Son in law's temper

FIL has body-shamed me and my stepdaughter, financially abused Hubby and me,

How does a FIL financially abuse his son and DIL?
^body-shamed*?

You and your family obviously have a lot of problems agnurse, which may colour your thoughts and hence your replies to others who are seeking advice.

Confused I wonder if your SIL is stressed or has money worries? I think your DD is the best one to handle this, perhaps advising a 'Not in front of the children' stance if your SIL does start shouting. Your DD needs to try to be stronger, firmer and not let him see her in tears.
Perhaps an anger management course would be helpful - but you're not the best one to suggest these things.

If you're there, you could hurry the children out of the room into the garden/upstairs and start playing a nice game with them or playing music and singing with them.

What would happen (in my job, anyway) would be a telephone call to each parent, asking if they would like any support.
An unsolicited call to the parents, instigated by MIL, is not a good idea imo.
It could make matters a lot worse.

agnurse
What the hell does your reply have to do with anything I said?
I assume that you meant anyone other than you or your DH is a possible child abuser.
Don't be so ridiculous woman!

And also Chewbacca - certainly in the department I work in, no social worker would be going out knocking at the door. Unless there was serious and sustained domestic abuse going on, there would be no social workers involved.

If someone calls in and reports a concern about a child, unless they are a professional, then they have the right to remain anonymous, and even if they disclose who they are to the person taking the call (me) they can request to remain anonymous, and that will be respected.

What would happen (in my job, anyway) would be a telephone call to each parent, asking if they would like any support. Generally we say that we understand that couples argue, and that stressful situations arise, but we talk about how the parents plan to ensure that the children aren't subjected to it in future.

It's not all social workers marching in and "interfering"

Chewbacca - "Please don't keep imploring people to contact Social Services agnurse, they would be most unlikely to get involved in this."

I work in Children's Services, and we would, and we do. All children are impacted by witnessing any domestic violence, no matter whether it is physical or emotional, directed at them or a parent.

It would most likely be the Early Help provision that would support, both children and parents

What has that got to do with the op?

Juggernaut

My FIL thought the world of his father and took his kids to see him.

TRIGGER

FIL molested his own daughter over the course of several years.

END TRIGGER

FIL has body-shamed me and my stepdaughter, financially abused Hubby and me, tried to destroy our marriage, and refused to accept that I have a chronic illness.

He's not allowed around me or any future children. Hubby is LC with him.

Do you think we should be spending time with FIL?

Well, obviously my DS and I have a unique relationship, because if I for one moment thought that his actions were affecting DGS badly, I'd have some very strong words with him, and he'd expect nothing less!
If it was my DDiL being aggressive, then I'd point it out to DS and expect him to do something about it.
Advising anyone to contact social services in a case such as this is wrong in the extreme, and a dreadful knee jerk reaction. Absolutely ridiculous advice to give!
Maybe my family are odd, but we're all firmly of the mind that 'it takes a village to raise a child'.
Not in the literal sense obviously, but in the not so distant past if a young mum had a baby who wouldn't sleep, or a newly-married couple had the row of a century, or a child needed advice with a school project, there would very likely have been a grandparent, an uncle, an aunt or a cousin just down the road who would be able to give much-needed reassurance, advice and support. But today many are parenting without family or even friends nearby, or if they are, they won't 'interfere' and we are all the poorer for it.
As for young parents threatening to stop GPs seeing the children, they should take a step back, inhale deeply, and damn well grow up!

And what good would that do to alleviate his temper agnurse? Eh? So now you'll have a man who has social workers in his house and he's going to be suspicious of his mother in law and his neighbours and he'll be as mad as hell at what he, quite rightly, percieves as interfering on a grand scale. His family will be isolated even further!

Confused has already said that she has no intention of involving social services in this matter so perhaps it's best not to advocate that line of advice any further.

Chewbacca

The thing about Social Services is that I believe they don't release the name of the person who contacted them. For all the parents know maybe a neighbour heard the dad screaming at his kids, or the kids mentioned something in school.

