My son is an abuser

It doesn't really matter why someone is an abuser.

Possibly they've had a terrible upbringing, maybe they have a need to control, or perhaps they're just horrible, entitled, abusive people.

The end result is the same for those people caught up in their chaos and violence.

Move out, and let them get help for their issues, before a tragedy happens.

Yes there is a cause it’s called selfish , self absorbed, entitled, narcisstic behaviour and they don’t change because they don’t see any reason why they should. They have all the control so why give it up

Of course some people can change if that's what they want to do. It wouldn't be a case of doing one short course and everything would be fine. They would undertake several courses over several years. They have to learn just how much damage their anger causes both to those around them and themselves it's not a quick fix and nor should it be. They should also have a counsellor on hand they can contact if they feel they are slipping backwards.

Courses don’t work because most abusers think they are entitled to do what they do because their partner “makes them” so it’s the partners fault always .

There must be a cause for why they believe they are entitled. can't some angry people be re-educated?

Downtoearth

Abusers as I said before don’t change. I now live in a completely different area after leaving . The 5 year injunction I was awarded after I had him convicted of assault in court, has run out. Myself nor my adult children or grandchildren have any contact with him and I live in fear of him finding us as I don’t believe he will not try to get some kind of revenge for me daring to leave and divorce him. Courses don’t work because most abusers think they are entitled to do what they do because their partner “makes them” so it’s the partners fault always .

Hello lovely X
I've just posted a similar story on another thread only it's about my daughter and her partner ....I can only empathise with you as it's such a hard situation ...I can totally understand how Ill it must be making you feel...you are doing the right thing by supporting her and your grandchild but any reporting of the DV incidents had to come from her. ...your responsibilities lie with your grandchild depending on if you feel he is safe around his father ... safeguarding should be made aware but currently whilst they are safe with you all you can do is be there for her..talk to her . Let her open up to you ...but have someone YOU can talk to as well as you will need an outlet x
He needs to seek help himself and the natiobal domestic violence helpline will be able to put both him and her in touch with groups who offer programmes for perpetrators of DV And their victims x However he has to want to seek help and recognise he had a problem ..that's the hardest thing x

One difficulty is that the evidence that 'anger management' courses change people isn't strong.
People who have significant difficulties , whatever name we give them, need firstly to fully acknowledge the damage their behaviour causes to others as well as to themselves. They need to engage in psychotherapy rather than simply attend a group . Sorry to seem negative but this is an area I sadly know more about that I wished I did.

It may well be difficult to get help for anger management etc via the Nhs but if people genuinely want to change they can pay to do the same courses privately. Far better than waiting for the state to provide them once the perpetrator is behind bars.

downtoearth - thanks so much for sharing your own story. It shocks me that some people still seem to minimise the impact of domestic abuse on children, as well as on the victim who in my long experience, is almost always the mother.
There are so many grandparents caring for grandchildren who suffered as your loved ones did. Can't find enough words to express my thanks to you x

LibbyR you are marvellous! I love to read your voice of reason.

Downtoearth I have no words, your story is one of saddest I've come across on here

Oh gosh Downtoearth fortunately I have no experience of DV but your story really tugged at my heartstrings

I have brought up my GD,now nearly 21,from the age of 4,still suffering effects from the abusive behaviour of her father to my daughter.

My daughter was beaten in front of my GD,many times.

My daughter tried to break many times from the relationship.

The final time she tried to leave,was beaten in front of my GD,who remembers her screaming out for me while on the floor.

That night due to the beating she took her own life.

My GD suffers this day to anxiety,trust,abandonment issues.

I hope this is relevant,I have seen and live every day with the damage done by DV.

We had to move away from an area under victim protection,that we had roots and family,jobs and friends and resettle in secret 150 miles away.

This a sad reality of DV,father also has MH issues.

This is our experience of it.from the childs experience.

You can’t be joking flexible friend. The OPs son likely to kill someone- his partner, their baby, himself, or all 3- if left unreported. He absolutely should be punished and put in jail because at least that way his child and partner aren’t at risk. His future job prospects shouldn’t factor in anyone’s concern while a woman and child are still in danger.

Iam64, it's not that way in my area but I should have considered that things aren't always done the same way across the country and waiting times can differ hugely.

LibbyR, this must be terrible for you. I hope your son feels better now that he is alone and I hope he gets treatment for his anger. I do hope the poor young mother and her child will be safe.

Starblaze - you're post makes helpful suggestions but they really aren't grounded in reality. I don't mean to be rude b ut the notion that the courts and police can arrange 'perpetrator courses' is vanishingly unlikely. We don't live in an ideal world.

The OP is doing her best, as is her daughter in law. The abusive male needs to sort himself out, see his GP and get referred on to an appropriate NHS service. Sadly, the waiting list may be 2 years....

What an awful situation for you. Hard is it is I think you need to offer support to both your dil and son. Something has gone wrong somewhere. Both of them need intervention for different reasons. Both need to be put in touch with proper help. Unfortunately that may mean persuading the dil to contact the police. The police and courts will be able to arrange perpetrator courses (I believe they are called something else now) as well as courses and support for dil. There is also the danger that if he is not ready to see his abusive behaviour, losing you to (her side) may cause a huge backlash from him.

