Are we moving backwards?

doormouse

My very first post in here, and it’s horribly depressing ?

I’m very much afraid that we are seeing the gradual disintegration of western liberal democracies and the rise of new fascist movements all over the world.

A great deal of the disruptive and divisive material on social media is deliberately disseminated by Russian troll factories with the aim of destroying harmony and cohesion within western democratic cointries.

Gosh I am beginning to think exactly the same.

It does seem that democracy is under threat, that was one of the reasons that Biden made the decision he did, as it seemed that a large minority of ex- military from Afghanistan were/are joining the far right facist groups and are a real threat to democracy in the USA.

Democracy is weaker in the U.K. and I find it all so worrying.

The Taliban will remain what they have always been, religious fundamentalists, whose hardline interpretation of Islam/Shariah law will impact most negatively on women.
Christian fundamentalists in the States are no better although of course their impact is far less severe, at least while The Handmaid's Tale remains a work of fiction.

The Taliban have obviously been in waiting and as soon as the helping military from different countries disappeared,they struck.Its an abominable situation, those poor innocent people who will be the subject of unknown attrocities have no chance.
The world seems to be slowly going under, religion, fires, floods, heatwaves mostly of our doing.Its a sad world we live in.

Nannapat1

The Taliban will remain what they have always been, religious fundamentalists, whose hardline interpretation of Islam/Shariah law will impact most negatively on women.
Christian fundamentalists in the States are no better although of course their impact is far less severe, at least while The Handmaid's Tale remains a work of fiction.

No better? How many of these have you seen Christian fundamentalists advocating?

- The killing of people who leave Christianity (apostates)
- The throwing of people who have gay sex off the tallest building in the area
- Men to be able to have four wives but women only one husband
- Women to be covered up
- The penalty of crucifixion for the rather vague offence of ‘spreading mischief in the land’, which can be interpreted in various ways
- Second-class citizen status for non-Christians

Plus the violent subjugation of unbelievers. (For chapter and verse on all these teachings from the Islamic sources, see David Wood‘s videos on YouTube.)

I can see a certain difference myself.

Skye17, you might get a more balanced view of Islam and Sharia if you didn’t rely for your information on a Christian fundamentalist whose ‘ministry’, such as it is, acts as a platform for anti-Islam views. Ever heard the term ‘echo-chamber’?

geekesse

*Skye17*, you might get a more balanced view of Islam and Sharia if you didn’t rely for your information on a Christian fundamentalist whose ‘ministry’, such as it is, acts as a platform for anti-Islam views. Ever heard the term ‘echo-chamber’?

He is not the only source I have. However, I don’t think it would ever be fair to call him a fundamentalist. Why do you think he is one?

Don’t you think there are some things about Islam it’s good to be anti (selection listed above)?

Power hungry men. Too many of them getting away with it. Religious beliefs my a**e. Money and power, and humanity flies out the window

geekesse

*Skye17*, you might get a more balanced view of Islam and Sharia if you didn’t rely for your information on a Christian fundamentalist whose ‘ministry’, such as it is, acts as a platform for anti-Islam views. Ever heard the term ‘echo-chamber’?

Also, the passages he quotes are either in the Islamic sources or they’re not – whoever is quoting them. This is open for anyone to check.

geekesse If you don’t like David Wood, try Apostate Prophet on YouTube - an atheist ex-Muslim.

My question is this. How is it that the Taliban have taken over a whole country in less than a month with no apparent resistance? Is it because the male population of Afghanistan are actually sympathisers of this barbaric movement? If not why aren’t they fighting back? God help the women, children and those men with more enlightened ideas. My heart weeps.

I agree with the other Gransnets, their opinions of the
Talibans especially.

I expect you have all heard about the atrocities that happened in Plymouth last Thursday. Absolutely horrifying. The little three year old being shot whilst her Daddy tried to protect her. Becky will need all the help the counsellors can give her losing her husband and her little girl, both at the same time. The relatives and friends of all who were shot must be heartbroken and question ‘why’. May they Rest in Peace.

The Taliban have held sway in vast areas of Afghanistan for a long time, it was inevitable and understood by US this swift and total takeover would occur. The UK could not stay without US / EU support. I am disgusted with Biden - but then he’s a demented old man, a mere puppet. I’m with you Granny O this is; as always about money and power. And as always the unspeakable atrocities will be meted upon the women and children. It is truly heartbreaking

I feel that we are witnessing the beginning of the end.l am not religious but the natural catastrophes and man made ones, covid, global warming.The anger of man against man and the inhuman actions in the name of religion, and the emergence of China as a super power are all frightening factors.

