Am I too 'needy', demanding and difficult?

absent I agree with you. My post late last night was referring to when I have in the past, when he was younger, been 'on my son's case' about something and he would tell me to back off. Of course family members sometimes get cross with each other about something that was said - as happens between all adults, related or not - and my response usually is "get over it". And people usually do. As Bags would says "Shrug".

I find the suggestion of pussy footing with one's adult child(ren) very strange. Perhaps that is because I don't give advice – unsolicited or asked for – as a) I rarely feel qualified and b) I suspect people simply want their own decisions confirmed. Having said that, I have no problem commenting, discussing or questioning anything that is in the public domain, as it were. It seems such an odd sort of relationship between adults if one party has to edit everything they say.

I wouldn't dream of giving unsolicited advice to anyone.
That's different from just commenting on what's been said.
Obviously you have to be careful how you phrase things. I hope that I'm as non-judgemental when I have conversations with my DCs as I am when talking to my friends.

My DD2 asked me ages ago not to give unsolicited advice. I felt stung at first: I thought, but my advice is worthwhile -unlike that of my parents and....ah....riiiight.....I remembered how much I resented my MIL when she went round our first house, criticising and 'advising' us what to do with it - trying to re-arrange furniture etc. I still get wound up by her and she STILL does it! I have to keep reminding myself what it feels like and that, though I had hoped my children would see our 'advice' differently, that wasn't going to happen. So now we try not to offer any advice, but now and then we foul up. Part of me feels we ought to be able to offer an opinion on things, but then I just cast my mind back to MIL and that's enough to silence me. For a while! It's taken ages though. Both DDs say that when I advise them unsolicited, as it were, it feels as though I don't trust them to make the right decisions themselves, and they lose confidence. I can see this perfectly well. I've found it incredibly hard to learn to shurrup, but I'm getting there. Slowly. Not fast enough for DD2 - DD1 is far more patient and understanding! I am practising saying things like 'I'm sure you'll make the right decision for you....' of 'You'll get there!' or 'Well, you know where we are if you need us...' It'll probably take me decades to get the balance half-right!

I'm in the minority here I think because I do tend to say what I think. My children are adults and don't need my approval for anything, but if I'm asked my opinion I tend to give it as honestly (and tactfully when necessary) as I can. My daughter once informed me that she had put a deposit on a puppy and asked what I thought. At that time I thought it was a completely daft idea and I said so and gave my reasons. The frost between us could have chilled a fair few drinks after I'd had my say, but the following day she telephoned to say that she was no longer getting the puppy (and she lost a substantial deposit in cancelling the purchase). Three years on she still thinks about what a disaster it would have been to get a dog at that time is remains grateful for my 'intervention'.

The only way to enjoy an adult relationship with your children is to say as little as possible. One day it might be really necessary to give advice and if you are not in the habit of poking your nose in they will listen.

I agree with jingl about parents having self-respect.
I can't remember now (sorry) who posted about their D getting cross when she questioned whether the D should get another dog.
I can't see why, if a D or anyone else announces that they're going to do something, a parent cannot make a reasonable remark.

My philosophy, see all, hear all and say nowt. Just because they are our children does not give us the right to put in our five pennyworth.

I don't pussy foot around my children. But I have tended in the past to get too involved in their lives from time to time. And then I'm thankful that they are comfortable enough to point that out to me, and that I'm sane enough to get the message.

Kiora I like your mother's advice 'see all, hear all and say beggar all'

I bet you wouldn't, jingl. You just think you would because you know he'll never do that.

If only jingle I do pussyfoot around them. My M.I.L certainly has never taken this road and her children fall at her feet. To add insult to injury they all admit she was a terrible mother who abandoned them. I think they are looking for her love and approval. They'll never get it though.

You are all far too soft with your children. You need to find some self respect.

If my son threatened to pull away from me, I would give him a two finger salute and tell him to sod off.