Abusive people aren't all lost, especially when mental health is a factor. This behaviour can be corrected. I have seen it work. Don't give up on him yet.

What an absolutely appalling shock this must have been for you.

I'm not sure you can help you son right now, as he unfortunately probably feels you are "siding with his wife against him".

Your priority right now is your grandchild and his mother, who like many abused women finds it almost impossible to leave her husband.

Sadly, the only sensible thing is for her to accept that however kind and nice he can be, he and she are a couple who cannot apparently resolve their difficulties without resorting to abuse.

Please continue to help her right now. When your shock has receded a little you may be able to help your son as well, but right now I think you would find it too hard to talk to him about all this and might unintentionally make things worse.

Sometimes, good advice, given with the best of intentions, can undermine those involved and sadly, alienate them from appropriate services.

It can also result in the individuals at the heart of the awful life events, feeling judged and criticised.

Domestic abuse is complex. There is no quick fix and no one approach will suit every situation.

I have personal experience from the experience of loved one's, people in our friendship circle (luckily not myself so far as physical abuse is concerned). I have far too many years professional experience - the Freedom Project is good. Bernardos and the NSPCC can offer support though, the NSPCC ' and other agencies will refer to Children's Services, both because its protocol and also because Children's Services are the agency with statutory responsibility for DA. The same goes for the police, any involvement with DA = referral to the l.a. social work team. The response there, unless injuries or significant risk to children from physical involvement/lt emotional abuse, is usually to write to the victim offering support.
The OP 's son needs to take responsibility for his behaviour - get help via his GP, the NSPCC or other agency.

I have to ask @LibbyR about your comments.

It seems from what you have said that you have not discussed this situation with your son—‘headspace to challenge my son about this as I have a big work event in a week’ - nor are you pushed to find out how your son is, particularly as you say he has MH issues. Have I missed something ?

‘By supporting her I feel I will almost certainly lose my son’ why is the choice so stark & so absolute based on the account of one person, no victim blaming but you do not seem to have both sides or an independent account.
‘but his behaviour has flicked a switch in me that has accepted that.’
Again, an account of his behaviour which is not favourable to him, so why such a quick flick switch ? We know that it often takes victims of abuse time & repeated cycles to accept the reality of the situation. You seem to resolve this conundrum very quickly.
So my question is, has abuse & DV been a part of your life, & therefore your son’s life, in the past ?

‘My grandson’s well-being is my priority and my son is old enough to be the author of his own life. I hold my little grandson and he is the image of his daddy at that age and I wonder how did we get to this.’
Is your son ‘the image of his daddy’?
Was abuse & DV an aspect of the fractured relationship with your previous partner / his father ?
I have the sense that your son’s partner has provided you with something that pokes your unconscious feelings that your son may take after his father &/or your previous partner.

My comments based on experience ? ‘fraid so.

For the sake of your grandchild, if not yourself, you need to move mother & baby on to the local support services. That you seem to be avoiding engaging fairly & squarely with your son, & have downplayed or dodged being honest about the situation with your partner - after all, this is not a tiff - suggests to me that this is much more complex for you than you may realise.

Of course, I could be wildly off piste.
Please excuse me if so.

I strongly urge closing down the option of ‘staying long-term’. This will not solve the problem or make your grandchild’s life sustainably safer or better.

Engaging with the local WA & DV support is essential because there are well established protocols, guidelines & legal obligations on the support agencies & local services to support the abused, abuser (indeed so) & vulnerable children. Dodging or ducking police attention if required is a grave mistake.

To be completely blunt & forthright @LibbyR, as much as you are kind, fair, reasonable & well-meaning, you are the alleged abuser’s mother which muddies the waters in many ways. The young mother’s background that you have described suggests that she is vulnerable - dare I generalise widely to say, possibly very insecure & unconsciously manipulative- & by no means excusing your son’s actions or blaming the victim, this is their relationship & not your responsibility. The coming days could see them reconcile & then your kindness will belong to a period of time they may choose to overlook, for you to be yourself pushed away & kept from your grandchild. Do I speak from experience? ‘fraid so.

Oh, & I have to ask, what is your son’s account?
Has he incurred abuse or injuries?

You need to keep yourself well, boundaries strong, & neutral in approach.
Getting WA & DV support agencies engaged is urgent & important.

I don't believe the only option is to return...ever! There are women`s aid hostels and victim support bodies. You haven't said about her staying long term with you..is this an option?.
Your son deserves a prison sentence, but only if his girl fronts it out. The abuse will not go away.

It`s awful all round...but should not be allowed to continue.

Thanks for commenting again GrannySquare. It's a truly challenging area, for workers as well as for loved one's. I agree with you about keeping boundaries strong.

LibbyR, the information about your grandsons mother's background clarifies her reluctance to approach children's services. I hope things continue to go as smoothly as they can. Don't hesitate to contact children's services if she does return