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End of tether with mil, need help.

(173 Posts)
Frustrateddil Tue 06-Dec-16 11:19:55

Hello – I’m new and here out of desperation. I’m on the other side of your traditional coin, as it were, and am hoping you’ll have some wisdom or strategy we haven’t considered, as I’m rapidly reaching the end of my tether with my mother in law, and all the daughter-in-law forums I’ve been to recommend we run and never speak to her again, which is a fairly drastic step I’m trying to avoid taking. I also apologise for the length – there is history, but I’ll try to be brief.

To set the scene, my husband is the only child of his parents, and his mum, my MIL, is also the only child of an only child. My MIL’s mother passed away about 6 years ago, so we and her husband are all she has by way of family, which is why we’re trying to avoid cutting her off.

My husband and I have been together for 11 years, married for 4. When I first met his mother, it was immediately apparent we’re very different people – she’s involved in the arts, is very extroverted and outgoing and open with her emotions, whereas I’m science-y, quiet, introverted and hate being the center of attention. Despite this, I was still hopeful we could have a good or at least workable relationship, as I get along brilliantly with his dad and also DH’s university friend who they’ve sort of ‘adopted’ as a pseudo-son.

Things were okish until we got engaged after we’d been together for 5 years (broke students = long engagement). At that point, her behaviour started to spiral. She’d always been a bit overbearing with how much involvement she wanted in our lives, and we did give her jobs and responsibilities with the wedding, but she went from ‘a bit over-excited’ (every conversation she had with us had to be about the wedding, she’d send us long rambling emails full of ideas we didn’t want, would attend wedding fairs without us) to ‘invasive but we could just about cope’ (she sulked and made PA comments for weeks when I said I was buying my wedding dress rather than letting her make me one, she nearly sabotaged our venue negotiations by calling them behind our backs, those long rambling emails became weird entreaties begging for us to change our dates or locations to something cheaper along with lists of things we could better spend the money on – not items that would have been helpful, but things like fresh rosepetals strewn down the aisle and things like that) to finally in the last 6 weeks, totally off the rails.

Due to a mix up with hotel rooms, we had to intervene and swap things around so a disabled guest could actually have a room with disabled access. MIL lost it.. Twelve increasingly hysterical and abusive voicemails, then radio silence for a fortnight, then when DH finally called her, she spent over 3 and a half hours screaming, crying, and wailing down the phone that if DH didn’t give her the control over the hotel rooms back, she and FIL would refuse to attend. Eventually, DH caved, but our opinions of her from that point on were permanently changed.

The wedding itself, the night before we each had family gatherings at separate restaurants. A cousin of DH’s grabbed me the following morning while I was getting ready, to report MIL had gotten drunk and spent the evening badmouthing me and DH about how we were so shameful and disgraceful and thoughtless, etc. Faced with having to confront and eject them from the wedding the day of and my DH not having his parents there, I kept my mouth shut, but having to cope with my blood boiling every time I looked at her didn’t exactly mean my wedding day was happy or relaxed.

After that, she sort of returned to normal for a little bit, and I kind of wrote it off and tried to just swallow the bad feelings – afterall, weddings make people crazy right? I was sure if she hadn’t apologised for her behaviour, it was only because she’d realised how bad it was in hindsight and was thoroughly embarrassed and didn’t want to bring it up.

Unfortunately, the last 18 months have given lie to that, and we’re now faced with how on earth to handle her. The first incident was she had a screaming temper tantrum in a car park at my DH that we should call our son her maiden name – I was not, and had never been pregnant at the time, we weren’t ready to TTC. This was followed up with an email that started out sensible but then became increasingly rambling and incoherent, and centered around the fact we’d double barrelled our surnames and this somehow made her feel left out and then spiralled into weird justifications about how he would always be her baby? DH acknowledged we’d received it, but never replied and never brought it up. He also overheard her saying to mutual acquaintances multiple times that she would have loved to have been more involved in our wedding but she ‘wasn’t allowed’. Blood boil – that was when I finally cracked and told him what she’d said about us the night before the wedding. He was horrified, but didn’t confront her.

