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Work wants to replace me with younger person

(123 Posts)
Laughterlines Tue 09-Feb-21 11:57:29

I have worked for the same company for 25 years. I am good at my job. I have a daily assignment which I carry out alone. I don’t have to go into the office and do not have social contacts with other employees.

Work have engaged a much younger person who will earn less and fits the positive discrimination guidelines who I believe is a replacement for me.

Work have asked me to attend a zoom meeting where they have found texts going back several years and accused me of bullying behaviour. I have not been aware of deliberately bullying somebody. I feel this is a trumped up excuse to get rid of me, save money, and comply with current employment requirements .

Last year I had some issues and needed to see a counsellor and asked in a text for time off to attend the appointment. This was refused as too busy.

I have always worked unpaid overtime and on days off but this is not being recognised. I am good at my job.

I am early fifties so couldn’t draw my pension yet.

Any idea how I should defend myself. I am usually non confrontational.

soozieee Tue 16-Feb-21 07:50:58

Have you checked your home insurance to see if you have legal cover attached? I always add it to my policy and it can come in very handy.

Tea3 Mon 15-Feb-21 14:02:49

You’ve been given some excellent advice in these posts but I feel I should mention that I was told by my GP to take into consideration the mental toll involved in taking action against an employer, which inevitably will be a lengthy process. Also, you may win your case but employers have ways and means of getting their own way in the end. Twenty years ago a friend in a similar circumstances, in their 50s, successfully retained their post, only to find that a ‘restructuring’ a few months later left them in a corner of an office, still on the payroll but with nothing to do.

OldEnough2noBetter Sun 14-Feb-21 18:37:50

I went through a similar situation while working for BBC. A senior colleague wanted to get his old school chum in so they trumped up charges against me. I was a union member but my rep was useless and also good friends with my Department Head! I did all my own research, took notes, spoke to ACAS. Don’t attend a meeting without a representative alongside you, even if it’s just a friendly colleague. DO NOT expect help from HR; they work for the employer, not the employees. Do not be forced into a meeting without all their allegations and policies in writing in advance. Reschedule the meeting if necessary to give you enough preparation time. It is a lot of work, but you are capable and a lawyer is not necessary for tribunal level.

I took them to tribunal and they eventually settled ‘out of court’ for a five-figure sum. They also had to pay the fees of a training course of my choice to help me into new work.

Above all, keep your head and don’t be worried or afraid. Remain calm. I did this; you can do it too.

Tweedle24 Sun 14-Feb-21 14:18:41

...or any other accusations.

Tweedle24 Sun 14-Feb-21 14:15:57

Whatever happens, please don’t be the one to bring up the subject of the other employee. It is not your place to do that. You must only talk about the accusations of bullying.

Ask whoever comes with you to take notes. Only the managers will have control over the Zoom meeting, whether to record the meeting and whether to allow you access to the recording. They should but, there is no guarantee they will.

GoldenAge Sun 14-Feb-21 11:42:39

Take legal advice before the zoom meeting and take a friend.
Ensure you have hard evidence of being able to do the job such as might be in appraisals from previous years. Also you can refer to the omission of any suggestion by the company that you have not completed your work properly or sufficiently productively.
Do not assume that working unpaid overtime is worth anything - it isn't. You may think it shows loyalty but if you had to do that you are simply masking the fact that the company needs to employ another person to cope with the workload.
Do not assume that somebody who is disabled is less capable than you.
Do not assume that somebody from a BAME background is less capable than you.
Listen, listen, listen when you eventually attend this meeting and think before you respond. Pre-lockdown such meetings were rarely recorded except via an administrator taking minutes. With zoom there will be a recording and that will capture your non-verbal communication and your tone of voice so be considered in your responses and don't leave yourself open to criticism.

Yorki Sat 13-Feb-21 06:04:54

Emmypemmy I love your reply. Say it as it is. ??

rozina Fri 12-Feb-21 23:04:32

Laughter lines, DO contact ACAS for advice before you do anything else. All the best.

