Strained relationship with daughter

Could it be that your daughter has been having a really crappy time and is tired of pretending that everything is OK for the sake of those around her? As a 'difficult daughter' myself, so-called because I don't like hypocrisy and living my life based on what other people might think, I have learnt that my family want me to conform to their idea of me rather than wishing me to be who I am. When you are judged without bring understood, coupled with health issues, sometimes you bite in the hope that people around you might try to understand. She has been difficult since her teenager years, you say - that would be when she became her own person rather than the child whose behaviour was controlled. Accept her for who she is, and try to find out why she is so fed up - it might be she is reacting to people around her, and is a pussycat when she is comfortable and at ease with those who 'get' her. Perhaps a chat with her partner might help?

Sue421.Had you brought up the subject of your daughters behaviour on meeting her MIL or did MIL mention it first.? You know what your daughter is like,( oh that we were all perfect)and I would not discuss your daughters behaviour with any one other than your husband.
Love your daughter for who she is .Invite her out for lunch ,not organise a lunch ,It is not a corporate business meeting.
Avoid any sensitive subjects that could cause an atmosphere but if it going to be too difficult, as your DH seems to believe this lunch will be and you will get upset , then you have an option.

I agree with willsmadnan completely - All the advice on this thread seems to be to keep trying ... keep upsetting yourself ... what a backward approach I think. You have already said that it is only the fact that she is your daughter that keeps you even thinking about this - clearly, she is causing you much stress, and equally she does the same with other people, and why should she be allowed to rule the roost and silence them. In no way is it rude for any of the people she offends to speak out - maybe they think you as her mother have the power to influence her behaviour. Your response to them should be to be open and honest, and say that she makes your interaction a misery too but there seems to be nothing you can do and there does come a point where despite problems in childhood adults do have to be responsible for their own behaviour. I see this from the viewpoint of all the others in her life whom she offends, as I have a close step-relative who is just the same. Neither of her parents can cope with her nor do they wish to see her but she is continually aggressive to all family members and even those who have offered kindness and a degree of understanding such as myself are in the firing line. Unless your daughter has a definite diagnosis of borderline personality disorder, you can expect some co-operation and civil interaction from her and so can other members of her family. It's not rude of other people to point out her disturbing behaviour. You know about it and you agree so why be upset about it?

GrumpyOldBat
Spot on.

From sad and painful personal experience, I think Nemosmum may have identified the issue - how could I know? Of course, I don't, but it may be worth looking up Borderline Persoanlity Disorder - and there are now some new treatments which may work. (You could look on line for these) The issue is that people with BPD often won't recognise that they have a problem - "its other people". We can all be like that - blame others or ourselves - but usually also have the willingness to reflect honestly on our own behaviour. When we can do that without judgement but simply with an opennes to what is true, we can change and free ourselves, but people with BPD find it far harder to look openly and non-defensively at themselves. And we cannot change someone else - all we can do is change our attitude or understanding, and sometimes that brings change to others, but sometimes not.

I guess she is pretty certain you will keep on trying and as her mum I guess you want to, it does sound as if there may be a personality disorder, or a general dislike of herself for not being perfect, who is?, so if you feel a meal before Christmas is a good idea go ahead, the pub sounds the best place as slightly more difficult for her to play up (just thinking that makes her sound like a child). Obviously you will be trying to keep things light.

As regards MIL it depends on her personality as to why she thought she would tell you and what had been going on. My MIL, long gone, felt it was her duty to inform my mother that my housekeeping skills as a very young new wife weren't up to scratch. My mum kept quiet about it for years but I could feel the vibes and never got along with her. Try not to be too upset you are doing your best.

