To think that a trend is starting here

I wasn't aware that there was a requirement to answer the OP in every comment Doodledog.

Well, there isn't, MoorlandMooner, but there is a requirement in most situations not to quote someone out of context, which it seems like you have done.

I wouldn't use the phrases that have been quoted, such as 'wimps' or 'bleat', as I fully accept that mental ill-health can happen to anyone (and I agree that 'playing the X card' is always dismissive and facile, whatever X represents). I do, however, disagree that people have to put themselves first. This is particularly true in work situations, but the same applies in social situations where others are being inconvenienced.

If someone is unable to do a job because of their mental health it is sad, but no different from being unable to do it because of a physical illness, or a lack of qualifications, or whatever. It is wrong for someone to keep taking the salary and expect others to do their job for them.

There is a difference (IMO) when it comes to athletes, who are not expecting others to pick up their slack, and even if they were, they are not doing it on a regular basis or they wouldn't have been selected for a team. As has been said from the start of the thread, it must take courage and strength of character to pull out of a high-level competition such as the Olympics, and it is not for anyone to criticise someone who does so.

Lucca

I don’t like that expression “playing the mental health card” anymore than I like “plying the race card” or “ woke “ or “PC gone mad”.

I agree Lucca, mostly.

I have a friend who has bipolar. She is fine, most of the time, including for the last two years, working overseas and unable to travel to see family. But at times, maybe once every two or three years, her bipolar rears up and she has to have a substantial amount of time off work to battle it. When she's in the middle of it, she is probably what most people once would have thought of as being insane. It is very distressing to witness. She's also a suicide risk. When she is well, she is a very productive employee, great at her job.

I also have a couple of friends who have retreated into MH issues for other reasons. One, a married woman, who has never worked, I think uses it as 'ladies' did historically, to enable her to stay on her sofa and still command attention. The other, a very lonely woman, for similar reasons. I don't deny they both have problems, but I think one would be helped by having a job and the other by having a partner. I have sympathy for both of them of course. But they are not in the same category as my first friend, who is severely disabled at times by her illness and yet who strives to live as normally as possible.

Lucca

Perhaps it is worth bearing in mind that we have experienced a pandemic too.

Nope.
Apparently all young people are simply wimps /wusses/snowflakes.

I despair.

Germanshepherdsmum

Thank you Doodledog for putting my comments into context.
Yes Lucca, it seems to be becoming a trend, almost a must-have accessory, an excuse made by a lot of people who confuse feeling a bit fragile or down (doesn’t everyone?) with actual mental ill-health. These are the ones who annoy me. I haven’t referred here to Simone, about whom I know nothing, but to the seemingly growing number of people who think they’re no-one if they haven’t got ‘issues’ and think nothing of letting others down whilst they indulge themselves. Harry and Meghan spring to mind. If that woman was ever suicidal and was in tears at the Albert Hall (but looking immaculate when the lights went up) I’ll happily eat my hat - but that’s another thread.

So you admit that you pulled through and carried on while suicidal, but don’t imagine others can?

Why is that?

“ These are the ones who annoy me.”. Looks like that’s your answer summerlove

Lucca The fact that you do not like phrases like, 'playing the mental health card' etc, and I do share your distaste, doesn't stop some people doing everyone of those things you mention. Unfortunately this devalues the very real problems of other people who are mentally ill, or discriminated against for any reason.

Yasmin Alibhai-Brown had a very good article in the i this week on the subject of women who are incompetent in their jobs and seem to get away with it because it is considered sexist to be honest and call them out. While not being political, this has been very visible in some recent appointments to high profile jobs in the public sector.

For some people playing these cards is a form of passive aggression. Many years ago before mental problems were fully recognised I had an American flatmate, whose great get out of gaol card was claiming 'that she wasn't 'emotionally' up to doing things. Things she wasn't 'emotionally' up to doing included her share of the housework and cooking, being welcoming to any friends I or my friend, the third flatmate, invited to visit, or anything else that didn't appeal to her. In the end I decided I wasn't 'emotionally' up to living with her and I moved out. No doubt today she would play the mental health card and tell us that her mental health was too fragile for some reason to cook, clean and be polite to visitors.

