The Women's Institute is to revert to being an Institute for Women

Eloethan the police force seems to be crammed full of men who been involved in the most awful treatment of women, including rape and murder as the mother of a dedicated police officer who has been violently attacked and injured by an offender can you supply evidence for your your vile allegations? I don't dispute that there are bad apples in the police force as there are in politicians, doctors, priests, CEOs, etc etc Being 'transgender', (whatever that means) or an immigrant does not absolve anyone from being a criminal and those that would dismiss offenders in either category as being unimportant do nobody any service. Do you have statistics for the percentages in each category that are guilty of offences?

Transwomen are men, they are part of the category you are discussing Eloethan. I don't think male police should be allowed in women's spaces if that is any help and if they start a movement to insist they should be I would object to that too.

Galaxy

Whether people discuss it or not, transwomen are male, if we never mentioned it again, they would remain male.

Yes. There are 2 sexes. Trans males are men who would prefer to be women. All this nonsense gets on my nerves.

I had a chat with fellow WI members a few days ago. Our feeling is one of annoyance with National. The statement from them was mealy mouthed and apologetic to trans members, promising to start Sisterhoods for them. The subs from 1st April will be £54 which has caused controversary in itself. Where is the funding coming from to start these Sisterhoods and why call it that because they are not sisters in the true sense of the word.

Yes, men who call themselves transwomen are maleand as such are part of the whole male group that carry out violent acts against females.

This is the smokescreen *eloethan”, that they are a different biological group.

We don’t know how many trans have committed acts of assault and rape because up till now those crimes have been recorded as committed by women.

What we do know is that women have been made to feel unsafe and have had to change what they do to meet the desires of men and that protest has met with persecution.

I find it really hard to understand why other women support the men in their attitudes and actions against women.

Trans people, like others have a right to be and pretend to be whatever they want. They have no right to demand that we collude in their pretence.

Yes, Scouts ( and Cubs) do have girl members, and at sleepovers, and jamborees, in my GC's group, the girls sleep in a separate tent.

Chocolatelovinggran

Yes, Scouts ( and Cubs) do have girl members, and at sleepovers, and jamborees, in my GC's group, the girls sleep in a separate tent.

No problem. They aren’t boy scouts.
The problem would only arise if a scout / parents decided they were going to lie about their sex.

Sarnia

I had a chat with fellow WI members a few days ago. Our feeling is one of annoyance with National. The statement from them was mealy mouthed and apologetic to trans members, promising to start Sisterhoods for them. The subs from 1st April will be £54 which has caused controversary in itself. Where is the funding coming from to start these Sisterhoods and why call it that because they are not sisters in the true sense of the word.

I, also, am a WI member and the Unofficial WI Facebook group is wholly behind the Trans 'sisters'.
There is much wailing and knashing of teeth at the 'unfairness of it all and how despicably Transwomen have been treated', because "they are women!"

Oh no they're not !

Probably because the apostrophe made it hard to spell.

SarniaI too am a member of the WI. I totally agree that the ‘mealy`’ mouthed apology from NFWI was totally pathetic. I have had a number of emails from people in my WI thanking me for speaking up about my concern of the WI accepting biological men in our Institute without a vote from members.

They keep insisting that transwomen are women when
they are patently not. They say they only received 20 letters of complaint but they avoid saying how many emails they got on the subject, at least 6 from me !

Interestingly, the subject hasn’t been brought up on Monday’s meeting, but the committee, of which I’m a member, has been complaint bitterly about the “injustice of excluding trans-women”. I keep my mouth shut until asked for an opinion. I truly feel very, very sorry for these trans people, but I am firmly of the opinion that someone with XY chromosomes is emphatically a man.
We don’t have enough refuges for battered women, there is more and more misogyny and rapes on the streets, press and media. There are plenty of mixed sex organisations, so why do the trans want to join the WI? And why are we women bending over backwards to accommodate such people?
(Get off my hobby horse!)

There are plenty of mixed sex organisations, so why do the trans want to join the WI? Because joining female only groups and using female only facilities 'validates' them. Otherwise why do transwomen like India Willoughby state they would never use a gender neutral toilet, only the women's one?

Lathyrus,- "Yes, men who call themselves transwomen are male and as such are part of the whole male group that carry out violent acts against females. This is the smokescreen *eloethan”, that they are a different biological group.

