Professor Jason Arday - plagiarism etc

Today 22.24 in case you can’t remember.

A plain statement with no chance of misunderstanding.

I quite directly from your post.

“He oversaw a great deal of fraud and knew it was happening”

Thise are your words. They are there for everyone to see.

Wyllow3 copied and pasted directly from your post of 22:44:28

I agree Latchman (not Katchman) isnt an ideal example (there were many others when I googled and btw none have been raised either as I have entered in the GN search engine) as he oversaw a great deal of fraud and knew it was happening although not directly taking part) you clearly say he knew the fraud was happening, which was not found by the investigation, so yes an untrue allegation!

Lathyrus3

what I actually said word for word was

"Its it a mere co-incidence that *no fuss was made on GN made at all about Professor David Latchman, (The Master of Birkbeck, University of London, and a top geneticist at University College London (UCL) in the 2018-2018 scandal. It was in all the papers of course but no one picked on it to specially feature. He was white.

I did not accuse him of what you suggest. No allegations there as to the manner of his going and why, whatsoever.

You posted an untrue allegation Wyllow.

Sorry Lathyrus3 I've cross posted and almost repeated you, I didn't refresh the page before posting.

Wyllow3
I agree Latchman (not Katchman) isnt an ideal example (there were many others when I googled and btw none have been raised either as I have entered in the GN search engine) as he oversaw a great deal of fraud and knew it was happening although not directly taking part)

If there were many others when you googled that amplifies the question what made you choose to use a Jewish professor who had not been accused of plagiarism for your comparison?

I'd be careful about allegations "he oversaw a great deal of fraud and knew it was happening" as this does not chime with the investigation's conclusion

UCL has considered allegations of potential research misconduct concerning UCL staff under our Procedure for Investigating and Resolving Allegations of Misconduct in Academic Research and related procedures.

UCL confirms that the conclusion of its investigation is that Professor Latchman has no case to answer in relation to research misconduct. Professor Latchman has accepted that there were procedural matters in his lab that required attention.

He was sloppy, but not complicit as you've asserted.

If we proceeded like that any given political or social thread where people make remarks other don't like would be full of demands to retract and make total muddle.

FGT not lecturing, needful points. Notice amongst them stuff like
Labelling valid complaints stops institutions from fixing real bias
Subtle word choices can quietly lock in stereotypes about race, gender, and class

My point is simply as stated above - case by case, look at the individual. Don't slap labels on. I have not disagreed anywhere with points made that he should not stay in place of the allegations are correct nor that merit needs to be strictly in selection processes.

“He oversaw a great deal of fraud *and knew it was happening*”

That was not the finding of the investigation Wyllow as you must know since you chose to put forward this case.

He was censured for poor procedures in his lab that allowed the fraudulent research to take place but the investigation exonerated him from any direct involvement or knowledge.

Given your knowledge of this case I wonder why you have chosen to post a false report of the fundings.

A retraction of your statement should be made promptly. And perhaps an explanation of why you chose to make it.

No shame or contrition in his resignation statement at all - bizarre.

There are several Black, Asian and other ethnic minority Professors at Cambridge, presumably all just getting on with their jobs in a professional manner.

Wyllow with respect, I don’t think we need a lecture on this. Word salad at best really.

I've just been researching in answer to FGT "why does it matter using "the race card" or theMH card.

I agree Latchman (not Katchman) isnt an ideal example (there were many others when I googled and btw none have been raised either as I have entered in the GN search engine) as he oversaw a great deal of fraud and knew it was happening although not directly taking part)

As regards using the race or MH card:

"Phrases like "using the race card" or a "mental health card" are objectionable because they dismiss real suffering as a manipulative trick. They treat serious social and psychological issues as game pieces used only to win an argument or dodge blame, rather than acknowledging genuine discrimination or illness"

"Dismissing Real Experiences

Invalidation: They claim a person's serious concern is fake or dishonest.

Silencing: They stop open talks on unfair treatment by shaming the victim.

Generalising: They assume a complex, painful reality is just a cheap excuse"

"Undermining Support Systems

Stigma: Calling a mental health struggle a "card" makes people hide their pain.

Distrust: Labeling valid complaints stops institutions from fixing real bias.

Affecting Social Behavior

Creating Stigma: Labeling people with dismissive phrases dehumanises them and reduces empathy.

Reinforcing Bias: Subtle word choices can quietly lock in stereotypes about race, gender, and class

Darn autocorrect.
* Ja when I type those letters suggests someone known to me and automatically inserts it, unless I correct it. Which obviously I didn’t.

Should have previewed!

I found who used the phrase ‘the race card’ pretty easily. Not far into the thread.

But that’s not really the point here.

It’s the description Professor James has used all by his own big self.

As you were Wyllow.

Latchman's case was rather different in that it was established that he did not actually fabricate the data himself or even knew this was being carried out by members of staff at his laboratory. However, he was reckless and sloppy, thus facilitating the misconduct of others resulting in the published research lacking integrity.

That is rather different from Arday although both examples could have serious impact on other people.

Wyllow3

You don't have to scrutinise thousands of threads to find out what David Latchman was accused of and whether GNs mentioned it and whether GN's were or were not around at the time.

Just enter a simple search in the GN search engine and no results whatsoever come up.

The remark Oreo picked up on I made that "I see racism in everything"

Actually followed Oreo saying I quote

"Or do they operate a tick box diversity programme there?

A clear reference to race diversity issues. As does any mention of ""it should be on merit only" as in no diversity policies in the selection process.

Perhaps because people here are interested in commenting on plagiarism they had nothing to say about David Katchman who has never been accused of plagiarism.

Why did you pick this Jewish Professor to bring forward in a discussion on plagiarism, Wyllow?

You must have had a reason that wasn’t connected to the topic under discussion since that topic has no connection to him.🤔

Crikey Willow bet you’ve got us all scrambling back to see what we wrote.
Or what someone else did.

But hang on a minute.
Cliches like ‘the race card’ one, exist for a reason.

Think about it.

Ah, just followed your lead there Sarnia and read up on he has resigned.

For the best I think.

They can reappoint someone in to the post and any needful investigations continue. Separate the achievements from whatever is found.

And I cant even recall atm who did use it upthread anyway just noted its use.

Well I think we all have that right, other wise there would be no discussion

My personal objection above was only to the use of that particular phrase " Using the race card" "Using the Mental health Card" and apart from using it when it is inaccurate and only hurts, has the problem of lumping groups of people together and not seeing them as a series of individuals.

Jumping before he is pushed. The University should still continue with their investigations as I doubt this is the last we hear of him.

I will talk about anything i like. This issue impacts on institutions and values that i care about in particular journalism and the police. I couldn't care less what motives people think I have.

You don't have to scrutinise thousands of threads to find out what David Latchman was accused of and whether GNs mentioned it and whether GN's were or were not around at the time.

Just enter a simple search in the GN search engine and no results whatsoever come up.

The remark Oreo picked up on I made that "I see racism in everything"

Actually followed Oreo saying I quote

"Or do they operate a tick box diversity programme there?

A clear reference to race diversity issues. As does any mention of ""it should be on merit only" as in no diversity policies in the selection process.

He’s still in denial - blaming the public scrutiny rather than the fact that he’s a fraud.