My oldest son once told me not to give unsolicited advice because he had probably already made up his mind to do it. Two years down the line when my advice proved to be true he'd just feel resentful. I'v remembered that and say nothing. My daughter-in-law once asked me if I thought she might have a bit of O.C.D my head I thought " a bit!!" But what I said was " oh I don't know what do you think" remembering my own mothers advice " see all, hear all and say bugger all" it would be wonderful if we could just let go and get on with this stage of our lives and leave em to it. Easier said than done though.

My son says to me sometimes: "If you push, I will pull (away). It's a simple matter of physics". Usually followed by "I need some space". And when I step back, he comes back. Push and pull.

He says it less often these days. He has trained me well

Remember what Carol used to say in this sort of family situation? "We have every right to have opinions and no right at all to express them." True.

To be serious for a minute- our DC are adults and do not need our permission or even approval. So if we want them to share their hopes and plans I think we do need to curb any natural instinctive reservations. We may not agree but that does not mean we are automatically right.

Nice soutra - i get into trouble for not responding appropriately to various cataclysmic utterances

Don't often write a post but read and have learnt so much from gransneters tears . So much wisdom and experience. It is so hard to always stand back and think before we speak . One wonders why should we always be the ones to hold back but if we love our children we will always do this and maybe our sons and daughters will learn from us and treat their own children with the same tolerance and respect. (Just re read and noticed the word tears automatically put in for gransneters ) how profound!!

x to you * ROWAN*

Soutra, thank you - your suggestions made me giggle, but are excellent ideas and I will definitely practise them Like you, I can recall my mother's negativity - and experience my MIL's regularly!
Nonu: it's NHS, definitely. Couldn't afford to go private! He's a nice guy, he listens, he makes me feel as if I have something important to say, but on his own admission he's limited. Psychiatrists these days really only prescribe and refer on :/

Strategies to avoid saying what you think (i.e. the wrong thing)
(Pause) ...lovely!
(Pause) ...wow that's interesting
(Pause ...that's a new idea
(Pause) ...tell me more about it.....
Or any combination of the above.
The Pause is to enable you to readjust your features if in her company into an interested maybe quizzical encouraging smile - if you can make something like this your first reaction, it gives you time to work out what the hell to say next. Maybe I am a wimp, but I tend to say what I think they will want to hear - i.e approval - they are adults and I think I can remember only too well my own mother's instinctively negative reaction to anything new.
Practise!

Hello Rownatree , you talk of yor psychiatrist , is that on the N.h.s. or a private one ?

I am feeling a little less sad now I've meditated. And re-reading all the wise posts here is very empowering, so thank you all! I need to re-think my strategy with DD2, though it's easy to get it wrong (I do frequently!). DD1 is a different kettle of fish: it's easy to discuss things with her without her flying off the handle. If she does get irritated, she does so firmly and kindly, but makes her point clear. With DD2 I'm always on one side or 'tother of the line, but usually on the wrong side!
KatyK - I can see your point and feel the same: 'my problem, not hers'....I don't want to make my issues spill over. I need to learn how to deal with them better. And keep my mouth shut more often!
Bluebelle and Petra - can relate there too - how many times have I wanted to take back words said too quickly and inadvisedly! I am a little better than I was though - I'd thought our relationship had improved a lot after a family 'meeting' about Boundaries (!) in a restaurant, when GD was a couple of months old. I'd hoped to see our GD more often than DD2 had envisaged - problems arose, we met for lunch with both DDs, discussed it, I shed some tears, but we all left feeling progress had been made.
Unfortunately the path of progress ain't always smooth. One step forward, two steps back...or sometimes vice versa....

Iam64- I am 9 months into some horrible therapy programme that my psychiatrist thought would be good for me. I have another 9 months to go. It's two days a week. Most of the other patients have been in-patients or have self-harmed (I have neither) so I feel guilty that I appear to function better than some of them, whose lives are very difficult - whereas my life is NOT difficult at the moment - it was, but I coped far better then! Sod's law, really.... but despite fantasising about letting rip at DD2 for being hurtful, I will put that firmly where it should be, and Do the Right Thing - be calm, measured, loving and warm. I know I will feel all the better for that.

I am amazed and delighted at how wise and compassionate most Gransnetters are, and how supportive of each other. It makes me feel so much less alone with my feelings. I hope others feel similarly