Blasphemy

Most definitely MOnica. Trump tee shirts, Jeremy tee shirts .

Blasphemy should never be a crime. People are entitled to their own opinions, and punishing people who don't agree with your view of the great sky fairy is ludicrous! And so very wrong!

knickas, your use of language puts you on the first step of the road that leads to to events like those in Pakistan and the actions of extremist political movements.

It begins when individuals used contemptuous words to label other people's political and religious beliefs.

MOnica, yes ok I accept there are extremists on all sides. We're living in interesting times aren't we.
And yes, I agree with your criticism of knickas63's use contemptuous words to babe other people's political and religious beliefs.

Which is more barbaric ? The death penalty or religious extremism where thousands are killed in the name of religion ?

Iam I don't understand what you don't understand! I listen to the BBC and they say 'so called' which sounds to me like it is not PC to call them what they want to be called. Political correctness is not necessarily a derogatory expression, it means saying what is acceptable in the same was as a friend used to be 'mixed race' but is now 'dual heritage'.

Do you disagree that there are parts of the Muslim communities with no tolerance for any views but their own? Really? Sorry, don't understand the relevance of Trump to this subject, it is about religious intolerance in Pakistan.

Nonnie Trump is relevant in this context because his brand of populism and his exhortations against the group of South Americans marching towards the border, and his (overturned) decision to ban anyone of the muslim faith from entering the country unless they had first been intensively checked to see if they were extremists, is the start of a road to populist extremism.

There was a very interesting program on R4 last night called 'How to kill a democracy' (available as a podcast. www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006r4vz/episodes/downloads ) examining how demodracy is being destroyed in many countries by subtle voter and voting manipulation. Much of what was discussed there is relevant to this discussion, even though not overtly about blasphemy.

The post from knickas is a perfect example of the intolerance in Pakistan.

EllenVannin Most religious wars result from the use of religion to justify other causes. The problems in Ireland grew from the Flight of the Earls in 1607. These men owned most of what is now Ulster/Northern Ireland. Their lands were forfeited and the British government advertised throughout Britain for protestant settlers to go their and offered free grants of land. The local people objected to this and the battle started. As time went by the only way a settler could be identified was, generally, by a Scottish surname (most of the settlers were Scottish) and their religion.

I am of Northern Irish descent and at one time worked with someone from Northern Ireland (Scottish name, protestant). The whole time I worked with him he kept trying to puzzle out and constantly referred to the fact that I had a NI Scottish name - but was a catholic. To him it just didn't make sense.

Boku Haram in Nigeria came from the problems of nomadic herders dealing with the expansion of farming and increasing drought in their usual grazing grounds. The herders are muslim, the farmers usually belong to other religions.

Saudi Arabia uses its conservative Wahabism to control its own population and expand it's power in the middle east by encouraging extremist Islam in other countries with more tolerant views. From this extremism came ISIS.

I could go on.

Religion does not have to be medieval. It is such a pity that Islam, and certain sections of Christianity and Judaism, cannot seem to rid themselves of medieval superstitions like genital mutilation or blasphemy.

Nonnie, so far as my comment about Trump supporters goes, MOnica's comments are correct.

To answer your question about whether I'm suggesting there aren't parts of the Muslim community with no tolerance of views other than there own. No one could deny that there are parts of the Muslim community who are intolerant of the views of others who don't see the world in the way they do. I introduced Trump because watching his rallies give me the chills. His supporters seem totally intolerant of anyone who doesn't see the world the way they do.

Thank you for the explanation Iam I think if you read your post again you will see why it felt like you were getting at me. I hope that was not your intention.

I don't believe I was getting at you Nonnie. I didn't understand what you meant by suggesting Isis may have another 'PC name'. My reference to Mr Trump was intended to point out that not only some Muslim communities, but some American Evangelical Christian communities like those who support Trump, don't accept that others have a right to see the world differently.

No * M0nica* just no ?

There are similar issues in many parts of the world but I suppose you can focus wherever you like. I prefer to stick to the OP rather than randomly wander off referring to another particular country.

Re Trump and religion - I have just read a book entitled "Why Christians can't be Democrats". To be honest, I skip-read it - it is the longest and most boringly repetitive sermon I have ever come across.

However, it did clarify just why Trump has such support among US Christians, who you would have thought would approve all the things he and his party are busy dismantling.

Apparently, the state providing assistance, food and healthcare for those who can't manage it for themselves is going against God's laws. That is because it is being paid for using money which has been taken by force in taxes, instead of being charity, donated freely and with love by those who follow scripture. Under God's rule there is free will, and people can reject being "good", but under man's rule they must do as the state commands. The author says that although the right is not perfect, it allows individuals to give if they wish to or not give if they don't, and be moral if they wish to or immoral if they don't, while the left usurps the power of God by forcing equality and morality on everyone.

God help America.

God help America.
I think I quoted on another thread words from the Statue of Liberty:
“Give me your tired, your poor
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.”

Perhaps a petition should be started to allow the poor woman to come to Britain where she could attend church in peace.

Or perhaps letters could be sent to Imran Khan asking him to intervene, but could this lead to him being in danger himself?

Interesting Elegran. thank you.

They are right, we have free will, we can choose to be selfish, to be racist, to cross on the other side, to ignore the teachings of Christ, but I fail to see how anyone can be a Christian and ignore his teachings .

In a country where it is the norm for those who can afford it, or who receive it as part of their work, to take out healthcare insurance, how can they complain about the state doing almost that same thing - collecting "insurance" in taxes from those who have, to help those who have nothing?

Because it removes the warm glow of righteousness?
I knew a (very rich) female US surgeon who was very quick to tell us of the one morning a week she gave to free surgery for the poor, but was dead against any version of the NHS - "Socialist medicine" - being instigated in the States. She has since given up general surgery for cosmetic operations, as it is more profitable. I don't know whether she does that pro bono too, probably not, it is unneccessary for "the poor".

All she did was take a drink of water on a hot day but it seems that the women shared a cup and said that it meant that they couldn't now drink.
She spent 9 years in jail for drinking a cup of water.
Prime Ministers in Pakistan often end up either murdered or in jail so Imran Khan has to be careful how he deals with this but he hopefully will take a longer view and try to change the education.
If it proves to be true that Saudi Arabia has stopped funding madrassas that may help. Pakistan still has to deal with the Taliban many of whom went to Pakistan as a result of the 'big surge' by the US.
What has happened to her is horrifying and she must be terrified but Khan has an almost insurmountable job to civilise his country. Many people in Pakistan who would challenge this kind of behaviour have left the country instead. I don't think he should be judged on how he deals with this particular case because the police and army aren't particularly trustworthy and might not deal with the rioters in any other way.

Imran Khan has only been PM four months , he is not a dictator he is PM

Blasphemy .... It’s yet another medieval concept that has no place in today’s society. Some are religious, some are not, some feel the need to ram their opinions down others throats as a way of control and manipulation. This world needs to live and let live before we all destroy each other, so many hate filled extremists everywhere.

Works both ways Coconut how often atheists tell Christians what they should do

I agree Annibach I seem to spend a lot more time reading criticisms of faith from those who don't believe. In our Western society I rarely hear comments the other way round.