Are we moving backwards?

I agree with GillT, it is a way of controlling people and specifically women. It’s misogyny, at base, both in Afghanistan and in those weird Christian sects. Men are afraid of women.

Gwyneth

geekesse what are the positives of Sharia law?

1. The basis of Sharia is available to anyone who can read the Qur’an - very different to the complicated legal system of western democracies, where a complex web of written laws produced by legislatures over centuries mean that only highly trained lawyers can find out what the law says about an issue. If something isn’t clearly covered by the Qur’an, it may be decided by analogy with something that is.

2. The simple structure which underlines it - acts may be one of just five categories: compulsory, recommended, neutral, discouraged, forbidden.

3. The high standard of evidence required to prove a case. A single witness is insufficient.

4. Once a punishment has been carried out, the offender’s slate is wiped clean. There’s no such thing as a criminal record.

5. The social focus is on the good of the community rather than the character of the individual.

The BBC has a useful page on Sharia here.

I’m not suggesting that Sharia is perfect, or that some interpretations of it are not distasteful to me. But I think it’s important to understand that all legal systems have strengths and weaknesses, and Sharia is no exception.

For women, being able to find multiple witnesses when she has been raped is an almost impossible feat.

MissAdventure

For women, being able to find multiple witnesses when she has been raped is an almost impossible feat.

True. But then fewer than 1 in 60 rape cases lead to a charge in the English legal system: www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/23/fewer-than-one-in-60-cases-lead-to-charge-in-england-and-wales?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

True, but in the absence of witnesses to a rape, the woman can be accused of adultry, the penalty for which, in extreme religious fervour, can be stoning her to death.

Thank you JaneJudge.I thought I was been accused of racism by saying the Taliban are savages. I now realise I misunderstood.

For me, there are absolutely no positives with Sharia law. A system that allows a man to beat his wife, allows the death penalty in any form, that allows people’s hands or feet to be cut off, that requires multiple witnesses to a rape; I’m sorry, it’s not real justice. Plus allowing a man to divorce his wife without recourse to the law of the land is primitive. Sharia law is primitive.
People absolutely should have a criminal record if they commit crimes. How would we ensure offenders were not allowed to work with children, or patients, or vulnerable people if no records were kept. Ridiculous.

Religions in all its many forms is often shown to be the cause of conflict.

Whether we progress or regress depends on whether or not there are fixed values.
Luckygirl has listed items that are regressive, and items that are progressive. I think we all agree with her evaluation.

However the values that we hold in common are hard to compare as we can't quantify values.

What I can abstract from what Luckygirl mentions is that evildoers put ideologies before people.

I have just received an email from UNICEF asking me to contribute to help women and children in Afghanistan. Hope they send one to Joe Biden too!

25Avalon

I have just received an email from UNICEF asking me to contribute to help women and children in Afghanistan. Hope they send one to Joe Biden too!

But how long does it take to train the Forces, help the Government to stand on their own? NATO gave 7 years of help after combat forces withdrew and now this.
Should there be a NATO presence (it wasn't just the USA and UK) be in such countries for ever?

Should there be a peacekeeping force in every troubled state in the world on a permanent basis?

I can't help thinking about all the families in this country and the USA (and other countries) of soldiers who fought and lost their lives there. Futile - and all for what -for things to go back to how they were.

25Avelon
I prefer to give my money to a cause where I feel they can do some good. www.womensaid.org.uk/the-survivors-handbook/women-from-bme-communities/

What I can abstract from what Luckygirl mentions is that evildoers put ideologies before people.

I agree. Do we think that will ever change? Will ideology always win?

Thank you for your reply geekesse

Who can tell, Luckygirl. We who put people before ideologies have a hard task ahead.

25Avalon

I have just received an email from UNICEF asking me to contribute to help women and children in Afghanistan. Hope they send one to Joe Biden too!

Biden didn’t negotiate the withdrawal it is firmly at Trumps door

Biden didn’t negotiate the withdrawal it is firmly at Trumps door

This is certainly true but Biden, as the Financial Times reports, he certainly accelerated it. And he's gone so far as stating that "he has no regrets" in withdrawing troops support from Afghanistan. Whilst I would agree 100% that Trump was a stupied and dangerous pillock, Biden had the opportunity to rectify this particular Trmpism but didn't. Such was his belief that Afghanistan was able to maintain peace without US forces prescence, he even denied that there was any risk or likelihood that the Taliban would overrun the country. He was wrong there, wasn't he?

I’ve just posted on the other thread about Bidens decision.

Bottom line is that America is putting America first and for internal as well as external reasons Biden made the decision to continue with the withdrawal.

I am like many filled with horror at what will now happen, but, at the same time, I am not sure if I was leader of a country like USA that I would not have made the same decision, given the stuff that was on the table when making to this decision.

I am also not reading that Biden thought that peace would be maintained. I think it has always been recognised that Afghanistan would sink into perpetual civil war, bitumen I’m not sure that they thought that the Taliban would move so quickly.

When you look at that arrogant and self serving moron Trump and know that people actually chose him to be president do you wonder at the rest of their selfish and blinkered behaviour? Any reasonably intelligent person can look in the bible and use different tracts to support whatever they want to push forward. When Trump and co want to keep driving gas guzzling cars they go round saying what climate change? They care nothing for the rest of the world just want to do what they want to and if they dont like the truth and scientifically proved results just ignore them.

Sending foreign troops to Afghanistan has never been more than a sticking plaster, sadly. As these last few days have shown, unless the country is permanently under foreign armed control, it will revert. It is heartbreaking to say, but perhaps there is nothing the Western world can do.

I think civilisation has reached its peak for the time being and a combination of pandemic and climate change will preoccupy everyone at the expense of lifestyle and educational improvements, and may even leave us struggling for individual survival.

We may be 'going backwards'. Speaking of Afghanistan, foreign powers have been there so long, I don't think top Afghanis have the faintest idea of the work, and cost of creating a government that functions in any way - it's all been done by other people - governments and NGO's. No idea what will happen but we need to 'speak softly and carry a big stick' - both personally and as a country.

“the world is a comedy to those that think, and a tragedy to those that feel” ..... cannot recall who wrote this but it’s so true, and now more than ever. I personally feel that religion is just medieval and has no place in modern society, however, I do recognise that so many people gain comfort from it. Religion itself isn’t evil, it’s the evil that men do, in the name of religion, with their twisted variations that just leave me lost for words and full of despair if you allow yourself to dwell on it for too long.