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Struggling with my Christian belief

(307 Posts)
hapgran Sun 19-Mar-17 17:06:44

I am a practicing Christian, but becoming increasingly upset with the thought that, if I am to believe in hell, then that is where my non-believing children and grandchildren are going. I think this could turn me away from my faith as I can't bear it. Any thoughts out there..?!

Anniebach Wed 22-Mar-17 14:41:11

I have never, ever felt superior , no idea what it's like to experience it.

Jayanna9040 Wed 22-Mar-17 14:43:25

Ha, ha, ha ha, ha.......

Luckygirl Wed 22-Mar-17 14:56:53

What intrigues me about all this is the number of believers who have "problems" of one sort or another with their faith; or aspects of it; or characters within the plot of their texts etc.

If it is so problematical, then why engage with it? - why not just expend that energy and time in spreading happiness, helping a neighbour etc.?

Just seems quite extraordinary to me.

vampirequeen Wed 22-Mar-17 18:26:52

Anniebach, I'm confused what you found offensive about this post about Mary.

^I can't get my head around the insipid version of Mary we're always given.

She was unmarried and pregnant in a society which condemned such women to death yet she managed to survive. Then after travelling whilst heavily pregnant she gave birth in a stable, had to escape to and live as a refugee in Egypt, bring up a child who, according to the Gospel of Thomas (one of those not in the Bible), showed off his miraculous abilities in a most irritating and at times dangerous ways and was incredibly arrogant and finally watch him be tortured to death on the cross.

Any women who could survive all that could never have been the insipid 'perfect' woman that men want us to believe.^

Please explain to me which part of this insults or disrespects Mary.

Anniebach Wed 22-Mar-17 18:37:47

Vampirequeen, I read it as you putting down nurturing women, and you seemed to be describing modern day women of the middle east , if I didn't understand what you were trying to say I am sorry, just how it seemed to me

Spot Fri 24-Mar-17 12:08:40

Hapgran, my first response is that actually, Hell has its positives! The book of Revelation was written without chapters and if you read through from "chapter" 20:12 to "chapter" 21:4 you will see there is a connection between the wicked, death and sheol being thrown into the lake of fire, and the New Heaven and Earth where there is no more death and God will personally wipe away our tears with His hand. He can't do it till then. If there was no judgement and no hell, this awful world-order with all its pain and suffering and injustice would go on forever!
My second response is: why have you decided your friends and family are all going to hell? Pray for them! That's probably what you are there for.

Anniebach Fri 24-Mar-17 12:37:32

He hath shown thee o man what is good . and what doeth the Lord require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God.

Micah 6.8.

TriciaF Fri 24-Mar-17 13:13:34

There's a view that if non believers keep the 7 Noachide laws they will be 'saved.' ie
Do not murder.
Do not steal.
Do not worship false gods.
Do not be sexually immoral.
Do not eat a limb removed from a live animal.
Do not curse God.
Set up courts and bring offenders to justice

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 18:57:12

Believing the Old Testament does not make one a Christian , to be a Christian one must believe in the virgin birth &that Jesus is the son of God, whom God sent to show the new ways of God because according to the scriptures God had changed his mind about insisting that everyone should be rising up to smote each other !!!

Anniebach Fri 24-Mar-17 20:21:02

Where does Christ say - you must believe in the virgin birth ?

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 20:39:34

He didn't!

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 20:47:19

It's comes from the disciples after he appeared to them after he had been crufied & was resurrected ,his message was that the way to God was through him & that required one to believe that he was born of the Virgin Mary & Died on the cross to save our souls' God said the way to me is through my son who came through the Virgin Mary &a died on the cross . ' just reiterating from bible studies etc not necessarily my beliefs but it is what is written

nina1959 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:14:14

Being a Christian all hinges on your faith in Jesus. If you believe that Jesus died to save you from persecution because of your sins, then you are saved. The OT was the God breathed word of God through Moses and the prophesy that Jesus would arrive. Christianity did not exist before the NT because Christ hadn't arrived. Even Jesus wasn't a Christian. He was a Jew. Christianity began with his birth (Christ) but mostly it was the Gentiles that believed because the Jews of the OT rejected Jesus. They had him crucified.
You cannot be accepted into eternal life without faith which translates into belief in Jesus. But you also need to prove this faith by good works. This goes hand in hand ie, if you believe you are naturally a good person willing to do good works.
This thinking sifts out those who say they believe but don't follow through with their hearts.

In the end, it's what's in your heart that matters. That's what God can see and God is about love, not anger.
But to get the eternal life in Heaven, God insists that you believe in Jesus and that his life and death were to free you from further persecution.
Read correctly, you can see that it's a love story between God and you. He wants you to accept him but not superficially by just doing lip service.
The bible and the ten commandments are a code of how to live a moral life. I can't see anything wrong in this but it's not easy for people to see it this way.
Most religions have the same core of understanding, just different ways of getting there.

In my bible dating back to the 1850's, there is a message. I think it's Leviticus. It reads 'I am the Lord your God. You are My tenant. I am your Landlord.
It speaks volumes to me about how we treat our lives, those around us and our planet.

vampirequeen Fri 24-Mar-17 21:21:56

How do you know this is what he said? The gospels were written years after the events. Oral tradition is notorious for adding bits to stories (human nature to make a story more interesting) and what were the agendas of the people who wrote the stories down. If you read the four gospels you'll find they tell the stories from different angles and it's generally accepted that they were not written by the Apostles they were named after.

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:24:25

No one knows , that's why there are so many arguments ,because there are no facts it's all about faith & believing .

nina1959 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:27:42

Vampirequeen, I am C of E brought up, bible read, and also have read many of the certified documents by academics of theologians and professors. There is scientific proof of the scriptures and geological proof of events such as the great flood at the time of Noah.
I'm not going to dispute the findings of those who have studied for years that the bible is grounded in truth. You can. But I prefer not to.

Anniebach Fri 24-Mar-17 21:27:43

norose, diciple or Apostle and which one ?

nina1959 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:29:26

Norose, people do know. They're called academics and geologists.

nina1959 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:30:43

Whether we know or not, that's why it's called FAITH!

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:32:33

My point exactly !!!!!

nina1959 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:35:03

It was the silent majority of Christians that voted to leave the EU.

lordashcroftpolls.com/2016/06/how-the-united-kingdom-voted-and-why/

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:37:53

Anniebach , some of the 'disciples' became 'apostles ' after the death & resserection of Jesus

nina1959 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:47:01

Norose, disciple means 'to follow'. They couldn't follow him once he was gone, which was 40 days after his resurrection.
Apostle means that after this, they became his messenger or envoy. They spread the word on His behalf. Acts in the NT explains this.

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:50:05

Yes exactly

norose4 Fri 24-Mar-17 21:51:48

They continued to 'follow 'his teachings as apostles & to write up his teachings which some people endeavour to follow to this day