Cougars - not the four legged type

In the U.K I know several couples who married under the Sharia Law, it is a binding ceremony for the couples under the Islamic ruling, the man will go to the mosque with several men and the woman stays at the house with her family/friends. The Holy man does the prayers and ceremony in the mosque with the men and then telephones the woman at the house, that's it they are married.
In the U.K for this to be recognized as U.K marriage the couple will then have to have an English ceremony at a registery office and get U.K documents if they want to.
I do not know anything about financial side of things or how property or anything else is distributed if they separate.
If they have done the U.K ceremony then it will be handled just like any other divorce that people can get.

Totally agree with everhything you say GSM. However, small steps. When (if) she does bjuy a small property out in Egypt she means for him to have it after she dies. It is her English property and money that she wants to go to her son and her other sons children. I have told her that I am not certain whether or not an English court would even overlook a later dated will, and she needs to check this out also.

I was very careful not, in any way, to badmouth this young man - did say that his thrice daily contacting her did ring some alarm bells, She came up with a reason (excuse for that.

Slowly slowly, will work with her, but the most important thing is that she protects her wishes for her son and g.children.

That’s good news Fran. She can make a new will in favour of her sons as regards her property in England but I have no idea if she will be able to leave any property abroad to them. She really needs a solicitor who knows about Sharia law. If she sees a solicitor to make a new will she can ask if he can put her in touch with one who can explain what, if anything, she can do to protect her property under Sharia law, here and abroad. Often in Islamic countries everything a woman has belongs to her husband.
She also needs to be wary of this man being able to claim that he is financially dependent on her and trying to challenge the English will on that basis - i.e. not give him money. If he intends to come here to look after her I assume he doesn’t have a job? I can’t help feeling that this man and his family have set her up but well done for getting through to her and keeping the friendship. You should have been a diplomat!

Think you deserve a very nice lunch after the efforts to help Fran. You have gone above and beyond and hope this lady appreciates what you have done. Well done for persisting.

I did manage to have a chat with her yesterday, and explained about Sharia law marriages. It explained why her friend came home and told her son that she was married to this lad. Also explains why he refers to her as his 'wife', and she told me his parents (both younger than her), also say she is now family/

She was alarmed but is going to a solicitor next week to have her will re-dated so this it will be 'after' any such marriage. I hope this will be enough.

She took it all well and really accepted that it was being told to her in her best interests. She was very thankful, wants to take me lunch one day next week as a Thank You.

In a few weeks time she is having a knee replacement operation, and naturally wants to ensure that all legalities are firmly in place prior to this.

Oh dear red flags are flying here. I hope someone can convince her that it definitely sounds like a scam.

Under Sharia law a couple only have to declare that they are married in front of two male witnesses Spore. It was the same in England many years ago.

Franbern

It is (I now believe), with whether or not she is 'married' to him under Sharia law

Does she has an Egyptian marriage certificate to prove that she is legally married to him?

If she does not have a marriage certificate then no marriage has taken place.

Obviously how you spend your time and energy is your own business but I'd advise you not to become over-invested in this woman's future, particularly as you've only known her a short time. She's already sapped the energy and patience of her son and other friends.

After you've pointed out that her Sharia-law marriage could be valid and have legal consequences I'm afraid I'd leave her to it.

Let her get on with it. You are pointing out all the pitfalls.
Just make sure you are there to pick up the pieces if it goes wrong and don't say "I told you so".

You have done all you can franbern, your friend seems determined so if she continues with this despite your efforts, it will not be because she didn’t know the possible consequences.

Callistemon - But this is NOT the case of someone being scammed by someone she has never met. My friend has indeed met and been with this young man for some time, and met his parents and extended family, been to his home, etc. etc. She is working hard at the moment in trying to get a visa for him to come here for an extended visit.

It is nothing to do with a fool and his money etc. (rather a nasty mantra). It is (I now believe), with whether or not she is 'married' to him under Sharia law - and if so, how this effects the property and money she has in UK which, she thinks, is safeguarded under the terms of her Will here.

Do not think she will accuse me of jealousy - I am ten years older than her, am fortunate, that I have good relations with all my five AC and many g.children, and am obviously for all to see very happy with my life. She did accuse the friend she had been away with who she knew was also 'interested' in this young man.

However, we all know that it is difficult for anyone to admit they may have been wrong in any situation - and she so desperately wants this situation to be totally above board. I have given a lot of consideration as to how I will approach this matter of the Sharia marriage to her - and hopefully I will get it right, enough to warn her, without alienating her.

Well, I thought swampy's advice about suggesting the friend looks at the Age UK site was quite helpful.

However, the friend is not going to take any notice of anyone, she is flattered that a younger man finds her attractive and is blinded by love.

She'll probably accuse you of being jealous, Franbern!

Thanks Fran. Anything I can do. If only people would read all the posts before wading in.

