New Law To Tackle Emotionally Bullying Partners

We live in hope heavenknows - small steps forward but its a long road. Attitudes have changed and are still changing.

True. Sadly, I think that laws regarding child maintenance and domestic violence are lagging because they negatively affect men and positively affect women. They fly in the face of men who dismiss it as "women stirring up trouble for men." I know so many that dismiss both out of hand, as well as go on about single mothers "popping out kids so they can get benefits" without stopping to think about the men that fathered those children and their lack of support.

I don't think things will improve dramatically until men step up and condemn those that are guilty of these things, instead of making derogatory comments about women that are the victims. It's still too much of a "men v women" divide IMO.

Emotional abuse will be difficult to prove, but sometimes the law has to lead so that attitudes can follow. This has been the case with attitudeses to domestic abuse in general - it used to be thought that domestic violence was a private affair that happened in the privacy of people's own homes and couldn't (or shouldn't) be policed. As prosecutions began to happen attitudes also changed and it would be difficult now to say what changed first. The same arguments have been used about emotional abuse of children and it is only fairly recently that we have begun to see this treated as seriously as it deserves, with children being subject to child protection plans and even removed from parents on these grounds alone.

On a different level, we have had the same arguments about driving offences such as using mobile phones etc. with some people arguing those laws were a waste of time, but I think that gradually attitudes are changing there as well. If something is wrong it's wrong, and there can be no harm in having a legal framework that reflects that.

It seems to be a law without teeth though, as proving it must be a nightmare. My ex was emotionally abusive to myself and my dcs, but always in our house or in the car, rarely did he slip and do it in front of others. Once his mother started having memory problems, I noted he was less careful in front of her, which I assume was because he then felt he could pass off any comments she made as a faulty memory.

Even his own family, who have witnessed a few slip ups on his part, and who have remarked on his dreadful temper, deny that he could ever be abusive. If I can't make his family believe, when they witnessed a small part of it, how could I ever convince the police? It's his word against mine, and he has a very finely tuned "public persona" that he puts on in front of others.

Having worked for the police, I've seen the attitude from quite a few PCs that they very clearly attribute any domestic situation as "not a real crime" and the eye rolls when talking about the woman and her saying she is being harassed and threatened is truly disheartening. I said something each and every time, and got a bit of a reputation for crusading the domestic situations a bit, but I've been there and it's terrifying to be stalked and harassed and threatened. Until domestics are regarded as serious across the board and the police are required to deal with it better, I don't see it improving much.

'Wide' is rather apt for our d.i.l. too Anya and you've summed up our situation perfectly. Our ES has "has proved himself to be a willing participant and is now as bad, if not worse than (d.i.l.)".

Sadly "thoroughly nasty people, the pair of them" also applies.

We can only hope that this law, which is certainly a step in right direction, can help those caught up in emotionally abusive relationships be they men or women.

Such sad stories on here DotMH1901 Lupatria Brupen Piggypoo and others. I hope this law will begin to help more people understand and maybe more women seek help and a route to escape.
TricaF they were not the good old days, "before feminism", were they.

His wife - not wide (though it's quite apt too)

Sounds a bit like my BiL and my SiL Smileless who have now alientated the entire family. Trouble is, although it stemmed from his wide originally, BiL has proved himself a willing participant and is now as bad, or if not worse, than she.

Wouldn't give either of them the time of day, thoroughly nasty people the pair of them.

Yes Boheminan you are a survivor. Our ES is a victim and his wife's controlling and manipulative behaviour has destroyed his relationship with his family and friends that he'd had for many years.

Only found out yesterday that our DS who we are with in Oz at the moment hasn't skyped him for almost a year. Skype sessions are arranged and then cancelled. When DS was home for a couple of weeks in the summer, they'd arranged to spend an afternoon together, just the 2 of them with ES's son and guess who turned up uninvited!!!

I can only hope and pray that one day he'll have the courage and the fore sight to see her for what she is. I fear it is all ready too late for our relationship because of the damage that's been done by both of them, but it would be of some comfort to know that he's freed himself and could perhaps find someone deserving of his love to share the rest of his life with.

I do hope that this law proves to be helpful. My ex, was so clever with his mind games and manipulative behaviour, I didn't realise he was controlling me, until one day, I realised that I couldn't even decide what to have on my sandwich without asking his permission, he dictated what I wore, who I spoke to and even stopped me wearing my prescription glasses, as they made me look "ugly". I managed to escape from his influence, but he still tormented me for over 10 years after I broke away from him. I would have found it very difficult, thinking about it, to prove this sort of behaviour to have gotten him prosecuted.

I should imagine it's extremely difficult to teach young people how to defend themselves against emotional bullying. It can be very subtle.

Unlike social media bullying, where the evidence is out there for anyone to see, domestic violence of any kind is usually carried out in secret, behind closed doors.

I don't think this new law will help all that much. I guess that there will be very few prosecutions of the type people are hoping for. I read one link that gave use of emails and bank records as evidence, also witholding passports. Leading to a fear of physical violence. It will take ages to prepare evidence - look at the time it's taking for celebrity child abuse cases to reach court.
Better that young people should learn how to defend themselves against this kind of behaviour, and physical violence, rather than leaving it to the law to cope.