Nellie098 Thu 11-Feb-21 20:01:16

I just wanted to add that if you are asked to sign anything say you will take it away so that you can read it carefully. If you feel any part is incorrect, either amend it and sign it or else take a copy, amend this and sign it, and send both back stating you only agree with the facts in your amended statement. It is then up to your management how they want to proceed from there.

welbeck Thu 11-Feb-21 17:22:14

what is the context of these alleged bullying texts.
when were they sent, and to whom, why.
was it using a work mobile.
were they work-related.
was any complaint made to you or manager at the time.
if so, what happened.

SuRu Thu 11-Feb-21 17:03:21

Does your company conduct annual appraisals? If so, has anything ever been said about bullying behaviour at these. Conversely, have you had positive appraisals? These could prove very valuable. You should have been given copies of these, so go over them with a fine toothcomb. Agree with what others have suggested, ACAS, bring a colleague. If you know anyone in HR away from your company, see if they'll gameplay the meeting with you. Good luck!

Seajaye Thu 11-Feb-21 15:12:05

Sorry to hear of troubles in your workplace, but it's an experience for many at the moment and very upsetting and stressful. Positive discrimination is actually unlawful under Equality act 2010, but positive action to recruit under represented minorities in the workforce is not. Your employer equally must not discriminate on the grounds of age either..
It does sound like your employer may be looking for economies if a cheaper worker could do the same job for less, and they only need one person in that role. That would potentially place you at being act risk of redundancy on economic grounds.
Redundancy is potentially fair dismissal ground provided selection process is fair, but comes with an entitlement to notice and redundancy payment.

It does sound like that your employer might be going the disciplinary route to avoid paying redundancy pay, you may have to brace yourself for these two possibilities. If they are trying to dismiss you on grounds of redundancy then you would be entitled to redundancy pay and notice . If you are unfairly dismissed for misconduct after an reasonable investigation process into the allegations, then you have a right to an appeal, then to go to employment tribunal. If it gets to that stage, very few people get reinstated into a job, especially one that is unlike to exist at that point, but you might get compensation of the dismissal is found to be unfair and/or age discrimination is found against your employer. Check your household insurance policies as you may have legal expenses to fight the case for compensation if they are being patently unfair or discriminating, but sadly redundancy on economic grounds is now far too common and likely to be held as reasonable, especially in current climate.

LMW1 Thu 11-Feb-21 10:08:23

I have no advice but I want to wish you all the best.

Classic Thu 11-Feb-21 10:04:07

Nellie o98 got it spot on, having been through disciplinary etc myself, (also on trumped up excuses) I would add that its very important for you to have a representative alongside you, I chose someone that I didn't know all that well but he had always seemed to be very sensible, and good at his job. He kept me calm, and asked for breaks in the meeting so that we could confer, and calm down. The industry I worked in got rid of all their older employees, the only people over 50 were management grades or cleaners! It is a thing, and so is looking out for the replacement before getting rid of the staff member in question. You can't fight your dismissal on those grounds though, you have to put all that aside in your mind, and fight it under grounds of unfairness, or incorrect procedure. They will get rid of you if thats in their minds, possibly not on this occasion, this time you will get a written warning with an 'instant dismissal if anything else comes to light' warning, so they are setting the scene and seen to be following procedures. Good luck, if all else fails you could ask if they are wanting to make you redundant? Sacking you saves paying out redundancy payments, and they just have to change the job title of your 'replacement' and then give them extra responsibility after your role is no long required.

SparklyGrandma Thu 11-Feb-21 04:25:37

Get yourself an appointment with an employment solicitor Laughterlines . If pension rights could be involved, even more reason to get a lawyer. Good luck.