God this is long: to the point. We’ve recently had two big things happen; we’ve just bought our first home (yay!) and are finally TTC (double yay!) She obviously knows about one but not the other, and she’s repeating the same behaviour. She got upset and very insulting to DH when we wouldn’t give her a house key to our new home to decorate it without us there, even when he spent 2 hours cajolingly explaining why. And now she’s kicked off a big argument because she has a whole load of her old furniture in storage, and feels we’re ‘insulting her’ by buying our own furniture rather than using what she keeps repeatedly offering. I want – no, I NEED to stop this behaviour NOW, before I get pregnant. Women from my family have dangerous pregnancies anyway, and the added stress she is likely to dump on me if she continues like this (or gets worse; she’s a little baby obsessed) could jeopardise the health of both myself and my child, and if it gets to that, I will cut her off rather than risk that, but I want to avoid it getting that far. So we need to force the issue NOW, rather than let it drag on to that point.

However, any drawing a line…well, the history speaks for itself really, in that it’s her way or the highway (with lots of screaming). When she isn’t acting like this, she is very loving and nice. She obviously adores her son – it’s just that she doesn’t appear to have any grasp of reasonable boundaries or expectations, and we really need to give her some.

So, MILs and grandmothers (and grandfathers, if there are any!) have you been in this situation? Did you and your adult children have to have a sit down and reset expectations? Did it go well? What would have made it go better? Are there any resources or books that I could point her at that might help her manage her expectations? Was there any logic or thoughts you had that led to an ‘Aha!’ moment that you think could be suggested to her? Is there something you think we might have missed that should be considered where we could change how we behave?

Help?

Iam64 Tue 03-Jan-17 12:59:24

Faye's post raises the real issue raised in the OP, how do we protect ourselves, our loved ones and especially children from adults whose behaviour can be emotionally or psychologically damaging. Faye's mother had mistreated her daughter, who went on to expose her own children to the grand/mother's unpleasant behaviour. I suspect Faye isn't on her own in wishing that her mother had reflected on her experiences and protected her children from repeating cycles.

FarNorth Tue 03-Jan-17 12:54:13

Yogagirl you wish you had been told if there was a problem so you could make adjustments.
That is exactly the opportunity that has been given to this lady, the OP's MiL.

DaphneBroon Tue 03-Jan-17 12:52:36

Don't be silly, wendysue empathy is not in question. Amateur relationship counselling based on what a person may have read on the internet can however be unhelpful or even dangerous

Wendysue Tue 03-Jan-17 12:49:28

Thanks, Judthepud2!

Wendysue Tue 03-Jan-17 12:48:42

As far as I know, Daphne, empathy is not against the rules here. If you think it should be, you need to notify Gransnet.

Yogagirl Tue 03-Jan-17 12:22:40

He is not my GD dad; stepdad

Yogagirl Tue 03-Jan-17 12:21:29

Postscript to my last post. My estD & I were the same, re phone calls & visits, but only when husband at work. When my now estD moved out of my house into hers, she would phoned me each and every day, before she moved out she would jump into bed with me with baby GD as soon as I woke. My D&GD lived with me before her now husband came on the scene and he lived with me for 6mnths too and I thought we got on well. When I got 'cut out' I had no idea he had a problem with me and now wish my D had warned me, then I would have made sure I stayed out of his way.

Jalima Tue 03-Jan-17 11:43:40

To be fair to DB some posts do sound like 'answers from an agony aunt' and we do only know one side of the story. Perhaps, both the OP and one or two posters being 'transatlantic' they may understand each other well.

However, I do recognise the toxic MIL situation.

You cannot modify someone else's behaviour, you can only recognise the triggers and behave accordingly or remove yourself from that situation and hope that a compromise can be reached over time.

Yogagirl Tue 03-Jan-17 11:13:30

Buddha said: Do not believe with the ears, that the eyes do not see" in this case , on here ears would be read.

I speak on the phone with my nice daughter for an hour sometimes more, most days, and we see each other 2-3 times a week, so OP's Husband, being close to his Mother [before all this] probably did the same, lot's of people/families do.

