Entering the UK- or going to happen now

So, really, is it the tone of the OP which you objected to, DAR rather than the fact that thousands of Australians are facing difficulties about this?

I think that a lot of Australians are asking the same and are furious.

No Allira. The tone just makes it very difficult to answer as there is no obvious point of debate.

You suggest "thousands of Australians are facing difficulties about this" That's not a defined figure so I will assume it's just pulled out of the air. We have one person - who is not personally effected - telling us of two people who are concerned. We don't even know if they are; it could be just Nanna8's view.

My family (4) of British/Australians, are ready to come over at the drop of a hat at the moment, for family reasons - should it prove necessary. Are they worried about the changes - not particularly. But then they have always had passports, etc., organised.

So that's two people whose grandma is worried, and four who are directly affected, who are not. What does that tell us? Not a lot to be honest but then this thread wasn't really set up to debate, was it? Just for red-top newspaper style complaint.

You suggest "thousands of Australians are facing difficulties about this" That's not a defined figure so I will assume it's just pulled out of the air.

It is not pulled out of the air

There really is no point in discussing this with you further.

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Basgetti

So you’re not a British citizen? Why would you expect special treatment because you were once?

I expect if you felt that you were in danger in Australia and needed asylum, your case would be considered along with everyone else in the same situation. Wouldn’t recommend a small boat from Australia, though ….

Well don’t . You can’t not live here for 50 years and still expect to just come back without evidence . It’s not like you have gone travelling for 2 years .
I think it’s perfectly reasonable.

Oh dear.
Why don't posters rtt.

boo12

Basgetti

So you’re not a British citizen? Why would you expect special treatment because you were once?

I expect if you felt that you were in danger in Australia and needed asylum, your case would be considered along with everyone else in the same situation. Wouldn’t recommend a small boat from Australia, though ….

Well don’t . You can’t not live here for 50 years and still expect to just come back without evidence . It’s not like you have gone travelling for 2 years .
I think it’s perfectly reasonable.

So you're saying that an Australian citizen who has not come back to the UK for 50 years cannot come here on their Australian passport.

Why is an Australian passport (perhaps plus visa/ETA) not good enough?

Why is an Australian passport (plus visa/ETA) not acceptable for someone who has never set foot in the UK but happens to have a parent who was born in the UK and may have lived there for a year?

So you’re not a British citizen? Why would you expect special treatment because you were once?

What special treatment?

Please define.

Allira I have a fairly robust fence or a house wall you might want to bang your head against........I so admire your patience and attempts to get posters to actually read the thread and understand the problem as it exists, not the fantasy one they have created in their heads

The new rules for dual UK/other nationality citizens have been made clear by many on this thread, links provided and detail also available on the government website.

It's not the case that an Australian passport plus Electronic Travel Authorisation (ETA) to travel to the UK is "not good enough" for dual UK/Australian citizens. It's the case that an a UK citizen is able to travel to the UK on a UK passport or a certificate of entitlement. If a dual citizen no longer wish to hold UK citizenship they can renounce it. There are necessary costs involved for ETAs, passports, certificates of entitlement and formally renouncing citizenship of course, as is the case in other countries for those who choose to travel. This new approach from 25 February in UK brings us in line with other countries including US, Canada and Australia and later this year with the EU.

The situation nanna8 describes is exactly the same in reverse for dual UK/Australian citizens who have settled in the UK for some years but wish to travel to Australia, their original country of birth. That is if they choose to travel from UK back to Australia they will need a valid Australian passport to travel to and enter Australia. They would need to purchase an Australian passport if they have allowed it to lapse as nanna8 has etc. Or they can choose to renounce their Australian citizenship and travel on their UK passport plus the Australian ETA. They will need to pay the necessary costs or choose not to travel in exactly the same way nanna8 has chosen.

The cost of a 10 year UK passport for UK dual citizens living and applying in Australia costs £108 plus courier fees for adults and £70 for children. Processing time is usually 3-4 weeks. The cost of an adult 10 year Australian passport for those living and applying in UK, which includes a mandatory overseas fee is AUD$611 plus courier fees, 75s and over 7AUD$392- 402 and under16s AUD$298- processing time Australian website advises is 6 weeks. Thus Australia is charging Australian dual nationals more than UK is charging UK dual nationals.

I so admire your patience and attempts to get posters to actually read the thread and understand the problem as it exists, not the fantasy one they have created in their heads
😂 or 😥
Oh dear, so it goes on.

There is no way to explain this, is there, Rosie51. 🤯
Should I try the Janet and John method?

Granny B gives you a present when you are born. She thinks it's a precious gift but you didn't know you had it until you want to go to visit Granny.

Granny B now wants to charge you for that precious gift you neither asked for nor want. In fact, you have to keep on paying regularly for it.

