Jason Arday found dead today.

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Thank you Vintagewhine

Vintagewhine

The irony is that if Cambridge had robust recruitment and selection procedures neither Cofnas nor Arday would have been employed. One held discredited racist opinions and there was published evidence of this and if the allegations of plagiarism are upheld, Arday was insufficiently qualified and had put false claims on his CV. No one is turning Arday into a hero the issue is the way his transgressions have been publicised and the degree of personal scrutiny he received that affected him to the extent he no longer saw a future for himself. How desperately sad and unnecessary, how dreadful for his family and friends. Did Cofnas suffer the say degree of scrutiny when he was dismissed by Cambridge? No. And that is how it should it have been for Arday but Cofnas ensured it wasn't. That is why he is relevant to this thread.

Exactly.

Wyllow3

That was my impression at the time. I feel no need to justify it, I answered a question pages later.

You saw what you wanted to see. You were wrong, simple as that.
There isn’t anything more that I can add to the discussion as it’s all been said now many times but that doesn’t stop the thread expanding that’s up to the posters who who want to carry on.

Vintagewhine
What you have said here is totally the whole point behind this whole terrible situation. Thank you for putting it so succinctly .

The irony is that if Cambridge had robust recruitment and selection procedures neither Cofnas nor Arday would have been employed. One held discredited racist opinions and there was published evidence of this and if the allegations of plagiarism are upheld, Arday was insufficiently qualified and had put false claims on his CV. No one is turning Arday into a hero the issue is the way his transgressions have been publicised and the degree of personal scrutiny he received that affected him to the extent he no longer saw a future for himself. How desperately sad and unnecessary, how dreadful for his family and friends. Did Cofnas suffer the say degree of scrutiny when he was dismissed by Cambridge? No. And that is how it should it have been for Arday but Cofnas ensured it wasn't. That is why he is relevant to this thread.

To deny that 'colour' was not involved also 'beggars belief'.

If Ardney's alleged plagiarism was the actual issue, it would have been raised in the context of the alleged plagiarism of the other Academics I listed way upthread.

Exactly.

So there was far more to it than merely that.
All his other likely fabrications.

I know I am repeating myself[hate doing that, but this thread is going around and around, not to mention the other thread], but it was 4 universities whicj made thing come to a head. Arday had not had the links with him that he claimed.

To pretend or just see colour, as some posters are doing, almost beggars belief.

If Ardney's alleged plagiarism was the actual issue, it would have been raised in the context of the alleged plagiarism of the other Academics I listed way upthread.
Arday's family cited the racist pile on.

And would rather carry on as we were, as all the issues are still really alive and pertinent to our time and need calling out.

That was my impression at the time. I feel no need to justify it, I answered a question pages later.

Wyllow3

You asked, Lathyrus3 ?

It was these posts that gave me the impression of moves to shut conversation down in certain areas:

as follows:

Oreo
Well Lathyrus it gives them someone to blame and reinforces the ‘it’s all about race’ argument when in fact it would be just the same if JA had been white, everyone would have been bemused that all the outlandish claims had been swallowed whole.

I think this discussion is just going around in circles now tho as we all have our own views on it

And

Oreo
We’re not here to debate Cofnas, tho I do see that it suits some people to do so instead of addressing the elephant in the room…the unsuitability of Jason Arday for a Professorship at Cambridge.”

Neither of which says But btw, I popped in late last night and see that some are still saying "oh well there is no ned to say more its all been said no need for the thread.
That's your interpretation, not what either poster said. Best always to stick to the actual words people use.

You asked, Lathyrus3 ?

It was these posts that gave me the impression of moves to shut conversation down in certain areas:

as follows:

Oreo
Well Lathyrus it gives them someone to blame and reinforces the ‘it’s all about race’ argument when in fact it would be just the same if JA had been white, everyone would have been bemused that all the outlandish claims had been swallowed whole.

I think this discussion is just going around in circles now tho as we all have our own views on it

And

Oreo
We’re not here to debate Cofnas, tho I do see that it suits some people to do so instead of addressing the elephant in the room…the unsuitability of Jason Arday for a Professorship at Cambridge.”