Believe it or not I was emotionally abused by my Mother. She was 45 when I was born and when I got to my teens she then treated me as a sort of servant. I looked after the 6bedroomed house while she was at her Hotel. Also had to look after my younger brother. I was absolutely terrified of her. She put a padlock on the pantry door and left me a tin of beans to feed my brother and myself,also a list of which room was to be cleaned that day and how. When she was around she called me all the names under the sun and told me I was useless and would never amount to anything and a lot more stuff I have managed to bury. I went to a Grammar School some miles away which involved a long walk to the Railway Station followed by quite a long walk to School. I never made any friends at school as reciprocal visits would have been useless. My uniform was only available at a specialist shop so in the case of my summer dresses I had to make them in my needlework classes thereby killing 2birds with 1stone. The only girl in school with home made dresses. I also had to knit my own cardigans for school. Also the only hand knitted cardigans. I found out many years later that my 2 brothers were also terrified of her and suffered greatly at her hands. My brothers have managed to make something of their lives but I'm afraid my life has been a bit of a roller coaster of problems.
I could go on but I try not to think about it all too much.

I don't think it is always and only men who can be emotionally controlling etc.

The Archers storyline mentioned above is chilling. I have a friend who worked in mental health who cannot bear to listen to it as it brings back so many memories of cases she dealt with. I hope they deal with it properly & this character gets his just desserts. Sometimes it is easier to take stock of a fictional story than face what is happening to you or a family member-it may do someone some good if they get it right.

Not before time although might be difficult to prove in a court of law I put up with this for 27 years along with physical abuse the long term effects of mental abuse stays with you forever and the worst thing is at the time I thought it was love and done with good intentions and so did my ex husband

my daughter, who has two daughters of her own, has been in this sort of relationship.
she was kept short of money - sometimes having to beg him for some to buy food for the girls. he would go to the "hole in the wall" on his way to work and withdraw money so there was none left for my daughter to go shopping.
thankfully she's out of that relationship now [very long, sad story] and both she and the girls are now living with me ............... she has a part-time job and applied for tax credits so she now has money to feed and clothe the girls [we share the food buying though] however my son in law hasn't paid out a penny to help with any of this - he spends all his money on himself [and maybe the odd bill now and again when the electricity or gas goes off].
all three of them were traumatised by all this - it had, apparently, been going on for years but I never saw it. but now the girls are normal, naughty, cheeky girls and my daughter, while still on pills from the doctor, is now a more confident, outgoing person again.
I know this new law will help people like her - and we've found out that it is actually "marital abuse" and grounds for divorce.
sorry - this was supposed to be only a short post!!

I suppose, reading your post Kitty that, unlike physical abuse which it is well nigh impossible to 'deal with', there is sometimes the chance to stand up to verbal abuse - not that anyone should have to.

In the seventies and eighties, If you had no where to go and no money it was damned difficult to leave especially with two children. Been there, done that, still with him. The years have mellowed him, but he still has his moments. And I know how to deal with it.

Dot - as you say it's so difficult to prove emotional abuse. Unless there are hidden cameras and mikes (impossible) or reliable witnesses. Unless they have changed the laws of evidence in this new law. Whereas with physical abuse there's visible evidence.
My earlier comments in this thread - I must belong to an older generation than most of you, before feminism, when there was no-one to turn to if you had this kind of problem. It was difficult to leave, and we had to do our best to deal with it ourselves and protect the children.

My daughter was (is) married to one of these people. He gradually stopped her seeing her own friends and then our family (only his friends and family were suitable) and tried to stop my daughter having much contact with me unless it suited him (babysitting services!). Like many other comments made about people like him, outsiders and those who he wanted to impress thought he was charming, it was only if you knew the inside story that you knew any different. When I saw him kick my grandson and told my daughter about it he denied it outright and I was told I was lying and interfering. It wasn't until we were away at a wedding and I saw him yet again hurt my grandson in temper that I told my daughter if she didn't stop him I would go to social services and report him. He is now on the register with social services but again he has denied everything, even though my daughter was in the room with me when he hurt my grandson.
He decided to move out shortly afterwards - straight into another woman's life - and, when she wanted him to commit he came crying and sobbing back to my daughter who took him back. 12 months later he left again, and within weeks was in another relationship and his new partner is now pregnant (my grandkiddies are staying with him this week and he let my littlest granddaughter who is 6 break the news of the pregnancy to my daughter over the phone last night). My daughter is so upset by his behaviour towards her and my grandson is devastated as he does love his Dad and he feels it is his fault his Dad has gone. When I told my sister in law the truth about him she was deeply shocked as she too thought he was charming - they are very clever and plausible! How to prove someone is being abused in this way is so difficult, my daughter was so controlled she believed everything he said to her. My daughter's ex m-i-l believes everything is my daughter's fault and refuses to let her in the house, she has to wait outside to collect the kiddies when they visit, she too is blind to what has actually happened - when I told her that he had kicked my grandson in temper more than once she denied it and then said he was only being disciplined! His new partner already has three children of her own and I just hope she is able to stop him continuing with his behaviour but I very much doubt it.

I hadn't read this discussion when I commented negatively on the Archers thread about Sarah Vine's column in the DM's today. Anyone who has either worked with women who've experienced emotional abuse, or themselves been subjected to it, can't fail to realise how damaging it is. I dont believe the absence of physical evidence will make it impossible to prosecute.

TriciaF I am not a victim, I am a survivor.

In my case if I'd have fought back I would not be here today. He wasn't drunk.

I believe that physical and mental abuse are often used together as well as separately. The slow drip, drip, drip of the mental abuse tap erodes away self confidence until the 'victim' is in such a bad place, they believe what they're being told and feel worthless and helpless because of it - it's all 'their fault' that they're being punished/beaten, which makes them easy prey for their perpetrator.

I have had both, and gave it him back. He was drunk though.