Biden / Trump the writing was on the wall. The Afghan army have been trained for years with money and expertise .

I agree with ‘OldWoman70’ and a lot of the other contributors. My great-uncle, who was an experienced soldier in the Great War and fought in the British War in Afghanistan in 1919 always said with great emphasis ‘We should never go back into Afghanistan’. Our politicians unfortunately don’t read history. The only hope is that the spread of modern ideas though the Internet and outside contacts will eventually inspire the religious population of Afghanistan to throw the Taliban out and progress to a less medieval form of Islam, as a personal belief and separate from the Government and Administration. In the U.K. we too, are guilty of allowing religious beliefs to infiltrate our social and legal systems, not surprisingly to the detriment of women, e.g. polygamy, abortions of girl foetuses, and the wearing of the full-face Niqab. We should guard our freedoms with care.

Whoops Algerias!

Savages is the right word for thugs like the Taliban! Any ideology that permits their behaviour towards their human fellows in the 21st century is wrong, disgusting, abhorrent. They are worse, far worse than Fascists and I really, don't care to be called intolerant, racist, etc when it comes to these kind of ideologies. I find no excuse for their behaviour at all. A bunch murderers, rapists, terrorists, anti women, ... are not worth any respect. The right places for them are either prisons or high security mental hospitals and not in any government. The Afgan nation has been abandoned to be devoured by a bunch of criminals and insane group, and here we are helplessly watching it and feeling angry and upset! Soon it'll be off the screen and not a news any more. Not seeing it though doesn't mean it won't be there! It's a real human tragedy hard to believe that it's not to be tackled as Hitler was.

hi coconut. according to wikiquotes it was horace walpole, writer and politician (1717-1797) who said "I have often said, and oftener think, that this world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel — a solution of why Democritus laughed and Heraclitus wept."
so it's been going on for a long time, and maybe will forever.

Sadly what about the shooter in Plymouth who sadly killed those people and a beautiful little girl .He was on the internet and against women

pearl79, one of my university lecturers used to quote that quite a bit and I often think of it.

It’s all about interpretation isn’t it ? The Taliban are about control. Ignorant people are easier to handle, so education becomes the enemy. I can’t get past the hypocrisy of it all - western civilisation is vilified, but they’re happy to accept and utilise modern technology to further their ‘cause’. And I also feel truly, truly sorry for anyone who has lost a loved one in the armed forces - they must be going through hell all over again trying to make sense of what they died, given what’s happening now.

this post seems to have deteriorated into a slanging match of religion, culture, and perhaps race. not, i think, quite what the op was hoping for.

my own "halfpennyworth" is that war seems to have been a constant for a long time. it's how the rich get richer and ensure they get more than their fair share of "the spoils".
but how do you persuade a lot of sensible people, intent on living/enjoying their lives and feeding their families, to go to war? you use the strongest form of persuader; which has long been religion.
in other words: don't blame the religion for war and the awful things that are done in its name; blame the people who use the religion to their ends.
and note, now that religion is, for many, less of a persuader, there's that much-abused term "democracy". "we" fight (with words as well as guns) for the principle of democracy, and yet in its name our own version of "vote for trump and you get what you deserve" has given away many millions and even billions of pounds to his friends and supporters. whilst allowing the destruction of our home/planet to continue apace.
surely we need a completely new way to make decisions!

@Mistyfluff8. I think the Plymouth shooter was against women for a different reason. He was a member of an online ‘celibate’ community and his rants against women were mainly centred on the fact that he wasn’t having much success with them. I think the biggest factor in the Plymouth shooting was the massive error of returning his guns and firearms license, which were taken away because of his past mental health problems. His rants were out there for all to see, but reportedly no one in authority checked to see whether it was actually safe to restore his access.

GrandeTante wrote:

"The one is the fact that the scientific or more properly academic approach to religions as such that made such advances from about the 1860s was just that - an academic discipline that certainly attracted followers at the level of congregations and their ministers, priests, rabbis or imams, but equally made no impact on a vast number of followers of the various religions."

Religions' social functions don't include educating the faithful flock. The reason for this is that religions' functions do include supporting the status quo i.e. religions are always conservative. The more liberal religions such as the Quakers, the Sufis, or the Unitarians are minorities and are sometimes not recognised as religions by the traditional more authoritarian institutions.

I too have been upset today reading about the taliban advancing on Afghanistan and the horrible person from Plymouth who shot people dead, we are going backwards especially where women’s freedoms are concerned, very sad world we live in.