Anne Boleyn

Sometime back I read an interesting trilogy of books which took as its basic concept that Anne did NOT miscarry the second baby, but went on to give birth to a healthy boy - destined to become Henry IX.

I think that this sounds like an interesting concept for a drama, but wonder how it would sit with those who insist on 'facts', and worry that A level students would be confused into writing essays about Henry IX?

It is interesting how much of our history hinges on accidents of fate. It's debatable how much our lives today would have been impacted by having the line of succession changed, but the loss of a battle here and there could have made things very different, as could anything that got in the way of inventions and scientific discoveries.

Callistemon

^Sometime back I read an interesting trilogy of books which took as its basic concept that Anne did NOT miscarry the second baby, but went on to give birth to a healthy boy - destined to become Henry IX.^

Interesting, Franbern, I hadn't heard of those books.
Presumably those Americans who claim to have been descended from Anne Boleyn (the ones who included my family in their inaccurate tree) had read those books.

By Laura Anderson.

Jabberwok

Yes, what if Arthur had lived? The medieval period is amazingly interesting, you can read about it again and again and still find something new to learn about. The over riding mystery of course is the Princes. I have always felt that Richard was responsible, although Josephine Tey nearly convinced me otherwise, but tbh, I think it was him. Could have been HenryV11th, but I don't think so.

An interesting mystery about the Princes. They were next in line to the throne. Their Uncle, Richard III is prime suspect but I wonder if Margaret Beaufort may have been behind their murders? She was very devout but also fiercely ambitious and was determined for her only son, Henry Tudor, to be crowned King. It was Margaret who together with Edward IV's widow Elizabeth, arranged the marriage between their children, Henry Tudor and Elizabeth of York, effectively bringing the Wars of the Roses to an end. Powerful women in their day.

Probably the worst casting of Henry VIII ever. To work, he needs to be both physically and mentally intimidating. This chap was your average bloke.
Comic book historical drama.

Yes, what if Arthur had lived? The medieval period is amazingly interesting, you can read about it again and again and still find something new to learn about. The over riding mystery of course is the Princes. I have always felt that Richard was responsible, although Josephine Tey nearly convinced me otherwise, but tbh, I think it was him. Could have been HenryV11th, but I don't think so.

Sometime back I read an interesting trilogy of books which took as its basic concept that Anne did NOT miscarry the second baby, but went on to give birth to a healthy boy - destined to become Henry IX.

Interesting, Franbern, I hadn't heard of those books.
Presumably those Americans who claim to have been descended from Anne Boleyn (the ones who included my family in their inaccurate tree) had read those books.

Darn it. Just as I read Jabberwocks post I thought to myself, you’ve still not got round to buying The Spanish Princess. I loved The White Queen. The White Princess not quite as much but it was still good. Then meant to buy The Spanish Princess. I didn’t rate The White Queen at first thinking it was a bit far fetched and then realised it was actually accurate. I think I’ve watched it several times now. I love staying at Middleham in the shadow of Richard III’s favourite castle. Wars of the Roses far more fascinating than Henry VIII imo.

I'm watching The Spanish Princess just now. It's very good, very accurate, I think. A Tudor story that doesn't get told very often. If Arthur had lived?

Yes history is full of if, buts and maybes which is what makes it so fascinating. If Henry and Katherines first son had lived? No Anne Boleyn I guess, if Edward V1th had lived? If Harold had won the Battle of Hastings? Intriguing stuff!

Ditto how weather has been a deciding factor in historical battles….

Sometime back I read an interesting trilogy of books which took as its basic concept that Anne did NOT miscarry the second baby, but went on to give birth to a healthy boy - destined to become Henry IX.

I know it is slightly off topic, but those books have remained with me each time I see or read anything about that period.

Equally interesting would have been if the premature death as a teenager had not occured with Henry's recognised bastard., Henry Fitzroy, Duke of Richmond and Somerset.

So many 'what ifs' in history.

I don't get revolted by graphic details in dramas. Well, sometimes, but not in the Anne Boleyn series. There's bits of Silence of the Lambs I haven't seen yet because my eyes have been closed.

It was shocking that the horse got killed, but it spoke to the change in Henry's character. I took it as meaning that he blamed the horse; later on he was going to blame Anne for something she had no control over either. It might not be Shakespeare, but it wasn't gratuitous either, IMO.

So what does showing the cutting of a horses throat add to the downfall of Anne except to revolt the viewer? Likewise graphic details of childbirth? The machinations of the Tudor Court are what is relevant in Anne's story, not mindless cruelty.

No, I thought it was awful

But that was due to the script and direction, IMO.

It was gratuitis imo. Did you think it was a good adaptation/ interpretation?

Why not? Giving birth wasn't exactly pleasant in the 16th Century.

The birth scene didn’t need to be so loopy and graphic though did it?

The killing of the horse was to support the idea that Henry's character changed after his accident at the joust.

There's no historical record of many things, but still we see them in dramas.

A horse being killed, why? as there is no historical record of this happening. It may well have done who knows but to portray something so horrid just to add a bit of spice to what is a very sad disastrous time for Anne is ridiculous and of no historical value at all. I'm glad I didn't watch it as that incident would have been a complete NO NO.

I didn’t watch it , not because of the casting, but because the story has been done so many times and I know she gets her head chopped off in the end. I loved Bridgerton - that was really well done and hilariously tongue in cheek.

I agree that it was pretty dire, but my point is that nobody knew that before they watched it. It might have been the best thing since Wolf Hall?

Look at the number of people on here who said that they wouldn’t be watching because of her skin colour - no marketing team would have pushed that aspect of it in order to increase viewing figures. Now that I’ve seen it I can see that the multi-racial cast was part of a wider attempt to make the story more representative of modern Britain (in that it was based on a timeless dynamic), but it is clear from posts here that at least amongst the GN demographic it did not increase viewing figures.

You may have watched for that reason, but others gave it as the reason they did not.

But it was only the publicity about it that made me watch it as Henry VIII has been done to death. I found everything about it dire, including the acting. Too much blood and gore, too (eg the scene where the horse was killed and the childbirth scene). No chemistry between Anne and Henry, even in the unnecessary sex scenes.

Why do you think the casting was done for publicity?

I suppose, given some of the comments on this thread, that more people than I’d realised are bothered about skin colour, or can’t follow a story without having replicas of old portraits as the characters,, but I doubt that the producers would be looking at them in their marketing.

I agree that it wasn’t great, but it was clear that it was an attempt to bring the story to a more modern audience- not one that would let the skin colour of the characters put them off it before they’d even seen it.

Watching it now. It’s awful.

I haven’t seen it yet. DH watched it and wasn’t very impressed. I will watch it out if interest but must admit that over the past couple of days I have been thinking that the whole thing was done just to court publicity. I’ll see what I think when I’ve watched it.