To get rid of this precious gift you didn't ask for and don't want, you have to pay a lot of money.

What a strange Granny she is.

The situation nanna8 describes is exactly the same in reverse for dual UK/Australian citizens who have settled in the UK for some years but wish to travel to Australia, their original country of birth.

If someone wishes to travel to either country for work or long periods of course it makes sense to renew passports for both countries.

But visiting for a week? Going over to visit family for a short holiday?

No. A visa or ETA should suffice.

Allira 11.18

No one born in a country requires a ETA to enter their country of birth as they already have the legal right to travel to and enter their birth country, subject to them showing their birth country passport at the border as they enter. Just as people born and living in the uK show their UK passport at the border and they return from travel and reenter the UK. Rules absolutely the same for UK citizens and UK dual citizens therefore no grounds of discrimination. They are not eligible to apply for an ETA in their country of birth as they already have the right to travel to their country of birth. People born in countries that use ETA systems simply enter their country of brith using their country of birth passport. Many have already patiently explained this.

All people across the world need to show a passport at the border to enter and depart countries Many have patiently already explained this. Many have also patiently explained that a passport is required for short and long stays.

Allira 11.18 "Oh dear, so it goes on. There is no way to explain this, is there, Rosie51. 🤯 Should I try the Janet and John method?

Granny B gives you a present when you are born. She thinks it's a precious gift but you didn't know you had it until you want to go to visit Granny. Granny B now wants to charge you for that precious gift you neither asked for nor want. In fact, you have to keep on paying regularly for it. To get rid of this precious gift you didn't ask for and don't want, you have to pay a lot of money. What a strange Granny she is".

It appears all on this thread can read and write Allira so not necessary for you use any "Janet and John method". Many if not the majority on this thread appear to understand the UK recent implementation of ETA and border entry arrangements that changed late February in the UK- in line with other countries and will also come on board for EU countries later in 2026. Many if not most now understand what that means for dual UK citizens now living abroad.

You and some others, including original poster may not like the new arrangements, feel they are unfair and do not like the associated costs but they are what they are if someone chooses to travel across borders. You inferr that other posters who do not agree with your POV somehow need you to implement a Janet and John method" to understand your point of view is somewhat pejorative. It's more likely they do understand but simply do not agree with your POV.

Lastly to help you understand, inline with your post, Granny B does NOT charge for UK citizenship for those born in UK in circumstances such as nanna8. It is a 'right' and there was no charge to nann8 at birth or since. At some stage she chose to apply for dual nationality in Australia, now her home. The UK does not impose any charges on her to retain her UK citizenship either. It is merely the case that if and when she ever chooses to visit the UK she must show a UK passport at the UK border as do all UK citizens.

Children born of dual nationality parents can and do weigh up the pros and cons of having dual nationality and take the necessary steps, plus pay any necessary costs, what citizenship they would like their children to have. Adult children of those who did not take such steps at birth, when travelling abroad always necessarily need to abide by border entry arrangements of their chosen travel destination.

Said Granny.

Allira

Oh dear.
Why don't posters rtt.

Because so much of it is unsubstantiated personal opinion, perhaps? It does get a little tedious.

"So you're saying that an Australian citizen who has not come back to the UK for 50 years cannot come here on their Australian passport." No one said this Allira.

LemonJam

The new rules for dual UK/other nationality citizens have been made clear by many on this thread, links provided and detail also available on the government website.

It's not the case that an Australian passport plus Electronic Travel Authorisation (ETA) to travel to the UK is "not good enough" for dual UK/Australian citizens. It's the case that an a UK citizen is able to travel to the UK on a UK passport or a certificate of entitlement. If a dual citizen no longer wish to hold UK citizenship they can renounce it. There are necessary costs involved for ETAs, passports, certificates of entitlement and formally renouncing citizenship of course, as is the case in other countries for those who choose to travel. This new approach from 25 February in UK brings us in line with other countries including US, Canada and Australia and later this year with the EU.

The situation nanna8 describes is exactly the same in reverse for dual UK/Australian citizens who have settled in the UK for some years but wish to travel to Australia, their original country of birth. That is if they choose to travel from UK back to Australia they will need a valid Australian passport to travel to and enter Australia. They would need to purchase an Australian passport if they have allowed it to lapse as nanna8 has etc. Or they can choose to renounce their Australian citizenship and travel on their UK passport plus the Australian ETA. They will need to pay the necessary costs or choose not to travel in exactly the same way nanna8 has chosen.

The cost of a 10 year UK passport for UK dual citizens living and applying in Australia costs £108 plus courier fees for adults and £70 for children. Processing time is usually 3-4 weeks. The cost of an adult 10 year Australian passport for those living and applying in UK, which includes a mandatory overseas fee is AUD$611 plus courier fees, 75s and over 7AUD$392- 402 and under16s AUD$298- processing time Australian website advises is 6 weeks. Thus Australia is charging Australian dual nationals more than UK is charging UK dual nationals.