FarNorth Tue 03-Jan-17 10:57:28

I agree with you, Judthepud.

Judthepud2 Tue 03-Jan-17 10:55:33

That was a bit harsh DB! From what I read, WendySue was just highlighting some of the points OP made in her defence.

I do feel for OP. Not all MILs are sweet and loving, as many of you on here have experienced. Some of them are jealous and intrusive as this one seems to be. My reading of the thread is that OP's DH has experienced this throughout his life and has had enough. He is trying to get his M to moderate her behaviour, which frankly sounds as if she has no self control.

Yes, this is a story told from OP's point of view, but don't we all do that? She came on here in distress looking for support and ideas as to how to cope with the situation as she experienced it. The least she deserves is some understanding, not some of the unpleasant comments she has received.

I haven't posted like this before on GN but am really taken aback by some of the judgemental comments. sad

Jalima Tue 03-Jan-17 10:44:40

Where'my post??!

I will try again:

Faye that is your unhappy experience with your GP and I am sorry, but from a situation I have witnessed, a toxic and jealous MIL can be loving and fun grandmother.

frustrateddil may I recommend this book which someone I know found helpful:
www.amazon.co.uk/Toxic-Laws-Strategies-Protecting-Marriage/dp/0060507853

Hard though this may sound, you may have to modify your behaviour and not react to any triggers from MIL - walk away, do not respond to what is attention-seeking behaviour. Your DH needs to do the same.

Another thought - is she having a bad menopause or has she always been like this?

DaphneBroon Tue 03-Jan-17 10:33:12

Can you really second guess what people are feeling and their motivation wendysue
Are you a qualified relationship counsellor or are you merely surmising?
Or do you have personal knowledge of the private thoughts and feelings of others?
The mid-Atlantic psychobabble I am reading makes me doubt professional expertise so I will leave it as your own opinion as to why anybody is feeling hurt (not "hurting" that is a transitive verb, as in "I hurt my foot")
I don't doubt your kindness and good intentions but we all know where that road leads.

Wendysue Tue 03-Jan-17 05:59:57

Rosyglow, my heart goes out to you! How awful the sudden change in your relationship with DIL and the fact that she has cut you out of GD's life! (((Hugs!)))

Wendysue Tue 03-Jan-17 05:45:20

Yoga, I know it bothers you that OP and DH didn't go through with their Xmas plans with MIL & FIL. And I imagine you're hurting for/identifying with them. I could be wrong, but I think, by now, you can see the differences between you and OP's MIL, but you ache for MIL, anyway. Cuz you know this estrangement hurts her, no matter what she has done.

OP didn't cancel the Xmas plans, though, DH did. I know you're saying it's cuz he's "brainwashed' by OP, as you feel ED is by SIL. And you could be right, IMO (no offense, OP - I just said "could be"). But he could also be reacting to all her apparent efforts to run their lives, including this new "last straw" stuff, whatever it is.

Also, he didn't CO her permanently - he just told her they're pulling away, unless and until she meets certain conditions. I realize the separation may hurt just as much, anyway, and I'm sorry about that. But at least, MIL knows what she needs to do in order to begin to fix the problem. I've seen EPs on this site and elsewhere complain about not knowing what the issues were. As much as this MIL may be hurting, she DOES have the knowledge she needs. I don't know if she'll take advantage of it, of course. Hopefully, she will.

Faye Tue 03-Jan-17 00:42:08

I doubt it Jalima, I didn't love any of my GPs, one GF was nice enough, the others were horrible people. Children are not stupid and while they may not say anything they are thinking it. I haven't forgotten thinking my GM was a bitch when I was five, nearly six, then I just thought she was very mean and she never changed her behaviour. I learnt a lot from her, how not to treat my children and GC.

I wish my mother had cut contact with her mother, she had been very badly treated herself and she knowingly made me and my brother and sister put up with my GM's behaviour every week and every Christmas Day until I was a teenager.

Jalima Tue 03-Jan-17 00:12:41

The thing is that the DGC, if and when they arrive, will still love their granny. If they see her in full tantrum mode they may get upset and wonder why she behaves like that, but she would probably not be like that with her grandchild; she could be a very indulgent loving granny.

