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Religion/spirituality

Who has the right to forgive?

(37 Posts)
Nanadogsbody Sun 07-Oct-12 09:55:36

Forgive and forget? I find it easier to forgive people who have hurt me than I do to forget what they did or said. Yes, you can let go of the hurt, but not the memory of the hurt - that can linger.
But I think that we forgive less when someone has hurt someone we love as in the case of greatnan. I don't think I could ever forgive someone who hurt any of my family. I certainly can't, forgive a god if s/he actually existed.

janeainsworth Sun 07-Oct-12 09:42:58

It is interesting greatnan that you say you feel no need to forgive your daughter because you don't hold her responsible.
"Father forgive them for they know not what they do".
That is the point I think.
How much more difficult to forgive someone who has knowingly caused hurt and damage and have no remorse.

absentgrana Sun 07-Oct-12 09:42:25

petallus Could it be a mixture of emotional response and intellectual decision?

petallus Sun 07-Oct-12 09:33:08

I don't think forgiving someone is a matter of intellectual decision. Not if the forgiveness is going to be more than just skin deep. If it involves feelings as well, it either happens or it doesn't, just like other emotions.

Greatnan Sun 07-Oct-12 09:26:41

Thank you, Grannyknot - it did seem the most suitable place.
The only person who has really hurt me is one that I love dearly and forgiveness would not really be needed, as I don't hold her responsible for her actions. On the other hand, I do not find it easy to forgive a man who hurt my daughter, even though she has moved on and is now very happy. She does not know that I harbour great resentment towards him and she would just say 'Let it go, Mum - he is his own worst enemy'. I would like to reply 'Not as long as I am alive' but I just avoid any mention of him.

Grannyknot Sun 07-Oct-12 09:07:29

Maybe greatnan posted it here because the thread heading is 'Religion and spirituality ...

Lilygran Sun 07-Oct-12 09:01:33

It is interesting that Greatnan has chosen to post this in this thread. Is forgiveness restricted to people of faith? Certainly, the OP says that it was after she 'found religion' that she felt moved to forgive. But others also feel moved to forgive. I'm inclined to agree with the other posters; you can't forgive people for offences against other people and forgiveness often brings more benefit to the one who forgives. Especially if the perpetrator is not contrite!

Grannyknot Sun 07-Oct-12 09:00:42

Forgiveness is for the benefit of the forgiver IMHO. I've heard it described as letting go of the hurt. And conversely, resenting someone and being bitter towards someone, is like you drinking poison, and expecting the other person to die.

baubles Sun 07-Oct-12 08:34:56

I suspect forgiveness is for the benefit of the forgiver, it may be what they need to do in order to live their lives. I'm not even sure that I understand fully what forgiveness means in this context as the circumstances are so out with my experience.

absentgrana Sun 07-Oct-12 08:30:10

She cannot forgive them on her sister's behalf. Paradoxically, only her sister would have the right to forgive them for murdering her and clearly is in no position to do so. The surviving sister, presumably, can forgive them for the pain that their actions have caused her.

In general, I don't think offenders have to show remorse to be forgiven by those who have suffered from their actions if the sufferers want to forgive. However, I should probably find it hard to forgive someone who was not remorseful. Equally, forgiveness cannot be automatic just because someone is remorseful. I am inclined to agree that if someone harmed a member of my family, let alone murdered them, my wrath would know no bounds.

In practice, any offences against me have been slight and unimportant in the big scheme of things. I haven't necessarily forgiven the perpetrators, but can't be bothered to brood over them or, indeed, even call them to mind.

I am still unsure whether forgiveness is really for the benefit of the forgiver, the forgiven or both.

janeainsworth Sun 07-Oct-12 08:29:40

I would never forgive anyone either greatnan.
But to answer your question, I would say that the sister has the right to forgive the Wests for the injury and distress caused to herself.
But she doesn't have the right to forgive on behalf of the murder victims and all the other people who suffered at the hands of the Wests.

Greatnan Sun 07-Oct-12 08:16:44

On Sunday on Radio 4 this morning, the sister of one of the girls murdered by the Wests told how she had found religion and decided to forgive them.
They never showed any remorse, and when she wrote to them they told her to get lost. I wonder if her sister would have wanted them to be forgiven? I certainly would never forgive anybody who harmed one of my family - it would feel like betrayal if I did.
I would be interested to hear the views of both believers and atheists on this issue.