Clarity ... thank you. That should, of course, soothe the various troubled minds. Sadly, it won't.

LemonJam People born in countries that use ETA systems simply enter their country of brith using their country of birth passport. Many have already patiently explained this. except nanna's GDs born in Australia of an Australian father can't use their Australian passports and an ETA like any of their friends could to enter the UK, because the UK has deposited citizenship on them from afar. Uk is not their country of birth. That's what the complaint is.

It's no use, Rosie51

UK citizenship is a precious gift forced on many Australians born in Australia which they don't want, but costs them to renounce.

They should be grateful.

Their mother was born in the UK.

Under the British Nationality Act 1981, a child born outside the UK automatically becomes a British citizen by descent if:

One parent was a British citizen otherwise than by descent, and that parent was born in the UK. So if the mother was born in the UK, she is British “otherwise than by descent”. That means her daughters, though born in Australia, are automatically British citizens from birth.

The UK hasn’t “given” them citizenship recently. Legally, they have had it since birth. The complaint in the post is really about this: The girls were born in Australia.They identify as Australian. They travel on Australian passports. But because their mother was born in the UK, the UK automatically considers them British. That prevents them using the simple ETA route like their friends. So the frustration is not about visas; it’s about automatic citizenship being imposed, which then blocks the visitor route. That’s what the phrase: “the UK has deposited citizenship on them from afar” is trying (rather emotionally) to describe.

Is this unusual? No, this is standard practice internationally. Many countries (for example Ireland, Italy, Poland) automatically pass citizenship down by descent. The UK’s rules are actually more limited than some.

The key point is that he UK follows citizenship by parentage (jus sanguinis). Once you are a British citizen, you cannot choose to be treated as a foreign visitor unless you formally renounce citizenship.

The practical reality is that airlines and border systems increasingly match citizenship records. If someone is known to be British, an ETA application may be refused. So the issue is administrative inconvenience, not punishment.

Allira and I both understand the descent path. What neither of us thinks is fair is that there are large numbers of people, not just those born in Australia, that have this citizenship who weren't even aware of it until just recently. Why would you be aware if you have no interest in or desire for it? And that's what we've both said time and time again! The cost to them of visiting the UK is far more than their friends, who get to travel on their Australian citizen's passports and an ETA. How can it be fair for a country to require its 'own citizens' to pay more to visit than it charges foreign visitors? Obviously anyone who was going to make regular trips back and forth would likely find a British passport convenient, but for a one off trip? That other countries do the same doesn't make it right. Children born in another country to one foreign parent and one Uk parent shouldn't have to pay huge sums to either renounce their citizenship or to get a certificate that allows them to travel on their normal eg Australian passport.
If you find our objections to what we regard an unfair practice tedious you do not have to read those objections.

Personally, selfishly, I would like the whole thread done again, with the 100% correct facts on it. So I can use it for future reference. For myself and others.
But that is not going to happen.

DaisyAnneReturns

Their mother was born in the UK.

Under the British Nationality Act 1981, a child born outside the UK automatically becomes a British citizen by descent if:

One parent was a British citizen otherwise than by descent, and that parent was born in the UK. So if the mother was born in the UK, she is British “otherwise than by descent”. That means her daughters, though born in Australia, are automatically British citizens from birth.

The UK hasn’t “given” them citizenship recently. Legally, they have had it since birth. The complaint in the post is really about this: The girls were born in Australia.They identify as Australian. They travel on Australian passports. But because their mother was born in the UK, the UK automatically considers them British. That prevents them using the simple ETA route like their friends. So the frustration is not about visas; it’s about automatic citizenship being imposed, which then blocks the visitor route. That’s what the phrase: “the UK has deposited citizenship on them from afar” is trying (rather emotionally) to describe.

Is this unusual? No, this is standard practice internationally. Many countries (for example Ireland, Italy, Poland) automatically pass citizenship down by descent. The UK’s rules are actually more limited than some.

The key point is that he UK follows citizenship by parentage (jus sanguinis). Once you are a British citizen, you cannot choose to be treated as a foreign visitor unless you formally renounce citizenship.

The practical reality is that airlines and border systems increasingly match citizenship records. If someone is known to be British, an ETA application may be refused. So the issue is administrative inconvenience, not punishment.

I think this is probably right.

What doesnt work so neatly is the children of those children.
As I understand things.
But probably, this is not the thread to discuss that!

fancythat

Personally, selfishly, I would like the whole thread done again, with the 100% correct facts on it. So I can use it for future reference. For myself and others.
But that is not going to happen.