That sounds more optimistic Confused, I'm glad things have calmed down for the moment.
If you get on well with SIL's family, that sounds like it might be a good idea. His own mum might be able to offer some insight into the problem. Good luck with it all.

I appreciate ALL of your inputs. I wouldn't approach Social Services. I'd go to his family first and see if they can make him see that what he's doing is wrong. However, for the moment things are calm, so I'll keep my powder dry. On the plus side he has many good points. Thank you all.

You say nothing. You just leave the situation. Unsolicited advice often isn't welcomed and is seen as interference.

Whereas calling Social Services and involving them in the situation would not be "interfering"? I wouldn't want to see the fallout within a family when they realise that the social worker who's just knocked on their door and informed them that they've had a report of family troubles, was their at their MILs behest. Now THAT is interfering.

agnurse I don't believe you have any idea what you're talking about, quite honestly. The "advice" you so liberally dish out is so flawed, it's dangerous.

Has he always been like this, or is he having business problems, or other problems with the family which you might know nothing about. He sounds as if he is on a very short fuse. Maybe one more go sometime when you are on your own with your daughter but otherwise at present they have both told you to keep out of it, lots of ideas of helping keep the GC out of it here.

agnurse as I said previously only the OP can know whether her constructive criticism given with love can be heard as that or not ....do you recognise this scenario atall (see my previous post to you a little earlier in this thread)?

Chewbacca

You say nothing. You just leave the situation.

Unsolicited advice often isn't welcomed and is seen as interference.

Confused I have pm'd you

But you can't say to your AC "I think you're wrong in yelling at your children" or
"You ought to parent them this way".

Ok agnurse, now that you've taught us what not to say, you really need to teach us what we should say. What advice would you give - apart from calling Social Services, which is just plain ridiculous, what does your expertise advise?

Sorry Bluebelle I disagree . Constant shouting around and at children is emotional abuse. I have worked in child protection and safeguarding all my life. An angry father shouting at small children looks like a giant and is very frightening. The OP says he "takes it out on the children" that could mean many things but it doesn't sound good to me. His wife may not be afraid of him or she may be justifying that he is not too bad and be unaware or in denial of how it affects the children. Children in an abusive situation do sometimes still " adore" their father again for complicated reasons, that does not make the fathers actions ok and it will affect them in time, I've seen the results in my own and other children

"...true love..." ..."some don't hear ..."

agnurse there is a subtle difference between criticising and advice given with tea love and care which can be a normal part of relationships! I remember gently advising my mum about some things she needed to consider as she got older ...it was a reality check for her! I remember her advising me about a couple of parenting things with my kids - I valued her experience and wisdom, despite it being criticism(given with love!). Now I know son don't take it/hear it Ike that but that doesn't mean loving constructive criticism does not exist!
The OP was asking if anyone thought she should raise the issue...she is entitled to ask that...and only she knows whether she can give it and have it received as loving constructive advice

Is shouting at a 3 year old abusive?
I think its worse than breaking an Ipad, and a lot of people were incensed at that.

The reason I always say contact Social Services is because it isn't another person's place to criticize someone else's parenting. If you think the children are at serious risk then the authorities need to be notified. If they aren't, then you need to leave it.

Let's try replacing the word "grandparent" with "friend". Would you consider it appropriate for a friend to criticize your parenting? What about a stranger?

Point is, if there's no actual abuse occurring, it's not on to criticize someone else's parenting.

Now, that said, I do think it's reasonable to have rules in your home that are to be followed. For example, if the GC are at yours and you don't allow eating outside the kitchen, you're well within your rights to remind them of that rule. But you can't say to your AC "I think you're wrong in yelling at your children" or "You ought to parent them this way". In my house that would be an instant case of until you apologize you won't be seeing me or my kids again.

Thank you everyone for your posts. My thinking is a bit clearer now.

If he has always behaved this way it probably does not affect the children, shouting will seem the norm to them.

If your daughter was unhappy she would ask for help.
Awful to have to listen to, maybe have your daughter and grandchildren to visit you without the son in law then you will not have to witness it.