People living in the Middle East

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

I’m a dog lover, and genuinely love my children’s dogs, but would have to sacrifice them to save the life of a human - even a stranger. It would hurt beyond measure, but ultimately there would be no contest. It’s just the right thing to do.

I know, and I like dogs and tolerate cats (even like some!) but couldn't put one before a human.
Well, some humans.

The Taliban kill cats and dogs so maybe that was the thinking behind it?At least the staff were taken out too, so that’s something.
It was awful seeing the terrified families scrabbling to get near a plane to take them away, that’s how very ghastly the thought of living with the Taliban is.

Oreo

Allira

Freya5

Seemingly a nasty judgemental lot on here. Still that's socialism for you. Did you spout the same when we had to bring over a load of Afghanis because they were caught in a war. No I guess you didn't.

I was a bit 😲 when a load of dogs were brought over from Afghanistan and people left behind.

Afghan hounds perchance?🧐

Operation Ark, Oreo

It was the charity started by ex Royal Marine Pen Farthing, the Nowzad charity, which evacuated cats and dogs in a private? charter plane, along with staff from the charity.

It just made me feel uncomfortable to know that dogs and cats were evacuated when desperate people were left behind.

Allira

Freya5

Seemingly a nasty judgemental lot on here. Still that's socialism for you. Did you spout the same when we had to bring over a load of Afghanis because they were caught in a war. No I guess you didn't.

I was a bit 😲 when a load of dogs were brought over from Afghanistan and people left behind.

Afghan hounds perchance?🧐

Allira

Tuliptree
Allira

seasider
I have friends working for the UK government in the ME . They pay normal UK tax . Not everyone is a tax dodging ex-pat .
I was going to post that not all are tax dodgers!
Some might be students on gap years too.

This point was covered posts ago. People working abroad for UK govt are not expats. They are Crown Servants as I already explained and are not the subject of this thread
Are you in charge of the thread?
People can post what they wish within guidelines.

I was merely observing that the issue of not paying UK taxes does not apply to Crown Servants and if had already been explained on this thread Thus it’s completely irrelevant to the main point of the thread which is about expats and paying for repatriation costs - which most people seem to agree with.

Tuliptree

Allira

seasider
I have friends working for the UK government in the ME . They pay normal UK tax . Not everyone is a tax dodging ex-pat .
I was going to post that not all are tax dodgers!
Some might be students on gap years too.

This point was covered posts ago. People working abroad for UK govt are not expats. They are Crown Servants as I already explained and are not the subject of this thread

Are you in charge of the thread?
People can post what they wish within guidelines.

Tuliptree

Allira

seasider
I have friends working for the UK government in the ME . They pay normal UK tax . Not everyone is a tax dodging ex-pat .
I was going to post that not all are tax dodgers!
Some might be students on gap years too.

This point was covered posts ago. People working abroad for UK govt are not expats. They are Crown Servants as I already explained and are not the subject of this thread

Whatever.

You are not in control of what is posted.

Excellent post SueDonim

Witzend

Dubai is a massive hub - I dare say plenty of people who are now stuck there were just transiting on their way to Australia, Singapore, and other stops east, or on their way back from such places.

We were on our way back from Australia last Saturday. Luckily we flew via Bangkok with Thai airlines.
Thank goodness we didn’t choose Emirates.
We were confined to our hotel room in Perth when Covid struck. We were flying with Cathay Pacific and Hong Kong refused to accept transit passengers so we were stuck. Thank heavens for Trailfinders, they got us on a flight via Oman. We had to pay for it. Fair enough, it wasn’t the tax payers fault and because we had help from the travel agent we didn’t have to put more than one flight on our credit card. No help from our embassy.
Once when we were over there my father died very unexpectedly so we had to fly home. Im beginning to wonder if we should visit our daughter again!
My thoughts are with those who were stranded on their way back to the U.K. hopefully hotel rooms have been found for them.

Allira

seasider
I have friends working for the UK government in the ME . They pay normal UK tax . Not everyone is a tax dodging ex-pat .
I was going to post that not all are tax dodgers!
Some might be students on gap years too.

This point was covered posts ago. People working abroad for UK govt are not expats. They are Crown Servants as I already explained and are not the subject of this thread

"We had to being over a load of Afghanis"

Blimey, you're on fire today.

Freya5

Seemingly a nasty judgemental lot on here. Still that's socialism for you. Did you spout the same when we had to bring over a load of Afghanis because they were caught in a war. No I guess you didn't.

I was a bit 😲 when a load of dogs were brought over from Afghanistan and people left behind.

Freya5

Seemingly a nasty judgemental lot on here. Still that's socialism for you. Did you spout the same when we had to bring over a load of Afghanis because they were caught in a war. No I guess you didn't.

Nasty, judgmental, spouting .

What is your name for people who use that sort of language about other posters? And what has any of that got to do with socialism?

Most people seem to agree that people wanting to come to the UK after leaving to live in low tax countries should pay for their own flights. Not be made to wait in danger zones until they pay, but invoiced later. How is that a socialist perspective, and how is it 'nasty' and 'judgemental'? I'm not sure how you 'spout' points of view, and how it differs from expressing an opinion on a discussion board - perhaps you can explain?

