Adam and Eve??

We're all entitled to our beliefs. Classifying them as fairytales isn't respectful.

On the contrary, I respect anyone's right to believe in whatever they choose. All I'm saying is that I place no more faith in religion than I do in fairy tales. That's my belief.

Elegran

They don't tell you that one in Sunday School.

Oh, they did I was sent to the Vestry for asking the same question aged 15. That was the end of my religious education in Chapel. I did enjoy my O Level R.E which was all about the stories in Genesis and further books until we came to David. and the archaeology etc. which "might" support or dispute this.

The Adam and Eve story was a total invention by the later Church. In the original Hebrew, it was never about man and woman at all. an invention, like so many others in te Bible, to demonize women.

I'd choose a slow nihilistic death over believing in fairy tales...

I place no more faith in religion than I do in fairy tales.

Not the same thing.

For me Volver just for me thinking myself as just an animal infesting the earth would be nihilistic. I have no desire to impose my understandings on others why would I. But this is a Spiritual forum where mystery magic other worldly thinking can be explored and expressed.

Nihilistic's a funny word to use. Does it mean "meaningless"? Life without the supernatural isn't meaningless. It's just lived now, not expecting some as yet unseen force to give us jam tomorrow.

But yes, this is a spiritual/religion forum and of course everyone is absolutely free to believe what they like (I hope that doesn't sound sarcastic, it's not meant to be). But let's take the big bang. What's more enthralling than a sudden burst of energy that creates a whole universe for us to inhabit? One that can give rise to organic life, as well as everything else. That's much more exciting than any recourse to the supernatural could ever be.

For me Volver just for me thinking myself as just an animal infesting the earth would be nihilistic
Me too. I believe we are so much more.

We're not though. Whatever you believe. 🤷🏼

But what you choose to believe Volver is no more the Truth than those who believe otherwise. Your asserting the impossible. But its not an issue, you are are in your words an animal infesting the planet nothing more, so be it.

We all are Stormystar. I wouldn't have chose the word "infesting", but I'm not going to argue with it.

My mistake it was Hetty 58 who said we were just animals infesting the earth. How how can you make assertion on what’s constitutes the “truth” that is rooted in just your own opinion.

And Volver there’s nothing to argue about it’s only our individual subjective reality. Not a right or wrong good or bad.

No arguing from me here.

volver

We're not though. Whatever you believe. 🤷🏼

That's your belief Volver. You don't know.

From a split second after the Big Bang, it isn't just our subjective reality. Traces were left of everything that happened since that cataclysm. The universe expanded and is expanding still, and if you run it backwards in time there is nothing before then. Time (the fourth dimension, which we live comfortably in without noticing it) did not exist before that.

What happened after it took far longer than we imagine. See the timeline chart. The bare uninhabited earth (and all the other planets round all the other suns in the universe) coalesced from the meeting of fragments of whatever it was that blew up so spectacularly, and gradually weathered and changed until it became more or less as it is today. Fragments of dust and chemicals combined in the mix of hydrogen and oxygen that formed water until minute specks of life developed and themselves combined into more complicated organisms until there were plants. All this took more long eras of time. There were still no animals for a long time, and no humans until a lot later. We are animals, yes. We have animal bodies and our brains still have evidence of our animal origins.We have one special power - our ability to think abstractly and to communicate our thoughts to one another, and to record those thoughts so that they can be communicated directly to others even when we are not present. Right now we are doing exactly that online.

flexbooks.ck12.org/cbook/ck-12-middle-school-life-science-2.0/section/4.12/primary/lesson/timeline-of-evolution-ms-ls/

I also think that there is a tendency to view atheism as life without meaning, when it is anything but, I dont want to turn into Ricky Gervais here but there are many ways to find meaning without God. Meaning in our connections to others, meaning in nature, meaning in trying to do the right thing.
No it's no good I sound ridiculous

Atheism can be a positive decision rather than simply a rejection of religion.

Despite some fundamentalist Christians' wacky ideas Bible stories like Adam & Eve were not meant literally. At most they were attempts to explain alleged events to an uneducated population. Don't waste time trying to make them fit a literal interpretation?

If you take a look at other civilisations and cultures, all of them attempt to satisfy human curiosity about how they began. It was obvious to them how their group continued and increased, but how did it all start?

The first creative beings were usually female ones, because new life came from women giving birth. The men didn't always go along with that, which led to the male deities. These were generally more aggressive and demanded more obedience and worship, of course, When Adam disobeyed ( though he managed to blame it on Eve) humans were chucked out of their Eden paradise and forced to toil for a living, and, for women, to bring forth children in agony.

Belief in God basically is belief there is order not chaos. Genesis I tells it poetically. You cannot interpret Genesis I as if it were some sort of science. It's poetic language.

Luckygirl3

Atheism can be a positive decision rather than simply a rejection of religion.

Indeed it can Luckygirl. I am a positive humanist and love and appreciate my life, and believing this is the only life I have makes it even more worthwhile and precious to me. I respect those who have religious beliefs as long as they do not cause harm.

I think I am very much on Volver’s wavelength that science and its methods of critical enquiry, logical reasoning and empirical evidence is a more reliable way of understanding our world than the work of a supernatural creator.

Absolutely Farzanah you have found for yourself what constitutes love of life. Others have discovered it through science and spirituality. How wonderful.

We all must find our own path.

Grantanow

Despite some fundamentalist Christians' wacky ideas Bible stories like Adam & Eve were not meant literally. At most they were attempts to explain alleged events to an uneducated population. Don't waste time trying to make them fit a literal interpretation?

I get that.

But why, if these were attempts to explain the world to an uneducated population, do people still stand and spout this nonsense and then all say "This is the word of the lord"? - this is what happens in Christian churches.

We all go to the cathedral carol service each year as the choir is beautiful and the acoustics quiet marvellous. But still the old nonsense in the readings: women to blame for evil stands out! People stand up and read this stuff!