Gareth Malone in prison

PamelaJ1, find a charity you can contribute to, that supports ex prisoners. That will be more useful than you trying to support one individual, using y0ur annexe. Working with this group is as you recognised, so demanding and so often a bit scary and sad. Best left to professionals.
You could volunteer to help teach a prisoner to read. There's a great scheme to help prisoners learn to read, so they can read a bedtime story on a tape, for their children.

Like others I wondered if we could help an ex prisoner. We probably could, we have a small annex, we could give one of these young men a home and support.
Then I realise that I would be totally out of my depth if anything went wrong and it probably would.

" Trouble is he is so charismatic, it's easy for people to fall under his spell, harder to keep the feeling when they're left on their own again".
I agree Suzy. I wish the tv channels would do more followups to his series.
Having belonged to various choirs in my younger years I know how much it added to my quality of life.
I can still sing, but the practises etc are too late for me now .

Glad to have noticed this discussion, since I had forgotten about this programme, and really want to watch. I am a big fan of Gareth, and I think he is very talented indeed. If he only makes a difference to one of the people he works with in building choirs, it is worth it. Trouble is he is so charismatic, it's easy for people to fall under his spell, harder to keep the feeling when they're left on their own again.

Meant to say Ross Kemp is in a documentary filmed in HMP Belmarsh showing tonight and tomorrow. Should be interesting.

No Fennel. We live in Urmston in Greater Manchester but we do have an apartment in Spain that we use for extended holiday trips now we are retired.

I'm a fan of Gareth Malone but just can't bear to watch this programme. And I've no clue as to what the answer is, if any.
Good posts from others though. And I agree about music as a healer.
BTW Urmston - do you live in Spain?

I agree with "fair and firm" - but this has to walk alongside training, education, addressing mental health problems, proper discharge support etc.

Dealing with mental health problems in prison simply does not happen in some. My dear relative in prison needs two different medically-prescribed medications a day - these were not forthcoming because said relative did not present to the medical room to get them - unbelievable! Not doing so is an aspect of the illness. No-one took the trouble to make sure they were taken.

Yes I can understand your points ladies. Sure Start was an amazing concept and George Osborne certainly slashed and burned his way through with his stupid austerity measures didn’t he?

I’d be keen to see an overhaul of the prison service. Drugs & mobile phones in prisons is a joke with today’s technology. It’s a long way from a file baked in a cake!

But until we get the foundations right there’s little point in just chucking money at a problem. (Same with the NHS).

Better pay and conditions to incentive clever brains and committed staff (not the governors they already earn mega bucks from what I’ve read - more salary than the PM!)

Once someone is in prison I’m not convinced about rehabilitation to be honest. Yes, spend public money on a more supportive family life outside (but with the lure of drugs and mental health issues will that utopia ever really happen?) but once ‘inside’ fair & firm would be my motto. Take best practice from how other countries do it.

It’s supposed to be a deterrent. Are we too soft? Ought privileges like tv or music things that should be earned by good behaviour? Or are they just supplied to keep the prisoners ‘quiet’ and malleable.

I admit, I don’t know the answer. The problem is multifaceted and too complex for my limited knowledge. All I know is the system is rotten and it isn’t working. Yes it’s massively underfunded. Maybe we do just have a really rotten section of society to contend with. There were always drunks, the feckless, the wicked and the mentally ill but add drugs, county lines, gang life and shivs to the mix and it’s become a toxic nightmare.

Indeed - the Blair government (and I cannot stand the man) recognised that prevention is the way to go and a long-term vision, rather than hoping for a magic wand approach.

Family support has gone and cycles of deprivation of all sorts continue.

There is no doubt whatsoever that there needs to be vastly more money pumped into the prison service: more properly trained and supported staff (some who are employed in the prisons are hopeless - I have met them); a focus on rehabilitation and the staff and facilities that are needed to achieve this; proper support when prisoners leave so they do not simply fall prey to the same vultures as got them there in the first place. All this is essential and costs money - but it would be money well spent.

Prisons are rife with drugs - is it not within the wit of humans to create a system where drugs are kept out of prisons? The use of mobile phones in prisons results in criminals conducting drug deals whilst imprisoned, so the vulnerable lads remain at the mercy of dealers, rather than being protected from them. Drugs come in on books - pages impregnated with the drug which can then be torn out and smoked - there is no end to the ingenuity.

Prison staff need better training, better support, better pay.

Urmstongan - those of us who worked with those damaged souls saw success, honestly we did. The real tragedy is that the money poured into early years by the Blair government has been wrecked by austerity. The research is absolutely irrefutable. Countries that invest in early years, by providing family support good parenting skills courses for people who need them, excellent day care provision, mental healt/drug alcohol support etc have less crime, teenage pregnancy etc.

Our culture has always had its feckless, it's dunks - look at those Hogarth cartoons. Over the past 9years we seem to be moving into a much more separate society with those of us who have being ok and those who struggle being left to struggle.

