History repeating itself

foxie48

Actually I don't think having "very little knowledge" was meant to be prejorative. Many voters don't have a great knowledge of economics or politics and just vote almost automatically for one of the parties. Many Reform voters used to be labour voters or conservative voters, they haven't suddenly become less intelligent however if they don't follow politics they will be influenced by social media and there is a lot of misinformation out there much of it being manipulated by bots or malign agents.

It wasn't. Most of us know a little about a lot of subjects, while some people have extensive knowledge of a particular specialist area. Neither of those things, by themselves, tells you how intelligent someone is.

fancythat

^Another reason why we must resist foreign interest UK party political donations.^

I dont think, though have not really thought about it before, I mind "some" foreign money?
I suppose it would hinge on how much?

Well how about "Christopher Harborne?" Britains largest single political donor. Based on Thailand where he is known under his Thai name Chakrit Sakunkrit.

Surely you've heard about his £5 million "personal gift" to nigel Farage; who did not declare it .

As of April 2026 his donations to Reform UK amount to more than £22 million in total, roughly two-thirds of all the party's donations since its foundation

"The govt doesn't listen/ care/ do anything about boat migrants" etc.

Most poeple who complain, want them completely stopped.
Does any government so far do that?
Hardly?!

So hardly misinformation.

And now frustration has built and built...

No government has stopped AS arrivals completely anywhere in the entire world! Neither does Reform UK state it will stop small boats coming in its manifesto.

If you care to read the current Reform UK 'manifesto' it states that they will intercept the small boats (though the Royal Navy and RNLI have said this is not their job as they act within maritime law to save lives at sea) then detain the small boat AS arrivals then after that seek to deport without saying how it would circumvent international law.

AI Overview Denmark enforces some of Europe's strictest immigration and asylum policies, achieving a 40-year low in asylum applications by heavily deterring unauthorized arrivals and deporting roughly 95% of failed claimants. [1] (https://www.facebook.com/skynews/videos/uk-looking-at-denmark-model-to-cut-illegal-migration/1453712959025405/), [2] (https://news.sky.com/story/uk-government-looking-at-danish-migration-model-heres-how-it-works-13470122), [3] (https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/migrants-stricter-danish-rules-uk-4040097?srsltid=AfmBOooZJy2cIEq5Ip8ztkfZwFY0MBgdVkjJXDNxCx8FewOKziLE0QPk)Key Border and Deterrence MeasuresStrict Border Controls: Denmark utilizes rigorous internal and external border checks and has threatened emergency border shutdowns or complete suspension of entry points during regional migrant surges. [1] (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5kjQIWLh88)Carrier Fines: Transport companies (airlines, trains, and ferries) face massive fines if they bring passengers into Denmark without valid travel and entry documents

I think that type of thing would appease most complainants.

ie, they are putting some hard yards into it all.

LemonJam

sundowngirl 19.36 - Angela Merkel did not recruit asylum seekers your earlier suggestion.

Many of us are indeed aware that AM welcomed refugees and migrants who arrived in Germany primarily fleeing war in Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan who arrived during the 2015-2026 European migrant crisis. Her government's humanitarian choice when it temporary suspended the standard EU rules at the time.

Humanitarian choice or pragmatic choice as Germany has such an ageing population and needed young workers.
Allowing so many unchecked into the country has had some unwanted consequences there of course.

Yes Fancythat Denmark has had enough of the crime the asylum seekers have caused there.

Meandrogrog

MayBee70

And did anyone listen to Bravermans plans for education including teaching children about how great the British Empire was and asking parents to report schools that don’t fly the union flag and other stuff like that.

I fail to see what is wrong with that.

There's nothing wrong with flying the flag.

Asking parents to report schools that don't is the kind of proscribing that belongs to dictatorships... along with getting neighbours to report on each other for alleged 'subversion'.

Oreo

LemonJam

sundowngirl 19.36 - Angela Merkel did not recruit asylum seekers your earlier suggestion.

Many of us are indeed aware that AM welcomed refugees and migrants who arrived in Germany primarily fleeing war in Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan who arrived during the 2015-2026 European migrant crisis. Her government's humanitarian choice when it temporary suspended the standard EU rules at the time.

Humanitarian choice or pragmatic choice as Germany has such an ageing population and needed young workers.
Allowing so many unchecked into the country has had some unwanted consequences there of course.

And by so doing, she pushed the normally centrist Christlich-Soziale Union in Bavaria into becoming far more right wing. There's always consequences, difficult to undo.

One of the main reasons we have had a problem with crime among immigrants is that, given so many of them are from very different cultures, until the last week or so no effort has been made to help them know and understand the very different culture in this country to that they are used to and what behaviour is and is not acceptable and why.

Now the government has brought out a leaflet, which is, I suppose, better than nothing. What should have happened when immigrants started flooding in they should have been kept in camps until they had completed an acclimatisation course to teach them, how society is conducted in this country.