AuntieE

Surely the people you are talking about, irrespective of their nationality, have chosen to live in the Middle East in order to avoid taxation in the countries in which they are citizens?

Or have I misunderstood the issue?

If my original statement is correct, then my feeling is that they must themselves pay for getting out of what is now a war zone into safety. Why on earth should the tax payers in their countries have to indirectly pay for their transport? They are already defrauding the country in which they are citizens of the tax they owe.

They are already defrauding the country in which they are citizens of the tax they owe.

Why does anyone owe UK tax on a salary they have not earned in the UK?
How is this fraud?

Are you saying any UK citizen who works overseas or lives overseas for any reason and for whatever length of time is a tax dodger, a fraud?

Of course, wishing to leave a war zone and return to their home country of which they are a citizen, should incur a cost.

GrannyGravy13

Tuliptree

GrannyGravy13

Two families I know (one my Goddaughter) still have properties in the UK. They pay council taxes, road fund licence for car, tax on their rental income from their home rental.

If push comes to shove and they need repatriation of course all British citizens should be offered the chance of a safe passage.

Unless you know the financial details of every ex-pat, it seems rather heartless to put finances over lives.

No-ones putting finances over lives. Some of us just agree they should pay for their ticket. This is normal embassy practice and they already have a form for it. They will not pay the full cost to us of the FCO time needed to sort this out.

I have not said they shouldn’t pay.

If they need to be repatriated, then the Government should do so PDQ and sort payment out once they are safe on UK soil.

Agreed, Grannygravy.

seasider

I have friends working for the UK government in the ME . They pay normal UK tax . Not everyone is a tax dodging ex-pat .

I was going to post that not all are tax dodgers!
Some might be students on gap years too.

I don’t have any particular axe to grind with people who go abroad to work, we’ve done it ourselves. My dh followed the work - while the UK is busy shutting down the O&G sector, people have taken their skills abroad. Seems reasonable to me to take a well-paid job in the ME rather than live on benefits in the UK. These people aren’t costing the Uk anything, their health/any educational costs will be covered by their employers, or at least that’s how it works amongst the folk I know who live abroad, and I’m sure they expect to pay the costs of repatriation. Often the work is very interesting or it’s a new challenge or even a new field altogether. I know both my daughters value their experiences of living abroad (as opposed to holidaying) very highly. It changes your outlook on life.

As for the Afghans who were brought to Britain in 2021, how do we know their motives for working for the UK? They too may have seen it as job security with good money or to gain advantage to come to the UK, or perhaps it was a way in which to feed back information to their own forces/government? We can’t know what their reasons were.

Everyone has different motives for what they do, I don’t automatically malign people who choose differently from me.

Anyone stranded in Dubai should be brought home, but should have to repay the costs afterwards. They should have been aware of the risks of travelling to/via the Middle East. It’s easy to jump on a plane without considering the destination. Dubai is directly opposite Iran!

Nothing to do with tall poppies. I wouldn't wish to visit Dubai. I hope people get back safely.

Those poor, poor migrant workers were totally dispensible.I can't imagine being a maid there is great either.

Conversely, many reports focus on employers facing jail time for severely abusing or torturing domestic workers, with sentences ranging from one year to 15 years in prison, sometimes resulting in permanent disability or death for the worker.
Gulf News

SporeRB01

I often felt I have entered the twilight zone or alternate universe when I arrived at Gransnet. Such as this thread.

Surprise to see the level of resentment and anger and name calling (tax dodgers and fraudsters) levelled at fellow citizens – British expats working and living in Middle East at a time when their lives are in danger.

I heard of the tall poppy syndrome. As soon as someone becomes successful, some people become envious and resentful and will cut that person down to their level.

The people returning home now are holiday makers on transit who are stuck in Middle East . They cannot rely on their travel insurances since travel insurances do not cover acts of war.

So looking towards the FCO to help them repatriate back home to Old Blighty.

Oh dear me - let’s add tall poppy syndrome to champagne socialists, politics of envy and other intellectually vacuous nonsensical phrases. I don’t think anyone on here doesn’t want anyone to be helped to come home. Holiday makers and any ex pats. The former are in a different situation from the latter. Apparently well over half of expats haven’t registered as wanting help. Most are going to sit it out and hope it passes. However, taking vulnerability etc into account ( as the govt is) those who want to are being brought home as logistics allow. And yes I am critical but certainly not envious of ex pats in ME. Just as I was with any of my peers who went to South Aftica in the 60s and 70s. I would never choose to live in any country with appalling human rights records, that punished ( sometimes with death) people who loved the wrong person, You couldn’t pay me enough. Plus the appalling treatment of the migrant workers in many of these countries which allows the expats to have an apparently lovely life.

I read that there are many Afghan refugees now in danger in Iran, some of whom are Afghan people that had to flee when the Taliban took back control because they’d been working for us. It’s shameful the way we let those people down.

sixandahalf

How does it work in Dubai if you are gay?

And capital punishment - depends on country but basically illegal in most of ME.

Some tall poppies will stay and blow in the British wind … SporeRBO1 and thank goodness they do.