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Is Germany killing the environment to save it?

(13 Posts)
Bags Fri 15-Mar-13 11:24:45

Ecologists in Germany seem to think so. Supporters of "green energy" disagree.

Galen Fri 15-Mar-13 11:29:18

I'm a great supporter of nuclear I'm afraid.

Mishap Fri 15-Mar-13 11:50:55

This whole topic is so difficult for non-scientists like me. Who to believe for goodness' sake?!

There are so many firmly held views flying around and we are told one thing one day and another the next. One problem is that it is almost regarded as a heresy not to be on the eco-bandwagon; and questioning and trying to understand both sides is fraught with difficulty.

A dear friend of mine is championing a "transition group" (I'm not sure what this title is about) which is basically pushing for eco-friendly policies and local action. But how do we know which are truly eco-friendly?

Even the greens are now espousing nuclear as the least bad option.
And my ecologist SIL rejects recycling as pointless.

Children on school have the eco message rammed down their throats in an unquestioning way - it has replaced original sin as the favoured guilt trip.

As I say - who to believe?

I just try and reduce wastage - but then our generation have always done that anyway.

Tegan Fri 15-Mar-13 11:53:19

Isn't this the Germany that closed down their own nuclear plants but were quite happy to buy nuclear power from other countries?

Butty Fri 15-Mar-13 11:56:25

Whenever my German friend goes home to visit, she returns with tales of beautiful landscapes being ruined by 'green energy' initiatives. Wind, solar and biogas all leaving their mark, along with the proposals of more high energy power lines. She views it as inevitable, with the expected closure of all nucelar power plants.

Bags Fri 15-Mar-13 12:32:16

Logically, anyone who is afraid of carbon dioxide should be in favour of nuclear energy because it is carbon free.

That said, at time goes on, it looks less and less likely that we need to fear the effects of increasing carbon dioxide in the atmosphere as there has been no increase in global temperatures recently in spite of carbon dioxide levels rising

JessM Fri 15-Mar-13 12:33:27

Ain't no free lunch as they say. Westerners keep inventing things that use more and more energy - like patio heaters for instance. Progress on making houses and other major uses of energy more energy efficient is agonisingly slow, due to absence of cojones in successive governments.
There is a down side to every form of energy generation.
It is just a case of what price you want to pay - an in which currency.

granjura Fri 15-Mar-13 18:00:26

I am proud to say that patio heaters, private or for restaurants/cafés are illegal here smile To heat up outside space makes no sense at all ...

FlicketyB Fri 15-Mar-13 19:31:30

Galen, do not apologise for being pro-nuclear, many people including me support that view.

Germany's policy is quite insane. It is planning to build more new coal-fired power stations than any other European country at the same time as it closes its nuclear generators. Its emissions will rocket, its energy bills are doubling and major industries like, iron & steel,cement and plastics are moving overseas, just what you want in a recession in a country that is our only bastion between fiscal security and complete fiscal meltdown in the euro zone.

Read this article and just bear in mind it is written in a tone of great

FlicketyB Fri 15-Mar-13 23:07:22

And this article gives shows death rates for every type of energy. Another good reason to think that German energy policy is insane.

vonmichael Mon 25-Mar-13 16:21:32

Any article heremis right as wrong. Who has the answer of the question
where an industry will satisfy it's needs of energy in the future?

MargaretX Mon 25-Mar-13 17:32:38

I see that the article was in 'Der Spiegel' a pessimistic magazine if ever there was one! It will definitely paint a worse picture than what the reality is.

It is all case of NIMBY in Germany at the moment. Nobody wants wind turbines near them, or anything like that. I am pleased that a nuclear plant, not 100 km from my home has been closed down. It was old and too near Stuttgart Airport and if a plane had crashed........

FlicketyB Mon 25-Mar-13 20:53:39

Both articles I mentioned were on and written by one of their regular contributors, Der Spiegel may have reprinted the articles, but it originated with Forbes.

I have lived most of my life within 15 miles of nuclear facilities and brought my children up near them and I have not had a moments concern. On the other hand the winter smogs that used to cover London every winter destroyed my grandmother's health and eventually killed her and coal use led to the death of 300,000 Chinese people last year.