Continued support and fun aspects too of rebuilding lives after estrangement can't believe 4 years and we still here to offer help, friendship and support.

<still shaking head in disbelief>

celebgran .... HQ mean you as well!! Stop trying to transfer responsibility onto everyone else.

eddiecat - thank you for the explanation and I'm sorry that you find yourself in this situation. I can see why you do it, but try not to assume that people are going to judge you because of your estrangement. It's not my place to judge anyone, I don't know your circumstances, There are lots of us out there in RL who would behave exactly the same and offer you non judgmental friendship and support. We take people as we find them and sometimes those outside a situation can see things more clearly and are able to offer impartial advice if asked for. (You know that old saying about not being able to see the wood for the trees?!) if people are judging you and finding you wanting because of a painful and complex event that's happened in your life then maybe they're not the people you need. Give us a chance -some of us are quite nice really!!

Thanks for your honest explanation though eddiecat, much appreciated.

celebgran you just don't get it, do you? I think there's maybe a touch of narcissism showing in that you assume you're of sufficient importance in my life for me to spend time coming up with conspiracies to do you down. Not the case I'm afraid.

Let us hope that all who post take notice of it.

Mawbroon maybe you can think on yourself and work out why i posted that?

It's not really difficult also read comments by eddiecat, fairydoll, and you will see why maybe but as you said none so blind,

Time for cup of tea having left pleased client!

Thank you gransnet maybe just maybe someone may take notice of that.

But, mette, personal insults and offensive comments FROM a few firebrands among the estranged posters to others who were not attacking them are not helpful, either, and are definitely not according to GN guidelines.

Like I've said on previous occasions - reminds me of a group of vultures circling above looking for prey, then swooping down for the best pickings

Hard to believe how the nasties are surfacing again

Sadly there is a little regular band of posters on gransnet theat seem to resent the friendships built over years on this thread

??
Sad lives they must live to get a buzz out of such horrid posts

One can imagine them bullying at schools in younger days
Now think on, celebgran
Who bandied these insults made these comments?
None so blind as those who won't see.
You want a "closed" club, why don't you set it up.
In the meantime, anybody who has registered with GN is entitled to pass comment - and that could include people who know you and your situation personally in RL.

Katekmyou and your friends are the ones making nasty comments can you not read the other posts???? Off or I will be late

Reallymjainsworth ? That is a personal insult and certainly not true
Off see client now thank goodness I have a life

I try to avoid commenting on this thread because it's history makes clear that even constructive posts can be responded to in an over emotional, exaggerated manner.
Celebgran, Janeainsworth's latest post is correct. Thanks to jane, elegran, penstemon, annsixty, kakek and others for being confident enough to contribute to this thread.
Therapy doesn't change estrangement but it does help to begin to make some sense of it, to create some emotional distance, even to be open to the
Ossibility of change.

The only person doing any bullying on this thread celebgran is you.

katek - perhaps I can help your confusion. It is extremely difficult to discuss estrangement with others face to face. People I don`t know well ask if I have grandchildren and I say that I have 2 but don`t see them - and they immediately wonder what I have done to merit this. Friends won`t talk to me about their own grandchildren because they fear upsetting me. And I don`t want to be telling them about my distress because it makes them feel guilty that they do see their grandchildren.
Before discovering this forum I did not know anyone at all who was in the same situation as me. If I did know someone of course I would prefer to talk to them face to face - but I don`t.
As I have said before - I do not focus on it every day but there are times when I really need to offload -without fear of the repercussions. And I am also pleased to be able to offer support to others who are having a bad day

Er....how do you know that your comments aren't tipping a vulnerable person over the edge Celebgran?? Point to ponder. You've just proven my point about lack of compassion for others on this forum.

I'm off for lunch.

Katek maybe your could read my post and realise what you behaviour you are exhibiting it certainly isn't constructive or necessary.

Maybe you can't help yourself likewise your pals?

Yes I actually know someone estranged from both sons who committed suicide and it was horrendous but there are still people who like to post unnecessary comments it is that kind of negative behaviour that tips a vulnerable person over the edge,

Likewise bullying in schools so very sad and online bullying is rife in schools

eddiecat I can well believe that an estrangement could drive people to suicide. I have no doubts that it has probably happened already. I have personal experience of losing people to suicide and it is the most terrible event so I do appreciate your feeling that support should be readily available. Perhaps a closed FB group which could be flagged up on GN?

I'm puzzled though, you say you prefer to interact with others re hobbies and interests but on the other hand you're prepared to be so open online re very private and personal issues?? I'm confused.

Thanks to you and sparklygrandma for your reasonable posts.

celebgran.....just stop. You're achieving nothing, only exhibiting a very unpleasant side.

Just to make it clear
Hard to believe how the nasties are surfacing again.

Well said eddiecat

Sadly there is a little regular band of posters on gransnet theat seem to resent the friendships built over years on this thread.

Sad lives they must live to get a buzz out of such horrid posts

One can imagine them bullying at schools in younger day

Katek - the reason you see little evidence on this forum of my other interests is that wherever possible I prefer to interact face to face with people rather than via the internet.

In view of the current unpleasantness I must admit that the idea of a closed group is sounding very appealing. However I feel it is vital that this support is readily and easily available to anyone who needs it. I would never have spoken to anyone else suffering from a family estrangement if I hadn`t chanced upon Gransnet. I am not being over dramatic when I say that there are people who actually feel suicidal when estrangement happens - and they don`t want to talk to friends for fear of being judged.

I don't need to make excuses for myself jainsworth maybe you do?

Don't confuse yourself with others

The estrangement does not irritatate at all. I have great sympathy for anyone unable to have regular contact with family for whatever reason. My "irritation"is a result of the very negative attitude by some on here to comments made in good faith. I feel it is purposefully designed to keep the majority of GN off the thread.

Therapy can't solve the estrangement but it can certainly modify attitudes and behaviour around it. As Penstemmon says a closed group may suit your purposes better.

"Grans on GN have a right to talk about things....etc." Yes, you do, but on an open forum we other grans also have the right to comment without being accused of all sorts of Machiavellian motivations or being called vultures or bullies.

"Plenty of other GN threads revisit their OP or same subject". I agree......but not for 4 years.

Your comment taken in the spirit in which it was intended.

Grans on GN have a right to talk about things that in an ongoing way affect their daily lives I would have thought.

That's one of things GN is for. Plenty of other GN threads re - visit their OP or same subject.

Therapy cant solve problems such as family estrangement, and all we are doing here is chatting about it.

If you don't like the content of the thread, please go and find another that doesn't irritate so much.

Meant constructively.

If you do not want people,who have not had exactly the same experience as you, to comment I do not understand why you don't have a closed group somewhere else to get the support you seek from each other. GN is an open forum so whatever is posted it is fair for anyone else to comment. You cannot control who says what ! It seems that you want others to know your sadness but are unhappy when others react.

Ignore 'day'

Evidence of the rejection is there through this and previous threads. one poster in particular not accepting the advice of counsellors/therapists and saying so. The defining evidence is that you are all still here being identified by your estrangements-it would appear that therapy has not been entirely effective if it has been undertaken. You may have interests and a life outwith GN but this is far from obvious on the forum. There is little engagement on any other thread/topic - just a perpetual focus on the estrangement and replaying of events over and over again. No support or advice or even interest in anybody else's hurts and problems Maybe you should examine why people say you are 'wallowing' - it's all any of us see. Perhaps you also need to see what you're doing wrong-self awareness day may help change the circumstances you find yourself in