Kryptonite Wed 10-Feb-21 22:06:42

Another thing, if this is handled properly, you will receive written statements from all parties. You will also have the chance to make a written statement and any grievances you feel. All will have the chance to read these prior to the meeting in order to respond to the statements. Keep believing in yourself and remember your excellent track record in your job over all these years. xx

Kryptonite Wed 10-Feb-21 21:55:53

Definitely take someone with you to the meeting to support or even speak for you. Has happened to me and later my husband. Is there a friend at work who could support you in this? Gather your evidence and make a plan with your supporter so you're fully prepared on the day. It's despicable what some people do to other people in the workplace. Good luck. Good advice about being in a union too.

Shandy57 Wed 10-Feb-21 21:34:54

My husband had been with his company for twenty years and the much coveted promotion to MD came up. My husband wasn't even invited for interview, and rumours were abounding. He was devastated to find a much younger graduate trainee, that he'd recruited, got the job. There was a twenty year age gap between them, but luckily they got on like a house on fire, both in and out of work.

Yorki Wed 10-Feb-21 20:38:22

Amberspyglass... I think laughterlines has put across her case across very well. Her employers want rid of her, and are trumping up excuses to get rid. It also sounds like they've hired someone to do the job cheaply, hence the ( disability ploy) especially as this person is not as qualified for the job. That much is pretty obvious. I think laughterlines has a pretty good case for unfair dismissal, and should seek advice accordingly.

Frogsinmygarden Wed 10-Feb-21 20:11:14

I too, had a similar experience to your husband V3ra. Unfortunately because I was so good at my job it incited much jealousy from 'colleagues' who weren't as good. And what made things worse was my boss would sing my praises to all and sundry. Eventually I was stiffed on a promotion and when I asked why, was told by another manager that I hadn't done work that I'd been asked to do for a senior colleague. I DID do it. And I did LOTS of it. It turned out that that senior colleague swore blind I hadn't done the work and she'd done it herself!!!! I knew there and then I would never get on in that organisation so I put in my resignation. So, before my leaving date they moved me to another job in another building on site which meant my working conditions were abysmal. To add insult to injury, they sent my replacement to me so that I could train them! I would never have thought that people's jealousy and maliciousness would be sanctioned by my other colleagues but I guess there are small minded, inadequate people everywhere.

V3ra Wed 10-Feb-21 19:14:02

My husband is another one who fell foul of a big national company downsizing its workforce years ago.
His job was given to a young woman who was paid less and allocated a much smaller company car.
To add insult to injury he was asked to take her round, introduce her to all his business contacts and basically train her to do his job.
He received a redundancy payout which fortunately cleared our mortgage but he still had to look for another job.

kjmpde Wed 10-Feb-21 18:28:28

if the firm is trying to replace you due to age then it is age discrimination. Even if you had sent those emails the firm should have dealt with them in a timely manner and not waited years
You do not need a union to fight your battles and in my experience ( ex acas conciliator) some of the representatives are worse than useless. remember acas does not take sides in any tribunal matter and can offer advice only
I would ask the firm to provide you with written details of what the issues are . Have you had regular appraisals with a written report? if so do they bring any performance issues to light?
If not then you have more ammunition to fight an age discrimination claim - . You could ask the firm to clarify in the absence of performance issues or discussions on bullying if the real reason is due to your sex or age or both

Caligrandma Wed 10-Feb-21 18:05:07

unfortunately, you need an attorney who specializes in labor law.

Harmonypuss Wed 10-Feb-21 17:45:08

If this employer has employed someone who sits in TWO of the groups that are normally avoided (not officially of course, employers will find any other excuse possible to avoid being prosecuted for discrimination), they should be applauded!

If they're doing this to replace you, they would need to have extremely compelling grounds to get rid of you and they can't make you redundant because it's the JOB not the person that redundancy applies to.

BeverleyJB Wed 10-Feb-21 16:23:49

I'm sorry you're going through this - from personal experience, being bullied is truly awful.
I do know from my current work (1) you should be entitled to a companion or union rep with you at any disciplinary meeting and (2) they should provide you with any “evidence” they intend to use against you before such a meeting, so you have time to consider it (and prepare your defence).

Also, have a look at your household insurance policy - often there is the option for some free legal advice included.
Best wishes.