ESTRANGEMENT- The silent epidemic! Let's get this out of the cupboard.

An enlightening debate, my dds mils exhibit many listed toxic traits. Bless my dds hearts.

Thank you Ankers.
Hopen you have a nice few days away

Hope you enjoy your time away.
Ankers it's been so nice to debate with you.
While I may not agree you've been articulate and fair in the debate.
I've managed to openly dissagree with you without you losing it and calling me vile and a troll. I really respect you for that.

There are points here I would like to post about.
But I am away for a few days, so will get back to them when I can.
Just thought I would post that, rather than anyone thought I wasnt going to return.


I do think it is very helpful to hear the detail.

Redheadedmommy. I dont think anyone can expect you to properly like such a person.

I agree with Red.
I've watched my Dh argue with his brother over something that had nothing to do with him because his mother shit stirs between them.
The AC is conditioned. They can't see the crazy and absolute dysfunction that is right
there in front of them because they are in way to deep.
Before me he thought it was normal to be trying to sit at home watching a movie while you listened to your mother wail on the phone about an argument she's had with your brother.
He thought it was normal for you mother to complain to your partner that she hadn't received oral recently from her husband yet she always gives him a blow job.
He thought she was just hard work.
She's not. She's selfish and manipulative.
She thinks all her DILs (except me she thinks I like her. I don't know why)
Are evil and out to get her.
3 different women. With 3 different upbringings and 3 very different personalities who all get on yet all dislike her and agree on everything about her.
So who's the problem everyon or her?
And of course she has friends saying how evil the DILs who Co her are. And she takes my DH grunt as confirmation that the hour long whine she's just had at him is justified.
What he's actually saying is please shut up.

community.babycenter.com/post/a65697076/why-cant-co-people-have-access-to-children.

It hard. It's hard from the POV as a wife and DIL because the blame instantly falls at your feet because he wasn't this way before he met me, which I agree, he wasn't.

I've been there when she degraded him in front of me and she said it all while laughing. It's only a bit of fun. He came to bed and cried. It's hard to like someone, I mean really like someone when they bully their own kid.

Fast forward a few years we saw her regular and she was trusted to have DD on her own. She had the chances and she blew every single one of them. It went to regular visits but we was always there. Then the visits dropped, week by week because SHE opted out.

I could write a book. Much more Drama.

We haven't seen her for a few years (3/4 years?) Since DD2 was born. We set up boundaries before that as she contributed to my PND with DD1 and my counsellor
suggested we needed to be more assertive. Which is what steam rolled the whole damn thing!

Ankers I meant, it corrected!

A mere, "no love, no compassion, no respect". You said it can do a lot of harm and I agree, but don't you think that grandparents like that can do harm to a young child? If it's true for the COs it's true for others surely?

Ankers "Sorry, RedheadedMommy. I did think that at least Bibbity was experiencing it too."

It sounds as if she is experiencing an abusive MIL. She is not quite CO yet, but on VVLC, it seems. I'm sorry you feel anyone who doesn't agree with your ideas is not qualified to discuss CO GPs. Perhaps the "fun and support" post is better suited to reading your view? Maybe a better question is "why not CO abusers?"

Gransnet may need to update its Acronyms list!

ELC:- extremely low contact.

I'm sorry it becomes like text speak you get used to writing it it becomes second natire

BSC :- Bat shit crazy
DWIL:- a board on the BC USA (dealing with the inlaws) a board people go to for advice when they have problems with relatives
AITF:- same forum but Stands for all in the family. Similar thing but more relaxed.

community.babycenter.com/groups/a6728031/all_in_the_family

Nor ELC

And she's already been Co by one son and has recently been allowed back into another's. She's on ELC with both the children she's in contact with. So I also have some experience.
Is that good enough?
Do I get to play now?

I dont actually know what BSC, DWIL and AITF is.
I presume CO is cut off, and I kepep having to remind myself what AC and GC is.

I have experience. Yes, my husband's brother is enough reason, relatives have been used as examples throughout this thread. I also have the experience of being having well adjusted children and happy visiting GC. I know what works and what doesn't work to keep my family happy.

I wasn't aware that this thread was so exclusive :/
I am dealing with a toxic person however. My MIL is BSC and I do dream of a day she is CO or otherwise permanently irradiated from my life.

Sorry, RedheadedMommy. I did think that at least Bibbity was experiencing it too.

Ah, so the only real poster in this dilemma is RedheadedMommy. [not norah, not Araabra, and not Bibbity]. You other 3 are just joining in the "fun", and have no experience whatsoever.

Ankers "If you were happy with your decision, why do you need to keep looking at and reading it all?" "Is it to "help" others to CO? Or to try your hardest to justify it to yourself?"

I merely want to point out many reasons GPs are CO. I hear it from my husband's brother and wife. What I read makes sense to me. I think a better question is "why would an AC keep abusive people in the lives of their small innocent children?" Many AC have a memory of their childhood that is marred by abuse. That is not a legacy they wish to pass along.

I've never CO anyone so I'm just on these boards because they're one small part of the BC group.
Red I agree. It didn't completly explain my argument. More that the CO usually beloved they are completly blameless and need to realise that the Co is happening for a reason.

I don't think i agree with that. what's wrong with neon green?

Cutting contact with someone isn't easy. It's not done out of spite or done quickly. It takes a lot of upset and because every option has been exhausted.

To make it sound like the CO person has to jump through hoops to 'win' isn't fair. When really the person who has cut contact just wants peace, having the person who they have cut contact with trying to 'fix' things, in their own way, brings more anxiety and more arguments.

I agree with the second one more.

And thank you for everyone who mentioned about my dad

Ah, now I realise that you put in the word abusers.
And I meant not to answer you. Blast.

Yes, unfortunately, that is what I thought.