Lathyrus3

Lathyrus3

Wyllow3

This is the way we can make a difference.

But btw, I popped in late last night and see that some are still saying "oh well there is no ned to say more its all been said no need for the thread.

I have thought all day, only GNHQ can decide that!

I still feel every bit of sorrow, anger, distress, political outrage that I did 2 days ago, and that if I wish to say so and carry on:

its not for anyone to shut us up.

As nobody can find a post that tried to shut down this thread shall we agree that the above post was a fabrication?

I guess the lack of response means I’m in the minority when I think that truth is important.

I’ll quit now because a thread about serious matters where fiction is posted to try to ‘win” is a bit pointless really..

And doesn't support their cause.

Lathyrus it was ever thus. I've had the same level of ignoring when I've challenged for the proof and links so often demanded of others. It's as if they never made their post or they've missed your request for a link???

As for Jason Arday, nobody should feel that taking their own life is the best or only solution and it's incredibly sad that this is what he decided, especially for his wife and sons who seem to be forgotten amongst all the angst. Actually has it been confirmed officially that it was suicide? Those blaming white men and women for his suicide should also consider that another contributory factor was the 'white saviour' people who never questioned his incredible claims but nodded and agreed because to question would make them 'racists'. For example does anybody really believe he underwent 3 hours of speech therapy 6 or 7 days a week for years funded by the local council? Not one person to whom he spoke of this said 'really, goodness I thought you'd be hard pressed to get one short session a week or month'. A lot of the press articles I saw progressed to focus on the fantasies rather than the plagiarism.

Diane Abbot and colleagues in Trafalgar Sq. seem to regard Ardey as some kind of hero.

Lathyrus3

Wyllow3

This is the way we can make a difference.

But btw, I popped in late last night and see that some are still saying "oh well there is no ned to say more its all been said no need for the thread.

I have thought all day, only GNHQ can decide that!

I still feel every bit of sorrow, anger, distress, political outrage that I did 2 days ago, and that if I wish to say so and carry on:

its not for anyone to shut us up.

As nobody can find a post that tried to shut down this thread shall we agree that the above post was a fabrication?

I guess the lack of response means I’m in the minority when I think that truth is important.

I’ll quit now because a thread about serious matters where fiction is posted to try to ‘win” is a bit pointless really..

And doesn't support their cause.

Thanks Galaxy.

Sorry Wyllow, I was asking Galaxy.
Yes I would use that term with reference to what's happening in the USA.
Off topic.
Apologies.

I wouldn't use someone's colour in the way it has just been used Maremia, I cant really imagine talking about white supremacy in any context really, it isnt how I talk.

Well I was being deliberately very blunt as you realise but we don't see things the same despite areas of agreement. Which is fine. Frankly I don't like males of any colour who believe they are superior to women or any other group per se: they aren't hard to spot.
But in this case I believe bluntness and directness to be appropriate as yes I consider him to be a White Male Supremacist.

Would you use the term White Supremist, in any context?
Just curious, and slightly off topic.

In case anyone doesn't realise that was sarcasm. I would never use the colour of skin in the way wyllow just did.

Yes I agree white males are awful- one leads the good law project of course.

I instinctively cannot warm to anyone who believes in one race's superiority to another.

I would not be able to talk to him and have no desire to.

To put it in common phraseology, he's too up his own you know what.

His methodology is fundamentally flawed and is little different from 1930's eugenics, in my opinion. I recall all too well an encyclopaedia from my childhood, and old one: it had a "family tree of mankind" and the branches of for example the aboriginal peoples came lower down as did some other cultures.

Human potential being realised depends on culture, upbringing, experience, and learning opportunities going back generations imo.

Brain development depends on matters like complex and substantially different very early years experiences.

Judgements on cultures and race also depends on what we value most.

Arrogant white male.

Did he get the post on merit? We don’t know but presumably that can be proven or disproven. If he got it on merit then it’s a witch-hunt. If he didn’t then that’s a contributory factor.