21 Kids and Counting.

I have not seen this programme but have previously read about the family. If they are not harming people, even though I do not comprehend their reasoning, then it is not for me to be critical. There are dreadful people with no children or the standard 2.4... will worry more about them.
I would not have chosen to have more than 2 even if I had had the wherewithall. My choice..nobody else's business. It serms this family are generally ok..why are people so anxious?

J, actually I'm sorry if I offend but having watched a few things and read about this family, I do feel they are addicted to pregnancy which to me indicates all is not well.

For an adult to have sex with a minor is also a crime.

But then I don't watch programmes about people buying expensive houses in the country, either.
We do watch sometimes but the houses are rarely under about £750,000 these days Kerenhappuch!

Lancslass - yes, that is an interesting point. Having done quite a lot of family history research, it is interesting to note that some families tend to 'shrink' down the generations whereas others 'expand'. It doesn't always correlate with the number of actual children the couple has, either.

I must confess I didn't watch the programme oldbatty.
But I do think it is down to choice, whether or not that is an ethical choice or not is a moot point.

Yes, it was a crime - who was in loco parentis of this girl at the time, I wonder? Was she in foster care or in a children's home?

If the mother had her first child when she was thirteen,did she have any more children before she reached the age of consent?
I presume they got married the moment she was 16 but like others I am surprised that he wasn't found guilty of having sex with a minor.

Presumably he was never reported, which is why I asked who was in loco parentis

Yes, it was a crime - who was in loco parentis of this girl at the time, I wonder? Was she in foster care or in a children's home?

She and the baby lived with her adoptive parents.

I think he was a neighbour and friend of an older brother.

Thanks notanan

She said in interview that it was "normal back then"
Meaning 80s/90s
It most certainly wasn't.

Attitudes change - and attitudes can change back again. At one time it would have been the people with large families who started them young (yes at 13 in some times and places) who were the norm, and those who had none or stopped at 2 and the women go to work and go out in the evenings who would have been seen disapproved of. The fact she held it together in spite of her young age, and with the same father for all the children, and that he took the legal risk of standing by her instead of pretending it was nothing to do with him, speaks a lot for their characters. As for the criminal charges, I believe the police are not obliged to step in when a post-pubertal teenager is willingly having sex, unless a complaint is made, or unless the teenager appears to be at risk (not the case if she has supportive carers). It's different with younger children of course. Also they were both teenagers of an age range where a natural attraction could develop and it's not like someone old enough to be her father was grooming her.

I quite agree paddyann. What on earth has it to do with anyone else how many children they have. We all had child benefit ......I had 4 children! Let’s not be so judgmental. Good luck to them I say.

18 is very different to 13.

Would anybody be happy to see their 13 year old daughter or grand daughter pregnant by an 18 year old?

It is a criminal offense for good reason.

It has nothing to do with anyone, except that they have courted publicity and fame.

It certainly wasn’t normal to have babies at 13 not in U.K. not in my era anyway, 50s 60 s 70 s 80 s that’s a hell of a cop out it was child abuse if she had the baby at 13 then she was probably abused at 12 and yes it is abuse whether he stood by her or not
I suppose it becomes other people s business when it’s being streamed into your living room Their privacy is the pay off for their considerable large fees gained and that includes good or bad reviews They could have kept all the ins and outs private Lottie

Would anybody be happy to see their 13 year old daughter or grand daughter pregnant by an 18 year old?

If she was PREGNANT at 13 then its not unlikely that the relationship/grooming started when she was 12? 11?

I don't think its honourable that he stayed sniffing around. It was her parents who supported her with the first baby.

I think its a bit gass-lighty of him to tell her that because she had more babies when she was old enough to consent, that that made the earlier non consensual sex okay

She wouldnt be the first girl to stay in a relationship with her abuser as she got older. And really what other life does she know?

Interestingly the first baby seems to not agree to being filmed.

The mum heavily pressures the older girls to get (and keep getting) pregnant young. Its as if she wants them to validate her life by choosing similar.

It has nothing to do with anyone, except that they have courted publicity and fame.

This! 100% .

The vlogs on YouTube show just how much fame they are courting.

Christmas Eve Eve. Who celebrates that?

Christmas Eve was like a rehearsal for the actual day with presents in named sacks under the tree, chocolate, new PJs for all and a festively laid table for breakfast? with all those kids? Christmas Day was an orgy of present opening. All carefully orchestrated for the camera.

Every aspect of their lives is filmed with Sue coming across like an excited child. Noel stays in the background but is firmly in control - especially in the new kitchen.

She probably had cancer because of those children who died.
Its not up to us to be annoyed when something someone else doesn't affect us.

Just a word on earlier sweeping statements about their adoptions being the reason for the parents' wish for a big family.

DD1 has 4 children and DD2 has none - her choice!
Both are adopted so make of it what you will.

I grew up with a family of 13 as neighbours. The parents were staunch catholics. The children grew up to be 4 teachers (including 2HT's), a university lecturer, 1 RAF pilot/senior instructor, 2 civil engineers, a chartered accountant, 3 senior-grade nurses and can't remember the others. All completed 6 years education at the local academy (ie Scottish academy, post 11plus so grammar school equivalent).

(Although the posts were deleted I regret that yet more anti-immigrant, racist comments were made by the same poster who sets out to spread such nastiness whether or not they are relevant to the thread.)

I just look at the size of the family and think what on earth does she do when they all suffer with a sickness and diarrhoea bug!! All those beds to change!

Sorry Hollydoilly10? Your post at 16.25. What does this mean?

I wondered too chewbacca!

Oh yes! D&V for 21!!!!

I am just amazed by the fact that they buy a new pram for each new baby. None of my children ever had a new pram/pushchair/cot - all second hand!

The UK is overpopulated, the world is overpopulated, that 's why there is so much poverty and homelessness. Soon there will not be not enough resources to go round to feed everyone on the planet and animals will suffer too, of course. It's very irresponsible for the human race to produce more than two children per mother.

I feel people like Janie Oliver’s wife who wants a 6 th child and Gordon Ramsey’s wife expecting 5 th are v bad examples at moment. Not judging on a personal way but regarding climate change. 12 yrs to change things areound. People require resources, full stop and the planet just cannot feed what the expected population is expected to be in a few decades time. It’s just a fact. The super rich will still be able to get food on the black market though!