For many years I worked for the international arm of British engineering companies and if we were sending someone abroad to live and work in a a foreign country we sent them and their wives/partners on an intensive acclimatisation course before they went , so that when they and their family arrived in some middle eastern or Asian country, they knew and understood the culture of the country they were going to and acted in a way that accorded with that culture.

M0nica

Meandrogrog

MayBee70

And did anyone listen to Bravermans plans for education including teaching children about how great the British Empire was and asking parents to report schools that don’t fly the union flag and other stuff like that.

I fail to see what is wrong with that.

I fail to see the point of it. Look where excessive patriotism has landed the USA, with voters who vote just as their party tells them to, even when it means voting a man into absolute power who acts like a dictator and is suffering from cognitive failure

I don't necessarily have a problem with teaching positive aspects of appreciating our country and building a shared identity. As long as it is historically balanced and historically accurate by including any positive aspects alongside the documented realities of colonial extraction, forced labour and its wealth drain.

If not honest or accurate it instead will be government interference by way of performative politics. Hardly motivated by a wish to make a substantive contribution to the educational standards of young people which is what I would prefer a government to focus on.

DaisyAnneReturns

David49

There is a move to the right in many countries including the UK, voters dont like the changes that have been made in recent years. Unless government responds to the worries voters have they will be voted out, thats the way democracy works.

Voters of very little knowledge will always be susceptible to people offering unicorns and pixie dust. How can these folks still hope these people have their interests at heart?

And that’s not patronising at all……..🤨

Perhaps instead of teaching our children about the British Empire, more teaching around current affairs, particularly how our political system actually works, would prove more useful.

But then, of course, there will the (sometimes warranted) criticism that teachers might allow their own political beliefs to “seep” into their lessons.

For me, when teaching children at Secondary schools, it’s no bad thing if a teacher does state their own political beliefs, explaining why they support right, left or centralist parties, and allow the class to learn to debate, ask questions and learn to think critically.

I’m not against history, it’s interesting and can give perspective, but it does have to show that there’s many sides to a “story”.

Cossy

Perhaps instead of teaching our children about the British Empire, more teaching around current affairs, particularly how our political system actually works, would prove more useful.

But then, of course, there will the (sometimes warranted) criticism that teachers might allow their own political beliefs to “seep” into their lessons.

For me, when teaching children at Secondary schools, it’s no bad thing if a teacher does state their own political beliefs, explaining why they support right, left or centralist parties, and allow the class to learn to debate, ask questions and learn to think critically.

I’m not against history, it’s interesting and can give perspective, but it does have to show that there’s many sides to a “story”.

And that it’s the winners that write history; which is why original source material is so important.

Cossy

Perhaps instead of teaching our children about the British Empire, more teaching around current affairs, particularly how our political system actually works, would prove more useful.

But then, of course, there will the (sometimes warranted) criticism that teachers might allow their own political beliefs to “seep” into their lessons.

For me, when teaching children at Secondary schools, it’s no bad thing if a teacher does state their own political beliefs, explaining why they support right, left or centralist parties, and allow the class to learn to debate, ask questions and learn to think critically.

I’m not against history, it’s interesting and can give perspective, but it does have to show that there’s many sides to a “story”.

I think that's a very interesting idea, Cossy, though somewhere along the line it must have already been considered, and rejected for whatever reason.

I enjoy History in the curriculum, but it is really just that, "stories" about a past age. The lessons are delivered without any great analysis or discussion of the subject. I'm sure at A level and beyond there is more dissecting of battles and wars, but I guess the younger children have enough to cope with living in the present without troubling themselves too much over who was right or wrong in the past!

I wouldnt want teachers to express thror political views to children, they are in a position of power over young people and it isnt appropriate.

History is an essential subject.

The success of AfD is very worrying.

fancythat

Now I need to look up what qualifies as "Uk-registered"

Presumably it means registered on a UK statutary register, e.g., a company registered at Companies House.

I think the underlying problem is the difficulty in tracing the true origin of money ostensibly donated by a permissible donor.

Always follow the money. If it isnt open and transparent. Suspect fraud, money laundering etc.

Whitewavemark2

Always follow the money. If it isnt open and transparent. Suspect fraud, money laundering etc.

Exactly, money has to be transparent, which is why QE is treated as borrowing.

Money is merely an exchange token, the money you possess is exchanged for your shopping needs, before money tokens it was barter, which still happens in places. A nations wealth depends on the value of its resources to an overseas buyer, consuming resources internally does not add to wealth.

Whitewavemark2

History is an essential subject.

I would agree with you, but we have to consider here that History as a subject, unlike even Geography, does not actually provide a direct path to a specific, high-demand profession. The career opportunities are far less.

As a pupil who disliked Maths and Sciences, I would have loved to have studied History every hour of the curriculum instead, but in today's fast-moving modern world, one hour stolen from a high-priority subject like computing or data analysis sets the pupil one hour or more behind the rest of the pack.

I was thinking of knowledge and how any country arrived where it us. Culture etc. Rather than future employment.

In that case, I think Philosophy would be more valuable as a subject. Not how did we get here, but how should we act now. More independent reasoning and analysis going forward.