Racism

Antonia, are you actually saying that someone didn't want to sit next to you on a bus because you aren't white, and so they got up and sat next to someone who was. How utterly appalling if so.
We all know that this happened years ago but I honestly thought people had now moved forward

I'm sorry too Antonia - it's just not acceptable.

Anniebach is quite right Jane. At my age I can surely tell the difference. And I do not expect racism in every unpleasant experience. I have been served lots of times in shops where the assistant was quite obviously stressed, too busy or chatting to a friend, to be bothered with a smile and a greeting. That is not racism but quite simply a slightly less than pleasant shopping experience. Racism is when the shop assistant looks at you with undisguised contempt, as well as the treating you with a lack of basic good manners. Racism is when someone sitting next to you on a bus gets up and goes to sit, not in an empty seat, but next to a white person! This has happened to me more than once and is just one tiny part of the casual racism that I have encountered during my life. No one looks for it, it just happens.

People who experience racism can tell the difference between a grumpy person and a racist Jane,

If you expect racism is behind every unpleasant encounter I expect that's what you'll find. There could be 101 reasons for surly service in a shop. Try rosesered's suggestion. Not everyone is cut out for service with a smile!!

Antonia, I am so sorry you are still having to endure this ignorance , try to think of the many who are not racists . Remember - all you can expect from a pig is a grunt , hugs X

Good suggestion rosesarered and yes, lona, I have met many people who are not racist. Thank you for your support, it really helps.

Antonia I'm sorry you've been hurt and humiliated, I hope you've also met lots of good people without any racist attitudes.

Antonia If I were you, I would buy some flowers there again, then, when you have taken your change, say something...along the lines of 'every time I shop here you make me feel unwelcome, is there a good reason for this?' You needn't shop there again, but this will make her aware of her stupid attitude.

Even as I was typing, I thought, someone will say 'it's someone having a bad day.' The answer to this is no, absolutely and definitely no. I am 64 and I have experienced this sort of attitude many, many times and believe me, I can tell the difference between someone being a miserable old so and so, and someone with a racist attitude. My daughter, who is white, has shopped there many times and has always been treated very well, but the racism was confirmed for me when she told me about her Indian friend who was treated as badly as I was. OK, soxI know there are worse incidents! But as Maeve Binchy said, are we seriously meant to feel better just because we know someone else is worse off? ( She was talking about health, but the same applies here). You yourself will not have experienced this if you are white. How could you? But believe me it exists. It is not the sort of thing that one can report either. There is no crime involved here, but there is a lot of hurt and anger caused by attitudes like these. This is the first time I have said anything publicly. When I was a child, the humiliation and the hurt was hidden away, but now that I am older I talk about it when it happens and maybe if helps.

Are you sure it was racism? Maybe she's just a miserable type who's had a bad day and was surly to all her customers? I've certainly met extremely poor customer service at times in shops but its not down to racism.

I am adding to this discussion because of the way I was treated recently in a shop. I don't recall the exact name of the shop but it is a florist in Blackheath, London, next to the station. My DD asked me to buy some flowers and I was appalled by the way I was treated. There was no greeting, no smile and the woman's whole attitude was very frosty. She handed me my change without a word until I very pointedly said 'thank you' and then she muttered 'thank you' in turn. It was very obvious that I was not welcome in that shop. When I mentioned it to my DD, she told me that can Indian friend of hers had met with the same treatment.
This attitude is not only very upsetting for the customer but surely bad for business! My DD says she will not shop there again. This is the kind of racist attitude that does not make the headlines, but it is not the first time, obviously,that I have experienced this and now I am fed up enough to point out the shop where it happened. In this day and age it is obviously not possible to write 'No Blacks' on the door of a shop, but the attitude when you go in is just as bad as if it was written in capitals!

Mojowic - that's such a sad story, but it shows how you can never know what reaction people will have to mixed races, especially within your own family.
I've known a similar thing with mixed religions - a Jewish friend of ours fell for a non-Jewish girl from a very religious Catholic family. They married, but the girl's family refused to come to the wedding.

I feel very embarrassed to remember that when I started work as a young woman, in a Hospital, everyone used to talk of each department employing a statutory looney and a statutory w*g!

Three of my GCs are of dual heritage and as far as I know encounter no racism thank goodness. Their father is of Jamaican origin. I heard a while ago that the term 'mixed race' is considered unacceptable these days, but it still seems to be in general use.

When I was first at work we only had one black guy who worked as a cleaner. All I can remember of him was that he was a joker and always up for a bit of banter, I don't remember anyone being unpleasant to him, in fact he was quite popular. This was 1961.

Yes it was different then, who remembers the MP Gerald Nabarro saying on the BBC in the sixties - how would you feel if your daughter wanted to marry a big buck n****r , this was on Any Questions

Things were very different in your parents era Mojowic, the way they felt sadly was the norm then. Don't think too harshly of them just enjoy life as it is now.

wobblybits, you used words which were acceptable then, bet you wouldn't have deliberately smashed a glass a black person had drank from , or if a publican say - will you sit in the room at the back, I don't mind you being here but customers do

downtoearth, my Dad was in the local pub and someone said - how can you allow your daughter to go out with a n*****, he replied - looking around the company in this room I can say she has made an excellent choice of friend

My morals were not attacked simply because I was dating a priest , expect they thought being a priest his morals were keeping me on the straight and narrow

I am glad things are working out in you family , respect from both sides makes such a difference

Some of the things in the 60/70's were awful, cruel and unpleasant by today's standards. Slavery was acceptable once, but we should be ashamed of it now.

wobblybits I don't think you have anything to be ashamed about since you were unaware that the language in common use then was seen by those whom it described or to whom it was directed as offensive and hurtful.

I don't think I have ever been racist, but I am ashamed of some of the words I used back in the 60's, simply because they were the common language of the era. Whilst I never imagined they were hurtful, had I realised I would never have used them.

I seem to remember growing up in the 50s/60s Anniemy mum making comments about white women with black men and the reference was on the woman's morals and not the men's colour.I understand your point regarding cultures as E's other GP'S and father are African and their beliefs and culture are very different from that of the one my daughter was brought up in.Although estranged from her father I have always tried to support respect for both cultures neither being wrong just different and thankfully she dosent seem to have any identity problems as we facilitated a gradual reunion with her paternal family

downtoearth, racism seems to have different causes for some time. In the sixties it was because my friend was black , the comments when my granddaughter dated a son of a couple from Napal it was culture which some had a problem with

Funnily enough AB my mum dated a Jamaican gentleman for 20 years after the death of my father late 70's to late 90's but she lived in East London and no one turned a hair ,and my daughter had only one white boyfriend in her short life,we lived In mid Essex at the time,my son had friends of many cultures and all where welcomed through our home it was seen as the norm in our area