I have a difficult daughter who has a congenital condition also suffered by her brothers. Somehow, life bites her on the bottom regularly so she often feels it's unfair and because she is difficult, the easy relationship I have with the rest of the family just highlights the problems with ours. She 'doesn't do' family events then complains that nobody makes an effort to see her.
One of the things I found made a difference was to admit I had made mistakes as a parent along with an explanation that I did everything I did out of love. I have learned to say "Ouch," and laugh if she is hurtful, rather than be defensive which causes a row. If she has a problem (that old circular argument where she doesn't appear to want a solution), I make sure I extricate myself from the situation telling her I will give the issue some thought and get back to her. It normally stops things escalating and me getting more exasperated.
OP, I have felt like you on many an occasion but I have learned that keeping calm, limiting my time with her when life is biting back and trying not to be too judgmental seems to be the way forward. Her DH and I have a good relationship so we also maintain a gentle, unified approach when she is being unreasonable which seems to be working. Her MIL has made some cutting remarks which I usually ignore but if she is being really hurtful, I quietly remind her of the burden my DD is carrying. I refrain from remarking that my SIL appears to have married his mother!!!!

Is it possible your daughter may have what's called borderline personality disorder. Your daughter and many of the other stories sound like my daughter. I'm not going into details I've written so much about the problems she has given us over the years. After three marriages she actually went for help with depression, but was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, or BPD as they say.Please, do yourself a favour and Google the condition, I think you might be very surprised, and it might explain a lot. All trust, and most of our love has gone. Unkindness, total lack of empathy, unless it suits them to be empathic, no understanding of anyone else's problems , it goes on and on. As my DR told us, it's not your fault in anyway. So please google, I'd be interested in what you think.

I had bereavement counselling and accepted DD did not want contact. Hard but extremely helpful and am happy. DD does text occasionally and that's ok.

Phew - so nice to have found out I am not the only one. Also to have some really helpful solutions on ways to handle this which I have not thought of. Will be taking on board what you have suggested ... bit by bit...and I will make that Christmas lunch date IF she agrees to it - but not on Christmas Eve as too near Christmas to get upset.
Thank you everyone - I feel that I am not alone. Really helpful

Hi sue I think maybe you should put how you feel into a letter and Let your dd read it don't hold back put how you feel if nothing comes of it you have your answer best wishes ?

I totally agree with wilsmadnan and saggi cannot understand tip toeing around them and biting ones tongue. There comes a time when enough is enough.

I’d try and tackle it before Xmas. Next time she says or does something say “ that is rude and upsetting” and if necessary walk away, or go to the loo if away from home. Say it every time , but don’t go into explanations etc as that doesn’t help. Just say one short phrase and go. GL

She may just be a person who doesn't like it when people "try too hard"... it may come off as annoying to her. Maybe even like you're being fake. You do get people that see things this way. Most of the time, they are quite independent and it irritates them.

First, I feel for you in this very difficult situation.

Did you feel that your daughter's MIL was criticising her, or was she perhaps hinting that she would like your opinion on how to handle her?

To me there is a world of difference here. I was brought up to never criticise some-one else's near relatives or friends and I have always tried to stick to the principle.

However, I have sometimes found it helpful to ask another friend or relative of the "difficult" person for advice. If that was what the MIL in question was doing, she wasn't trying to be unkind.

If you look at it honestly, is all of your daughter's behaviour that hurts others due to her heredity condition, or is some of it just unkind behaviour that should be checked by telling her how hurtful it is?

I am also in total agreement with wilsmadnan and saggi. I have 'put up and shut up' for so long. We only seem to here from DD when she wants something. I know she is busy with work and family but a phone call more than once every three weeks wouldn't take up too much time. She's just had a week off work and we have not had any contact at all. So, by coincidence, today is the day I am going to ring and ask why.
I have a feeling it's going to be stormy but as said earlier enough is enough.

