He has done it! The toolmakers son has resigned!

I will not be reading the responses, pointless

OldFrill. I didn’t say he was PM when he took the knee forGeorge Floyd! People lost respect for him when hedid that as Leader of the Opposition.

Why lose support for someone who agrees with 'Black lives matter'?

To Maremia, the fact that he was able to pacify Trump and keep us from participating in an illegal war is something to be really thankful for. I agree that we should always be grateful for that. Steve Bray showed a singular lack of kindness playing Ode to Joy all through Starmer’s goodbye speech. It was an important political moment and it was a pity that it was ruined by an anti Brexit demonstration, regardless of one’s views.

greyfur

Calendargirl

The late Queen had 15 Prime Ministers throughout her 70 year reign.

King Charles will soon see his 4th, in just under four years.

Average of 1 a year so far then.

He was not "hopeless" Whilst many were eager to jump into an illegal war, he refused.

Not sure why I have been quoted.

I never said he was hopeless.

The only reason Sir Kier was ousted is because the party members were reacting to the poor opinion polls re his popularity. They want Burnham because he is deemed to be a people's person and they want to ensure that Labour will win again in a couple of years time. Burnham will still have to follow the party's mandate. I was saddened watching him leave and it felt like a mistake. If we want the ever-changing turnover of PM's to stop then we have to move to a Presidential style, which guarantees they stay put for the duration of their terms. We are the laughing stock of the world and they can't believe what is happening here.

ViceVersa

I have my doubts. I have serious concerns about his stance on women's rights, for one thing. The way the whole thing has been handled leaves a bad taste in my mouth too.

100% this.

What are the reasons that Keir was forced to leave? How can somebody step into the Prime Minister role without the requirement for a General Election?

Yes Violetbynight, other Leaders were all for jumping at Trump's command.

Plevey08

The only reason Sir Kier was ousted is because the party members were reacting to the poor opinion polls re his popularity. They want Burnham because he is deemed to be a people's person and they want to ensure that Labour will win again in a couple of years time. Burnham will still have to follow the party's mandate. I was saddened watching him leave and it felt like a mistake. If we want the ever-changing turnover of PM's to stop then we have to move to a Presidential style, which guarantees they stay put for the duration of their terms. We are the laughing stock of the world and they can't believe what is happening here.

I believe we will not stop this until we have PR. The parties themselves tear each PM apart egged on by the media.

I wonder how Burnham will fare on the international stage? Starmer at least seem to be respected. Burnhams man of the people style might not work on the world stage unless he models himself on Zelenskyy or similar.

Desdemona

ViceVersa

I have my doubts. I have serious concerns about his stance on women's rights, for one thing. The way the whole thing has been handled leaves a bad taste in my mouth too.

100% this.

What are the reasons that Keir was forced to leave? How can somebody step into the Prime Minister role without the requirement for a General Election?

They can easily step into the PM's role without a GE. It's been done before a number of times. In the UK, we don't vote for a leader of the country.

Primrose53

*OldFrill*. I didn’t say he was PM when he took the knee forGeorge Floyd! People lost respect for him when hedid that as Leader of the Opposition.

Some people.

I really am struggling to understand why you find Andy Burnham embarrassing. He's presentable, intelligent, has proved he can get things done and has years of political experience. He is perfectly capable of making a serious speech, as he has done on a number of occasions.

I could understand that you don't agree with what he's done as a politician, but he's not embarrassing.

PS. That last post was to Allsorts.

ronib

But will the population want to hear Burnham’s messages? What is his mandate to impose his changes?

What was Starmer's mandate to take the LP to the right and try to win Reform voters? (which resulted in hundreds of party members leaving)

Maybe the heat is getting to me, but I have a slight crush on Andy Burnham.

That should lighten the mood a little on this increasingly rancorous thread!

nanna8

I think Starmer played a part. He was hopeless. Like Theresa May.

It would be interesting to see whether you could justify that criticism. He most certainly wasn't "hopeless". He actually achieved quite a lot in two years as PM and has been more successful in his career than I (and I bet you) have ever been.

I was no fam of Theresa May, nanna8 - but she had a better Brecit deal than Johnson and was more honourable.

She was maligned too.

MaizieD

ronib

But will the population want to hear Burnham’s messages? What is his mandate to impose his changes?

What was Starmer's mandate to take the LP to the right and try to win Reform voters? (which resulted in hundreds of party members leaving)

Interesting question. I wonder if anybody will attempt an answer.

*Brexit

MaizieD

ronib

But will the population want to hear Burnham’s messages? What is his mandate to impose his changes?

What was Starmer's mandate to take the LP to the right and try to win Reform voters? (which resulted in hundreds of party members leaving)

When was the last time the electorate voted for a left wing government? They were offered it under Corbyn he lost two elections (had Keir have lost an election I’m pretty sure he would have stood down as leader…).

MaizieD

ronib

But will the population want to hear Burnham’s messages? What is his mandate to impose his changes?

What was Starmer's mandate to take the LP to the right and try to win Reform voters? (which resulted in hundreds of party members leaving)

Labour would not have been elected as the government if they had pursued a more left agenda, it’s as simple as that. Winning voters is the only way to success, and voters are largely centre.

I’m not sure what ronib means by Burnham’s mandate of changes, his mandate is already there, it’s to deliver on the manifesto, there’s room for a change if people in top jobs, and in the style of the government, but not in the goals.

PS Ladyleftfieldlover, Burnham is not too shabby looking, that is true .

Tony Blair was the person who really took the labour party "to the right" in my opinion.

MayBee70

MaizieD

ronib

But will the population want to hear Burnham’s messages? What is his mandate to impose his changes?

What was Starmer's mandate to take the LP to the right and try to win Reform voters? (which resulted in hundreds of party members leaving)

When was the last time the electorate voted for a left wing government? They were offered it under Corbyn he lost two elections (had Keir have lost an election I’m pretty sure he would have stood down as leader…).

I certainly don't think they voted for a right wing government when they voted Labour in 2024.

And don't forget that Corbyn very nearly beat May in 2017. It was only her deal with the DUP that enabled her to form a government.

foxie48

I think the right wing media played quite a large part and no doubt AB will receive the same treatment. Iam64 The voters seem to prefer style over substance, Keir lacked charisma and is probably too bureaucratic to get things done quickly. However he's been painted as incompetent and IMO that is a very harsh criticism. I also think that Reeves as Chancellor was a poor decision but he's certainly not the worst PM we've ever had but the media has done him no favours. I'm still astounded that the likes of Nathan Gill and Farage's £5million have attracted so little mention in the press!

It’s not so much Starmer who doesn’t get things done quickly enough, and is too bureaucratic, I think it’s more our legislation and systems don’t really lend themselves to urgency.