News on the domestic front

Foxie yes, as you say, none of us know which way AB would vote and TBH I don’t mind.

If his religion or other belief means he disagrees with assisted dying then I would expect him to have the courage of his convictions and vote against the bill. I would respect him (or any MP) for doing so.

Yes, it may be headline news, whichever way he votes - but that’s no reason to ‘opt out’. I’m afraid headline news comes with the job!

IMO this looks like he’s trying not to offend either ‘side’. He can’t keep doing this - being PM is not a popularity contest!

That is interesting foxie thanks

There seems to be an assumption that AB would vote against the Assisted Dying bill, no one seems to think his reason might be because he doesn't want to vote for it because it is against Roman Catholic teaching but his personal belief is that an individual has the right to choose when to end his/her life. We don't know which way AB would vote but if he did, it's absolutely certain that it would be headline news whichever way he voted. I had to look up which way my MP voted and why, I'm sure I'm not alone in that! Interestingly, AB's voting record on abortion and reproductive rights don't align with the standpoint taken by the Catholic church so he might vote either way!
"Andy Burnham has a long-standing parliamentary voting record of supporting fewer obstacles and broader access to abortion rights, aligning closely with reproductive rights positions" AI gen

Re the grab bag- it’s a sensible idea if you stop and think.
Look at recent events- wildfires, floods, extreme weather events. In the event of some sort of civil emergency, such a bag makes sense.
We live in central France, our area wasn’t affected thankfully but remember the news reports?
As my husband said- do you want to be standing in line for a bottle of water after an emergency? We put all our important documents (house deeds, passports, identity cards, bank details, insurance papers) together in a bag, plus another containing a change of clothes (underwear, socks, a jumper, tshirts) toothbrush, wet wipes ) and a final one which we left in a cupboard near the door- water, some ring pull tins of food, biscuits and a couple of plastic plates.

Overkill? Maybe. But better a few sniggers than being left with nothing should the worst happen.

It is a free vote for MPs of all parties and it's not unusual for MPs to choose to abstain if they have religious reasons for not supporting a bill which they know has the support of the those who do not share their religion.

So they don't think it right to vote according to their conscience if they oppose a bill, for whatever reason, religious or otherwise?
If he believes it to be wrong he should vote against it.
It is called integrity.

LizzieDrip

Why abstain?

If MPs don’t support the bill, and it’s a free vote, then vote with their conscience / beliefs - vote against the bill.

Why sit on the fence?

I agree, abstaining is fence sitting.
If his religion makes him feel that he must vote against assisted dying then I would respect his decision as I respect all decisions on this subject whichever way they go.
So its a political decision not to offend any voters.

Commonsense btw is in short supply online usually.

Whitewavemark2

Most Europeans understand the concept of a grab bag, and have taken it on board.

People are perfectly at liberty to ignore all advise, no one is forcing anyone.

Common sense though does occasionally help.

Oh come on!
We have no need for grab bags in the UK at present, we are not at war and if this is indeed government advice ( from where?) and not something dreamed up by an online joker then it’s someone in a gov dept thinking it will be a good idea so we don’t complain when taxes go up to pay more for defence.

Why abstain?

If MPs don’t support the bill, and it’s a free vote, then vote with their conscience / beliefs - vote against the bill.

Why sit on the fence?

I think AB is perfectly entitled to abstain on a bill that was not part of the Labour manifesto. It is a free vote for MPs of all parties and it's not unusual for MPs to choose to abstain if they have religious reasons for not supporting a bill which they know has the support of the those who do not share their religion.

I just cant believe we are going to go through this again with the assisted dying vote, I suppose it means I know that I wont ever vote Labour again ( yes I know private members bill) I had a tiny bit of hope when burnham started talking about importance of getting palliative care right before the assisted dying conversation.

Most Europeans understand the concept of a grab bag, and have taken it on board.

People are perfectly at liberty to ignore all advise, no one is forcing anyone.

Common sense though does occasionally help.

I meant to add it may be Luddite like to have such opinions and we cannot stop new developments, but I fear there will be many negative repercussions.

I think we should be concerned about what's coming down the line as to data centres and the massive resources they will consume, meaning possible shortages. There's an element of Pandora's Box in these initiatives and there are quite a lot of warnings as to the negative effects on society, Bill Gates for example warns us there are no plan for the upheaval AI will cause. The Green Party have called for a moratorium on these sites. I don't often agree with their stance on many issues but I do on this one.

I don’t see Burnham as weak. He’s thoughtful

Whitewavemark2

I might be wrong, but i suspect that Burnham - a practicing catholic, would vote against assisted dying.

I agree WW, so he should vote accordingly.

It will be a ‘free’ vote in which all MPs will be able to vote according to their conscience, not their political allegiance.

AB ‘opting out’ seems cowardly to me. His reason (excuse) is very weak. I don’t think his vote would influence other MPs on this issue - they’ve already thought deeply about this and will follow their conscience.

He clearly doesn’t want to make himself ‘unpopular’ with one group or the other. Not good leadership IMO.

My Ukrainian friend's husband has a grab bag of documents and cash.
He is living here with her now but she says he wakes in the night to check on it.
I'm sure it's just what you do of you think yourfamy couldbein danger.
I know they have had abuse over here from some as well as welcome from others.

I'm sure I would have a grab bag in extremis.

(And I didn't have one for childbirth as i had home-births)

Burnham will not vote in the assisted dying free vote, to avoid influencing other MP

Failed the first leadership test.

Abstention? Cowardice.

Man of our Jewish community have kept Go Bags at various times. Their history of pogroms and the holocaust means the idea they might have to run is deeply held.
I know some elderly survivors of the holocaust and the kinder transport had Go Bags when Corbyn was elected. I understand their fears

Whitewave, that’s my take on his decision. It’s an important issue and he’s entitled to separate his faith and politics. I expect faith would have him unable to support assisted dying but my impression is he’s a pragmatist and no doubt able to see alternative views are as relevant.

I might be wrong, but i suspect that Burnham - a practicing catholic, would vote against assisted dying.

Bounty Bars in mine 😁

Oreo

greyfur16

I don't understand this grab bag thing. Grab it and go where? To a local Sports Centre when we are invaded or what?

It’s just nonsense isn’t it?

I'm going to put some large bags of maltesers in mine.

NotSpaghetti

I think that's a limp excuse.

He could wait till nearly everyone has passed through the lobbies. He doesn't need to broadcast his opinion.

You’re right it really is a limp excuse and I can’t understand why he’s saying it, it’s obvs a ‘political’ decision rather than obeying his own natural instincts on the subject.

greyfur16

I don't understand this grab bag thing. Grab it and go where? To a local Sports Centre when we are invaded or what?

It’s just nonsense isn’t it?