We don’t know how many trans have committed acts of assault and rape because up till now those crimes have been recorded as committed by women."

That is not the case- we do know. On arrest for committing any such act the perpetrator is then taken to police station into custody. To reassure you- the current police custody forms records all usual personal and alleged offence details and specifically includes sex at birth, country of birth, ethnicity and also preferred gender. All known medications have to be declared- e.g. gender reassignment medication.

Detained Persons (DP) in custody will also be "processed"- e.g. finger prints, photo, DNA, samples, maybe even strip searched if appropriate to arrestable offence. Injuries will be noted, photographed and the DP may also see a e.g. health professional- nurse, doctor for such a serious offence to make sure they are fit to be interviewed.

So if born and man and living a life as a woman that is known on arrival at into police custody and will also become evident when DNA tested. Will remain on record evidently at stage of conviction.

Comparative data exists how many arrests and how many convictions are perpetrated by males born living as a man and males born living as a woman and can be categorised from shop lifting offences to violent and serious crime offences.

Things may have changed since the High Court judgement lemonjam but in 2021 Faur Pkay for Women requested information from Police Forces and it was confirmed that a number of Police Forces registered crime in the sex of the perpetrators chosen gender. ie transwomen’s crimes were registered as female.

Even if it doesn’t happen that way now, for a period if time it did happen and so we can’t know the true extent of male violence against women in that period.

We don’t even know exactly what oeriod of time we are looking at as practice varied from force to force.

Can you link to where you found your information please LemonJam as when I googled I found this freedom of information request and answer which doesn't seem to match?

www.met.police.uk/foi-ai/metropolitan-police/disclosure-2023/april-2023/recorded-data-relation-transgender-matters/

I realise it's from 2023 but don't imagine anyone has been back through the records correcting sex entries where they have been wrongly recorded.

Crossposted Lathyrus .

I remember reports of convictions assigned by gender , though I don’t remember the source.
The fact is that if a male person committing a crime, is already claiming to be female, what happened to the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

Rosie51 There have been several reports relating to the sexist and racist views of a significant number of police officers. There are two high profile cases, one involving rape and murder and the other involving multiple rapes and coercive/violent behaviour.

In a recent documentary a police sergeant was filmed using the most disgusting, offensive terms about women and was joking about the most intimate details of his encounter with a woman when he was off duty. It was an appalling way to speak in front of junior officers - in fact appalling to think and speak in such a way full stop. He has recently been sacked but that is only because his words were secretly filmed - he'd been in the post for years, setting such a vile example to co-workers.

Of course, that isn't to say that every police officer is like that - but, given the numbers that have been suspended and are being investigated, I think it is reasonable to say that I expect more of people who are supposed to uphold the law and who have such power over people.

Given many of the comments on here, I can see why my Mum did not enjoy attending the WI. I say again, the people that women need to be most afraid of is heterosexual men, not transgender women.

Given many of the comments on here, I can see why my Mum did not enjoy attending the WI. I say again, the people that women need to be most afraid of is heterosexual men, not transgender women.

I agree that the information about the police is appalling.
Re the heterosexual men:
TW are men.
When they force their attentions on women, attack or intimidate women or cheat women out of jobs or awards, they are no better than the police you mentioned.

Tw are men many are heterosexual. Oh and those violent policemen you talk about re not welcome in women's spaces either.
Creating a 'special category' of men is a safeguarding failure.
Oh and women who were brave enough to talk about this stopped listening to people calling us names about a decade ago now and carried on highlighting the safeguarding of women and children.

I don’t understand what the post about police has to do with with the topic of trans in the WI?

It’s a non sequitur.

🤔🙄

It is look at those men over there, they aren't the same as these men over here. When of course they are exactly the same.
I mean goodness knows where trans policemen fit into this complex categorising of special men.

Lathyrus3

I don’t understand what the post about police has to do with with the topic of trans in the WI?

It’s a non sequitur.

🤔🙄

You’re right, but so many things on GN are non sequiturs. Depending on your POV it’s irritating or it adds to the discussion, debate etc.

Sometimes the wandering off is interesting and you can see why it’s gone off at a tangent.

I just couldn’t see any relevance in that though.