will we have to choose - this is just awful :(

So sorry, I know. Being retired, we at least have more options. That is tough.

It is. I'm off to an autumn camp with the students next week. Looks like it'll be pretty swish. They're lovely kids but of course I'm lavishing care on other people's children while I can't see my own GS.

biba70, I've not seen my grandchildren since February either. Still, I've no plans to travel any time soon.

I don't want my family to worry about possible risks (however small). They'd be devastated if I got ill or died as a consequence of going to see them. We'll all just stick to Zoom for now, at least until next summer.

I also have an elderly small dog. She's always right by my side (and in my bed). On the rare occasions where I've left her, at home, (for a few days) with a friend staying over, she's been upset.

She'll sit by the door all day, refuse to eat much or go for a walk. At night she'll reluctantly climb into bed with my long suffering friend - then whine quietly all night!

Therefore, I can't holiday without her as I think she'd just starve herself!

We all have different issues to face. We should all just stay where we are. No travelling. No socialising. No “poor me”. I can’t bare all the whining and whinging.

Yes, Oldbat, We're all in the same boat. We haven't seen our youngest grandchildren for a year now. The older ones have been able to come for 'bubble visits' in the garden because they drive but now that winter is around the corner they will cease.

We'll be spending Christmas on our own not just because of the rule of six but because DH will be at risk if we stay in a house where people are coming and going all the time.

That's Life!

I use to board dogs in my own home. Most dogs loved being with me but twice I went and pet sat in others homes and I would never do it again, the dogs howled all through the night....they missed their owners . Some dogs don't mind being with strangers but a lot don't !
I would stay home and zoom , I know it's very sad being apart from our families but remember this won't go on forever

I have a son in the UK whom I saw last Christmas. I live in Canada. We feel we have no alternative but to postpone our usual Christmas holiday together because we don't consider train+ long haul flight to be safe. My son would need to self-isolate in an hotel for 14 days before staying with me.which would be a bore. So we'll stay in our respective homes until it's safe and make do with Zoom and WhatsApp. It's just an exercise in patience! I guess you will feel better when you've made a decision.
Do let us know what you decide.

We probably won't go - just too complicated. Thanks to Gagajo though, I can see that there is a way to do this if it becomes unbearable or in an emergency.

I feel for you as Canada is such a long way away- so much more complicated. We would have never ever even considered moving further than a quick (well, 1 day) car drive- knowing that there were no real borders or restrictions, apart from pet passport.

Lovely day today, crisp but so bright- we go out walking all day, foraging - and will probably feel much better afterwards.

Massive walk this lovely morning to clear the head and heart- and it did me a power of good- and I found 2 huge baskets full of filed mushrooms. Went out again to the woods this pm, with OH and Emma (dog) - watching her run around with so much joy - felt good. Che sera, sera.

Haven't read thread totally but get the gist that you live in France?? After 31st December 2020 the blue pet passport will not be valid for return to the EU. It will work temporarily for return to the UK but the hoops to jump through to take a dog, cat or ferret into the EU are a night mare and can take up to three months. Just saying.

Trying not to even think about this Sunny - but yes, for many families who have been coming and going with pets- this will be an absolute nightmare. It will for us, for sure.

In the meantime, 2 young friends here have each a very sick parent in UK and just cannot come to visit. One in end of life care, and young friend does not know if she will ever see her mum again. So, yes, perspective.

Some days everything just feels too bleak and wearisome and dark.

I'm glad you're feeling if not better, then more settled, Biba.

Can I ask if all our different opinions helped you to decide?

Yes, thanks. I think I knew the answer - but it helped focus.

However, we are keeping the idea of renting some place to isolate at some point in the Spring- depending how things pan out. It does seem ridiculous with all the expense tied up in keeping a flat in UK- to go and rent elsewhere- but- needs must. See how it goes. Thanks

I won't go anywhere at the moment, isolation is not something I want to go through unless absolutely necessary. I am staying put until this situation settles, and it will one day.

We last saw our son and grandson who live in Scotland last October.

I have a friend who lost her husband to cancer in July. He had been ill for four years and took a turn for the worse in May. Too weak to get to his doctor and my friend spent 4 weeks making daily phone calls to get a doctor to visit. When they did, he was immediately taken to hospital, the cancer had spread through most organs and it was too late for further treatment and only palliative care could be given. No visitors allowed, my friend was allowed an hour on his last day and their three adult children were not allowed to go at all.

I am also sick of people whinging that it isn't fair. That family would love to only be wondering how to spend Christmas/Easter or any other time together.

Lioness68 always always someone in a much worse situation. I too get fed up with whingers.

Thank you.

Well I am truly stunned, and furious. Having accepted that of course we won't go and visit family - I have found out today that I could use public transport in red zone country, to the airport, get on busy plane then take public transport in the UK to go and self isolate ...

but that I can do so at a friend/s's house of with family - who will continue to go about their normal life, going to work or school, etc. Talk about utter, irresponsible nonsense. Fuming.

or not of

Have you heard, Biba? Suisse is thinking about doing away with quarantine OR reducing it to 7 days?

No- but for you and me, it is t'other way round which is the problem. How can the description given in previous post make any sense, any sense at all? If I go to UK and have to self-isolate - how can I do so at a friend's house, or with members of my UK family- whilst they continue to go about their non isolated life. Utter nonsense (another word starting with 'b' comes to mind.

As No Deal seems to become a real possibility today- and back to our dog- yes, we may have to choose as the whole EU pet passport is now up in the air. My worries are becoming very real, and not because of Covid.

My daughter will isolate before I go home. So it will be me putting them at risk, rather than the other way around.

Even a week's quarantine in Suisse would be ok. I could have a week at home then AND they could come here, too.

But how does it make sense for rules to allow people travelling from red zones, red zones countries- to self isolate with their friends or family? Friends and family who will continue to go about their normal lives, not isolating? I mean, I am really glad for you- but it does not logically or medically, make any sense.

If they come to Switzerland, they will have to then isolate for 14 days on return to UK.