And if she said anything at all to a child about its mother then that child is not going to like it and will say so and she will probably have to change her behaviour.

Faye Mon 02-Jan-17 23:57:08

DaphneBrown we only have any posters version. I am sure you have heard the saying, "When people tell you who they are, believe them." There are many posters that ask for advice and write what is happening and they are advised they are wrong. People usually believe they are in the right so even if they are absolutely being unreasonable, they think they are doing the right thing.

I really think the DH needs to stand up to his mother and both, Frusturateddil and her DH should have said to the MIL not to bother to come to the wedding and continued to stand up to her. If she doesn't start acting in an adult like manner then cut contact. The MIL sounds like she has never grown up and found her tantrums get her what she wants. Imagine letting future DC see their granny acting like this. smile

Jalima Mon 02-Jan-17 23:48:02

saga
hmm

I have heard worse tales.
That film could be close to the truth for many
('Monster-in-Law')

DaphneBroon Mon 02-Jan-17 23:23:50

Oops
"More than a MIL from hell "saga.

DaphneBroon Mon 02-Jan-17 23:22:21

Faye we only have OP's version of events and far be it for me to suggest she might be exaggerating, but she too sounds very excitable.
Nobody seriously listens to 3 hours of screaming (?) down a phone, so while I am not disputing the facts, I just think we are not in a position to judge as the MIL's version might be different.
Somebody was clearly out to stir up trouble with their version of what went on the night before the wedding, but the MIL was admittedly drunk so to "evict them from the wedding?" Bit if a over reaction. In any case the DH was presumably present so it was up to him to deal with it.
OP has gone on at length so I won't but there does seem to be more to this thank "MIL from hell" saga.

Jalima Mon 02-Jan-17 23:18:36

For instance, why would you stay on the phone for 3 hours with someone who was screaming and ranting? I would say 'I will speak to you when you have calmed down' and put the phone down and leave it off the hook.

These mothers have tied the apron strings very tightly and they find it very difficult to let go. It is up to their sons to find the strength to maintain a mother/son relationship which does not dominate all their lives and to realise that the relationship with a wife is the one that is most important now.

Jalima Mon 02-Jan-17 23:10:47

OK, take the point Faye but some posts are tltr and I was trying to sum up what I thought.
The syndrome of the toxic MIL from Hell is not unknown to me and although some courses of action are tempting I think walking away is often a good option.
And I still believe that the relationship with any future DGC could be entirely different and should not be ruled out before the event.

Faye Mon 02-Jan-17 21:49:18

Two warring women, with respect Jalima I believe you are very wrong there. The MIL's behaviour is is out of control, she in fact screamed and carried on at her son for three hours on the phone and he was too uncomfortable, shall we say, to hang up. It's not fair to say Frusturateddil is part of the problem and is a warring woman. When you are being abused it really sucks to be told you are just as bad as your abuser. The probem lies with the MIL's behaviour and the DH's inability to tell his mother to stop.

Frusturateddil you can cut contact, your DH can do as he pleases, but you should not put up with your MIL's behaviour. Or the other alternative is do as grannypiper suggests.

Yogagirl with the greatest respect, I am sure posters do not think your DD cutting you out of her and your GC's life is in any way because you were like this MIL. There are decent MILs and decent DILs unfortunately they often find themselves with the type of inlaw you have. It's more than likely Frusturateddil's MIL loves only herself and doesn't care who she hurts in her quest to have her own way.

Jalima Mon 02-Jan-17 19:54:41

Frankly, I'm shocked that anyone would think that this woman should not be cut out of her son's life...at least until she has accepted her awful behaviour and attempted to address it
hmm
No-one can cut a person out of someone else's life.
It is up to the son whether or not he wants to do this. He can refuse to speak to his mother about his wife if she becomes abusive about her, he can tell her that her behaviour is out of order but it is not up to the dil to finish their relationship. He could end up resenting his wife and that would be damaging to their relationship.
The poor man should not be forced to take sides between two warring women.
He is an adult and able to make his own decisions.