This is a subject so dear to my heart. My daughter has hardly had any contact with me for a year now (she lives 5,000 miles away!) and it came to a head when she wrote me a horrible letter in April saying I'd been an awful parent etc, and accused me (!) of having borderline personality disorder (her husband also wrote saying the same thing!!).
This situation has literally made me I'll, but I keep on trying because she's my daughter and if I let her go and 'walk away' I have nothing ... (My son is also alienated ... and it's his birthday today but I can't contact him to with him happy birthday... gutted.) I sympathise greatly with you Sue421. All we ever wanted was a reasonably happy family.... ?

That’s very sad Sue421 most be very upsetting for you.
I would try and see her the pub seems a good idea.
It’s difficult i know for you but it’s something you will regret if you don’t try. Give it your best shot anyway.
After that who knows.

All my sympathies go out to anyone with an adult child with BPD. My DD is 28 and was diagnosed 3 years ago though the last 12 have been a real rollercoaster. Do read up about it - it does help to have some understanding of the condition which is a very difficult and painful disorder for the person and their families. I deal with my DD better now but I take every day as it comes. I try to steer a course that keeps forgiving and forgetting the hurtful things she says and drawing a line that means I don’t feel totally manipulated. She needs my love but I have had to be really tough at times. It is heartbreaking but I have to take care of myself ,too. I reach out as much as I can but also have to protect myself , too. For sure , if she wasn’t my daughter I could walk away and indeed would. It seems that there are many of us experiencing this from our DC. That it itself helps. Good luck

Don't ever give more than you can give freely, if you need affection, respect or consideration in retern maybe it is time to step back. If you can just love her for who she is, then go with that but make it as easy on yourself as possible. Not Christmas Eve out, mince pies and coffee or mulled wine at your place. She may be ill, she may just not be one of life's sweetness and light people. Accept her how she is and take the course of least resistance.

Go to film at Christmas, cheap and something to enjoy without any pressure.

I would not allow someone to speak badly of my child, she may have her problems but everyone has their failings. Whoever she is she is your child, and she is her husband's wife, people should not feel free to critique her to you, what spiteful gits they are.

I think meeting her at low key things is easiest until the time is right and f it never is, well you kept the faith with her while protecting youself.

Have a lovely Christmas.

I too have a difficult daughter. She is sure that she knows everything and I know nothing. She has totally destroyed my confidence in every aspect of life. She tells me I was silly and stupid. She claims I cant do any form of housework or cook I cant walk or talk properly and I cant drive. I have been running houses and driving since I was 20 when I got married and 17 when I started driving. I was assistant regional manager for an international company. I know all these things but she with her nastiness convinced me I was stupid and worthless.
It was silly because I was looking after her children, cooking for them and driving them around so if she really believed I was such a useless person why trust her precious children to me.
I have been shouted at and sworn at so often in public that I have had shop assistants tell her not to speak to her mum like that. An Official Person told her to stop swearing while I was trying to do a very distressing piece of official form filling. I have had neighbours tell me she is a bad person. I have been in a hospital and staff have told her to stop shouting at me. She has hit a patient in hospital (a relative). My late parents told her to leave their house until she could behave in a suitable manner. I was recently told by another customer at a place of business that I should not tolerate such disrespect. She has hit me to my damage which was seen by medics who then reported this to SS who seemed to want me to go to the police.
The end for me was when a DGC started saying the same words as their mother. I am not going to have another generation abuse and disrespect me so I have not made any attempt at contact. I know the child is only repeating what they have heard. Contact with DGC has only been as and when it suits the mother so I have no wish to take part in emotional blackmail and hurt to myself.
Her childrens' other side have stopped putting up with her. Her school friends are disgusted with her ways and most have dropped her though some are in contact with me! It is sad watching all this.
I have to protect myself for my own well being both mental and physical.

Sugarpuff

After reading all these posts I thank goodness for Sons .

My first thought was BPD too so maybe those not so involved see things more clearly . My X Dil had a BPD and made everyone`s life hell so I sympathise xx

Sugarpuff

Invite your daughter round. I'm willing to bet she needs you far more than you will know. Don't ever let it be said you abandoned her - you could regret it for ever.