The le''er 'T'

Fanny I am with you 100%. I absolutely cannot stand the snobbishness that goes with accents, makes me sick to the stumick ,as they say here and so unnecessary.

Wow! I tried to vocalise the words you mentioned and I found it almost impossible, even though I'm from Yorkshire and we tend to shorten the word 'the' to a 't'. Mind you, I always find non-Yorkshire people add our 't' at the begining of the next work eg, over t'road, where in my area it's usually on the end of the preceding word, eg over(t) road. Actually, now I've said it to myself a few times it probably is exactly what you say except I've never heard it in the middle of words like 'irritating'. Maybe I'm a bit more 'posh'.

Not always JaneJudge . Unless I tell them I was born and brought up in the Black Country, people think I have always lived in South London. I can’t even imitate a Black Country accent now!
The same applies to people I know brought up in Cornwall, Wales, Yorkshire, Manchester etc. , I would never have guessed until they told me.

I am always a bit at people who have moved away from their original area and think they no longer have the accent! you do I'm afraid, even if it is less broad

I think my spelling is up there with those who went to "little independent schools" on here.
Of course I don't spell how I speak, any more than the next person does.

It happens in the written word too, firstly children were not taught to spell properly, and this has fed through into the language as many spell words how they sound as they haven't been corrected or can see the point. I love the English language and although not an expert I hate it!

Reminds me of Tony Blair and his faux cockney accent (eeugh). Also people droppin their g's when talkin ... on tv news mostly....very annoyin !! I am a Souf Londoner but try hard to not to drop my h's and t's as I have lived in Sussex for 20 years.

FannyCornforth In my post I wasn't talking about regional accents, (I'm from the NE and I have an accent and am proud of it!) My problem is with 'lazy' speech in general.

What about the game show "The WO." Woe is me . it would have me climbing up the wall if I had to watch it.

It's easier for children learning to write and spell if words are pronounced with all of the sounds clearly enunciated.

Candelle my point exactly - it's lazy speech that annoys me, not regional accents.
mrsHorn me too! I shout at TV/radio so often that eventually I just have to switch off.

Yes, "Suki70*, they were correct - in their own circles (and I was remiss as I shouldn't have used the example of 'huntin', shootin', fishin'!).

In some more rural areas, not pronouncing the 't' is indeed the norm but where I am, it is viewed (heard?!) as lazy speech.

Almost drives me to distraction - I find myself correcting speakers on the radio and then turning off because I can't bear it. Children will find it harder to learn to spell correctly when they never hear the 't' pronounced in words. English spelling is hard enough already, The poor things must get even more bewildered. This is not a dialect thing - it seems just to have come from the younger generation trying to sound cool and has now invaded all ages and social classes.

Fanny Cornforth People’s accents can and do change quite easily. Both my DH and I were born and brought up in the Black Country and our parents had quite strong accents. We came to University in London , stayed here afterwards and within a very few years our accents had disappeared without any conscious effort on our part. The same thing happened with my three nieces who moved away after University, although they have retained the short ‘a’ and with our school friends who didn’t stay in the area.

Candelle At College my two Hall of Residence room mates (one from Norfolk, the other from Cornwall) told me I shouldn’t pronounce the ‘ing’ at the end of words , which is a characteristic of the Black Country accent!

Summation (mine!):
Regional accents: good.
Lazy sloppy speech: bad.

My children and grandchildren speak fairly well after being told "that's an I.N.G. word" until the idea sunk in. As in huntin, shootin, fishin etc.

They later gleefully enjoyed picking up television presenters/actors who dropped their word endings too, telling the television screen "that's an I.N.G. word, silly!"

I was brought up in the 1940's. I was taught that it was very rude to criticise anybody's appearance, speech, table manners, or indeed anything about them.
I believe that there was one Royal personage who was sitting next to a guest from a different culture, who was eating with his fingers. The RP laid down their cutlery and followed suit. Pure class.

elleks

Chestnut

I joke about dropping t's to my grandchildren and we say 'butter is better than bitter for bellies'. They do speak very well at the moment (primary school) but this may change as they get older. In fact one of them told me off for dropping a t once which made me laugh.

We learned this at school; allnurseryrhymes.com/betty-botter/

Ha ha! That must be where it comes from, a long forgotten memory. Thanks for that, now I can teach them the full text. I'm very good at tongue twisters myself, I rarely get them wrong if I concentrate. I like to show off to the grandchildren!

ExDancer

Off topic a bit but have you noticed even the PM says 'ta' or 'ter' instead of 'to'?
"we're bringing in tax increases 'ta' fix this" for example.
So does Prince Charles - what's going on? Is it levelling down?

I was just about to say how BJ never pronounces “to” properly - he just says “t”.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz9_YfIQaz4

The people from the black country and brummies very rarely use the T in words,my Dh and his family say bockle of pop ,piece of bread and bu a etc.
I am a brummie have always put the T in words,they find it amusing,enough said.

There was (maybe still is) a presenter on local radio who drives my friend so insane when she says 'This is Radio No'inn'an' (Nottingham) that she has to switch off.

Then there's the 'h' sound, 'I work in haitch R - Human Resources (formally Personnel) which is annoying.

Do many of us speak the Queen's English?

Chestnut

I joke about dropping t's to my grandchildren and we say 'butter is better than bitter for bellies'. They do speak very well at the moment (primary school) but this may change as they get older. In fact one of them told me off for dropping a t once which made me laugh.

We learned this at school; allnurseryrhymes.com/betty-botter/

Grandma70s

It was a characteristic of London English, but has now spread to other areas. Sometimes known as ‘glottalisation’. Very irritating!

A bit harsh Grandma70s: It's more of a Cockney thing than London, I too come from East london like Peaseblossom and their was no dropping of Ts amongst my peers.

Don’t know if it is just my ears but listing to audio books lately I seem to hear ‘expantation’ - no idea wher the ‘l’ has gone!

It's one of my biggest 'hates'!