Swampy your comments are totally irrelevant. You have not read the thread, and have jumped in very late thinking you know the background which is totally incorrect.

Many thanks to GSM who has really helped with advice about the legalilities.

swampy, do read the thread!

Maybe you could point her in the direction of AgeUK who have a useful section on scams/being scammed.
She sounds lonely if she believes that this is a loving relationship with someone in another country who she has never physically met.
But ultimately it is her money and her life but a fool and his/her money are soon parted.

I agree there is no point shaming her or telling her she is being unreasonable, especially as she sounds needy. The advicr to concentrate on the practical issues [her will and possessions] is spot on.

Think I will advice her to update her will. So, it will be dated later than any date of what may have been a shariah marriage. Thanks GSM.

It is difficult I have only known her a short time. One son she has been estranged from for a long time, do not know the reasons behind that, although she does have some sort of relationship with that sons' two children. The second son, she has only fallen out with in the last few weeks due to his concern about this relationship with this boy. (Sorry, to me a 30-year is not much more than a boy!!!). I does seem that the more people try to ward her about what is happening, the more she tries to convince herself as to how genuine it all is.

She IS lonely, does repeat this often. She want someone to be attentive to her and give her loving company. I suppose we all want that to some degree, but she feels she gets it from him. He contacts her three times each day and she loves that (to me that in itself is a little wierd and suspicious).

Provided she can properly protect her home in UK and any money she has from him as she want that to go to her g.children on her death, then if she can get a year or two of this 'affection' cannot see the harm in it.

I don't know what you can do, Franbern as she seems determined and is not listening to the voices of reason from you or her sons.

I wouldn't say she is a cougar, a cougar would be well aware of the pitfalls of such a relationship and savvy, but your friend sounds as if she has naïvely fallen into the trap that other lonely women fell into.

There are reports of others who have seen the folly of this, perhaps you could show her but she may have to find out the hard way, unfortunately.

It's not just women who are targeted, older men can fall victim too.

Perhaps the best you can do is to advise her to make a new will benefiting her children as possibly the existing one is no longer valid. I would also suggest giving her children power of attorney but it may be best not to mention that in case she gives it to this man.

Egypt is one of the countries that allows polygamy, so it would be possible for him to marry for money and also take a younger wife if he hasn't already. Maybe she knows all this already and is still willing to go ahead..

OMG - so much now falls into place. She was out in Egypt where she met this man for about three months, with a couple of English female friends. When she came back, one of them informed her son that she was married and had been giving money to this young man.

Her son then had a go at his Mum, who told him that it was ridiculous to say she was married and her friends was just trying to make trouble because she was jealous. Obviously has no idea about the fact that she could well be married under Shariah law.

She denied having given any money - but as time has gone on has said she has given him cash for certain things, (putting roof on house, to get his driving licence, paying off a small debt.) Now back in Uk she has sent him money for a visa to come here, cash for plane ticket to come here (and i now suspect other small payments)_She sees it as helping him out, says she loves his family who is very welcoming to her (I bet).

Up to now I have felt the best support I could give her was to listen to her (and she does talk about it endlessly), and that provided UK house and money was protected, then not much harm could be done.

It was only yesterday she came out about these wedding rings and told me how he calls her his wife.
and
Now, I am concerned........and not quite sure what I should be doing. She so wants to believe that she has it right and there is a real relationship between her and this man forty years her junior. She is unhappy and lonely = see her future as being able to spend four to five months each year in his country = even the fact that he has now given up his job (to work on the building work at his families house!!) is not ringing any alarm bells as she does not want to hear them. She wants to set him up in his own shop, where , when she is in the country she sees herself spending the time assisting him. She wants to buy a small flat there to stay in those months each year she is thee and for him to live on/look after the rest of the time.

When I next see her, I will need to (very carefully) broach this thing about shariah law marriages It seems as if her friends had it pretty correct when she reported about the marriage. And, that is why this young man refers to her as his wife. I do not want to burst her bubble - not sure if she will even believe me.

I had a quick look online. Not exactly legal research, but best I can do. As Callistemon days, for a valid marriage abroad under Sharia law, the parties only have to declare they are married in front of two male witnesses, and such a marriage contracted abroad (not in the UK) will be recognised under English law. I assume that means the English will would be revoked. Does your friend realise how easily a valid Sharia law marriage can be contracted? Has she already done that? A physical relationship between unmarried people would be illegal under Sharia law but they seem to be lovers from what you say. As it would, as pascal says, not be usual for a Moslem man to have a relationship with a non-Moslem in Islamic countries, I can only think that he and his family have an ulterior motive. It’s sad that your friend has fallen out with her son over this - he seems to have far more common sense than she does.

I am surprised he would consider being with a non-muslim woman, and wonder if he actually already married. He's no doubt delighted that he will be getting a house for his family..

It's all rather improbable in terms of a long term relationship..