It would be good if the future was considered when making cutbacks - society's future as well as theirs. So many young men in prison have little education, and next to no qualifications. They're in a restricted environment but not particilarly encouraged from improving their life chances. One big Youth Offenders' Institute has a privatised education service - so someone's making money out of it!

On the recommendation of this thread I’ve just watched the first episode (of 2).

Is it poignant? - hell yes.

But the reality?

These are damaged boys. By circumstance, by drugs, by peer pressure, by mental health issues.

Society does not have the time or the resources to mend these broken souls. Yes, for a few minutes on a one-to-one they can be inspired. They have regrets. They miss their mums.

But anger management issues simmer just below the surface. Waiting for that catalyst. One ‘wrong look’ from a rival gang member on another wing provokes a fight. Bang! It goes off.

Would I employ any of these boys and ‘give them that chance’? Hell no.

As I say, one-to-one intensive encouragement ‘you’re doing really well man’ and fist-bumps. But with drug misuse in the past and mental health issues, plus the temptations to go rogue outside in the real world? Not a snowball in hell. Sorry. I wish I could be more positive - that would be nice. But not real.

I looked at the thread title and thought...’WHAT’?!
Glad to find he isn’t actually incarcerated.
Yes Luckygirl many in prisons are victims and some cases are heartbreaking.
Sometimes all people need is a second chance and a helping hand.

I remember watching The Loneliness of the Long Distance Runner and Ket all those years ago.
The working class culture that most of us grew up knowing is long gone. Working class boys went into traditional jobs in the pits, the mills and the engineering factories. We have huge estates where we are 4th generation since the men worked.
Working men had pride, they trained kestrels, kept pigeons and bird averse, they had gardens and allotments and a sense of community.
I know we can't go back and I don't say these were golden days but, they did provide stability, security and boundaries for young men who in truth, need those things.
the fact the drug dealers, the county lines etc are visible on all the big estates, in small towns and villages inevitably draws vulnerable boys in.
We need to invest in our communities. We shouldn't have such a large prison population.

I agree about the despair surrounding the ‘lost souls’ Gareth Malone was dealing with. However, the programme 24 Hours in Police Custody was also broadcast last night. The police detective’s view that “most of the kids on the estate are off their heads on cannabis” and the fact that the teenage dealer had a subsequent income of £2 grand a week is the real problem.

I never cry at the cinema but this programme moved me to tears. I do agree that involvement in music is a great healer and felt for all concerned , willing them on to succeed.It wont hurt to remember the expression "there but for the grace of God go I ". It is easy to criticise when your childhood has been steady, you supported by a loving family and friends and I think Gareth recognised that . He did mention that these young men had done things which were completely against what he stood for but he went on to try to bring out the good in them .So hard.

Maybe I'm a bit too soft but I felt as if I wanted to give some of those guys a big hug.
They seem to bottle up so much emotion and don't know how to deal with it.

It is telling that the song they put together was basically called "In Too Deep."

QuizQueen, perhaps you do not care & that is your prerogative, but it helps no one in society
when the choice to commit a crime , being caught & sent to prison is preferable to the lives lived on the outside.

quizqueen Of course, people who commit crimes, and, in particular, violent crimes against others should be punished. But locking people up for years on end without trying to address all the issues that have contributed to their criminality means that, in large part, the cycle of criminality will continue - and it does.

Recidivism in this country is high so the system we have at the moment cannot be regarded as successful since one of the aims of punishment is claimed to be rehabilitation. The US system, which is very much more punitive, is even less effective in reforming people - although in the US the imprisonment of people also yields good profits to private providers of services and goods.

Other countries have adopted a less punitive and more therapeutic approach, which has cut rates of recidivism dramatically. No doubt there will be a howl of outrage at this suggestion, with some people saying that "going soft on criminals" would be a betrayal of the victim. But if it is more effective in preventing them, on their release, creating more victims, surely it is an option that should be explored? I do agree, though, that more resources should be made available to victims of crime, as they appear to get little support in the lead up to a trial.

quiz queen, as you will be aware, your comment was provocative and totally lacking in humanity.
It was also ill informed.

I can't believe you really think that quizqueen. Have you no compassion?

That last sentence altered when I pressed send. Should have been. It's what bought them there that need addressing and quick.

I applaud Gareth Malone, I was moved to tears. Those with mental illness had decent families who had fought for help with their vulnerable children, but never got it those let down by lack of family, they sang and there was no one to appaud them, some one had given birth to these children but where was the family for them. Children need role models,a moral compass, people that genuinely love them and can provide a home. To just have a child is easy, raising them, being there is the stability they need. If you can't do that and commit, don't do it. What happens now? There should be no mobile phones in prison, zero tolerance on drugs or abusers, how can anyone survive it I don't know. It had me in tears throughout at the injustice for these youngsters wasted lives. Don't let anyone tell me that most of those lads would not have been better adopted by people that actually wanted them. The lad that had committed who sang do movingly, was truly remorseful, but had not one person outside who visited. These gangs live by drugs and the weapons they carry. It what bought turn there test needs addressing and quick.