I don't think you are being unreasonable in your view of how it has played out.

This is an emotional argument wrapped up as a discussion. Such matters of opinion are best had on AIBU or chat. This purported to be about the law initially but it actually been a demand that we agree that "it's not fair". This way of thinking ignores the fact that:

• Citizenship by descent has existed for decades.
• The rules are public.
• Parental nationality is not a secret.
• Adults are capable of checking their own status and should be capable of doing this for young children or appointing someone in "loco parentis".

This set out as a muddled discussion - a small part news and politics, a small part attack on the UK, and a large part seeking validation for for being upset at not being prepared.

The law was explained, had the OP been reasonable in their setting out of their issue more sympathy may have been forth-coming. Not because what the government has done is outside the norm, but because the OP's family have did not seem to be aware of upcoming changes. We have probably all been frustrated by changes in law at some point but that does not make the law, the Government or the Country the villain.

Rosie51 14.41. "Allira and I both understand the descent path. What neither of us thinks is fair is that there are large numbers of people, not just those born in Australia, that have this citizenship who weren't even aware of it until just recently. Why would you be aware if you have no interest in or desire for it? And that's what we've both said time and time again! The cost to them of visiting the UK is far more than their friends, who get to travel on their Australian citizen's passports and an ETA. How can it be fair for a country to require its 'own citizens' to pay more to visit than it charges foreign visitors? Obviously anyone who was going to make regular trips back and forth would likely find a British passport convenient, but for a one off trip? That other countries do the same doesn't make it right. Children born in another country to one foreign parent and one Uk parent shouldn't have to pay huge sums to either renounce their citizenship or to get a certificate that allows them to travel on their normal eg Australian passport.
If you find our objections to what we regard an unfair practice tedious you do not have to read those objections.Oh dear, so it goes on".

Nanna8 has confirmed that her GC are now aware of all border arrangements and that they hold dual citizenship. You have indeed it time and time again Rosie51 you think it's unfair that the UK has now adopted the same border arrangements for dual citizens as already in place in other countries, e.g Australia, Canada US and later this year EU. No one in this post has the power to change the arrangements no matter how many times you say it's unfair. Border rules are border rules.

Dual citizen Australian/UK grandchildren who previously "had no interest' as you describe now do have an interest- so thats a positive move forward. They now realise if they chose to travel across borders they must necessarily make themselves aware of border/passport arrangements, comply and pay the necessary costs. Such is life.

They may have "no desire" for UK citizenship as you describe but it was an automatic right bestowed on them at birth, at no financial cost, because one of their parents was born in the UK.No one on this post can change that- no matter how many times you keep telling us you think thats unfair. There are pros and cons for dual citizenship- that is a fact of life -families and individuals can weigh up and consider their options- fact of life. Presumably Nanna8's GC have always been aware that their mother was born in the UK and now they have been advised this resulted in them having dual A/UK citizenship. Quite simply- this is a fact of life and as a result of their birth circumstances. There are options for them to relinquish their UK citizenship if they so choose.

It is not the case that the UK , or Australia in reverse, require its their 'own citizens' to 'pay more to visit than it charges foreign visitors'. Having said that I hope you understand that Nanna8s grandchildren are not "foreign visitors" to the UK - as she has told us they are in fact UK citizens. Therefore just like all other UK citizens they must have a valid passport to enter the UK when traveling across borders.

"Foreign visitors" are required to not only have a valid passport to travel across borders but must also pay additional ETA charge as they are not UK citizens- which Nanna8's grandchildren do not have to pay. have All dual citizens need passports for BOTH of their citizen countries if they choose to travel across both borders, even for short visits. You keep telling us you feel that is not fair but its fact of life for countries that operate the ETA system at its borders. Or they can relinquish one of their citizenships and just pay for one passport. Facts, choices, options.

Such children have been aware since birth that they had 2 parents with 2 differing birth countries. If they had no previous interest and have only become aware recently that this poses dual nationality issues when travelling- there's little anyone can do about that. Now they do have an interest, have found out the travel requirements and as adults they can exercise choice.

The cost of visiting the UK is exactly the same for Nanna8s grandchildren as it is in reverse for their Australian friends who have dual citizenship, ie an Australian and a UK parent. Indeed as UK passport costs are less than Australia they have a cost advantage. Nanna8's grandchildren also pay exactly the same passport costs of Gransnetter's UK citizen grandchildren, save for courier costs. They are not being discriminated against or treated any differently.

The top and bottom of unfairness appears relate to the understanding that dual citizens living in Australian, UK, Canada, US and later this year EU, are required to have 2 UK passports IF they wish to travel across borders of country of residence and other dual national country of birth, or parents' birth OR relinquish one citizenship so only one passport is required. It is what it is no matter how many times you tell us you personally think that is unfair.