This weekend, Sir Digby Jones has accused the Sports commentator Alex Scott of ’playing the class card’

(Jones had a go at her - on Twitter, natch - because she doesn’t pronounce the ‘g’ at the end of words. Scott responded that she is proud of her working class background.)

So it seems that there are many cards available for playing - race, sex, mental health, class.

Today I’m going to see if I can make up a few of my own, and accuse others of ‘playing’ them.

Can I play my " human being who recognises and supports others in difficulties" card?

Or else my "believes the youth of today would be as likely as any others in history to do their duty if needed" card?

If Jones is playing the class card.

His snobbery fails to understand his title.

It is not Sir Digby Jones.

It is Digby Sir Jones.

Stupid man.

Alegrias1

Can I play my " human being who recognises and supports others in difficulties" card?

Or else my "believes the youth of today would be as likely as any others in history to do their duty if needed" card?

I’ll join that card club

She probably doesn’t care what Piers Morgan has to say or her fellow competitors. When you go into meltdown you go in to meltdown. I should imagine it’s like a panic attack where you just can’t help yourself. She will now be scared of it happening again.

M0nica

Lucca The fact that you do not like phrases like, 'playing the mental health card' etc, and I do share your distaste, doesn't stop some people doing everyone of those things you mention. Unfortunately this devalues the very real problems of other people who are mentally ill, or discriminated against for any reason.

Yasmin Alibhai-Brown had a very good article in the i this week on the subject of women who are incompetent in their jobs and seem to get away with it because it is considered sexist to be honest and call them out. While not being political, this has been very visible in some recent appointments to high profile jobs in the public sector.

For some people playing these cards is a form of passive aggression. Many years ago before mental problems were fully recognised I had an American flatmate, whose great get out of gaol card was claiming 'that she wasn't 'emotionally' up to doing things. Things she wasn't 'emotionally' up to doing included her share of the housework and cooking, being welcoming to any friends I or my friend, the third flatmate, invited to visit, or anything else that didn't appeal to her. In the end I decided I wasn't 'emotionally' up to living with her and I moved out. No doubt today she would play the mental health card and tell us that her mental health was too fragile for some reason to cook, clean and be polite to visitors.

Monica, of course there will always be people who take advantage, just as there have always been malingerers. I just find the use of that particular phrase tends to allow the user to lump many genuine sufferers in that description.
I don’t have a huge extended family by any means but within it there are 6 who have suffered from mental health issues either temporarily or, in the case of two people, long term.

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202108/medium-301887-fcbc67a0-36b0-4c71-a6a6-3c3446c6bfdb.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202108/medium-81860-b5c83bd7-75bf-40db-b940-a55876199223.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202108/medium-280304-b9448ff4-d783-44ab-8071-2ad5d151af8b.jpeg

There’s an article in the Sunday times today about Simone Biles. I’ll included it here . Well worth reading it all but at the least have a look at to it’s I’ve (rather clumsily) highlighted.
It’s written by Martina Navratilova.

Typos… I’ve included….look at the bits ….

I agree Lucca,some poor soul would have loved the chance to be in the Olympics.

Navratilova has been such a champion of women in sport.

Gwyneth

I’m just surprised that with the support top athletes receive from various professionals that mental health issues are not spotted before the athlete is selected to compete. Surely coaches etc would realise that something was not right?

I am surprised at this also, Should be spotted much earlier in my opinion

timetogo2016

I agree Lucca,some poor soul would have loved the chance to be in the Olympics.

Sorry I don’t understand ?

Germanshepherdsmum

Moorlandmooner you cannot compare that statistic with joining up during wartime.

To join the British armed services at any time is to willingly put yourself in the way of danger in order to benefit others and defend our country.

All of our service men and women are prepared to be the first one there wherever and whenever there is conflict.

Between 2000 and 2014 454 British forces personnel died in Afghanistan. Their average age was 22. 3,560 were wounded many suffering life changing injuries.

In 2020 37,000 student nurses enrolled during a pandemic which which was killing medical professionals daily and before a vaccine was available. Now that is bravery.

Then there are all the incredible young people who have made lifelong sacrifice and are now stunning the world with their achievements at the Olympics and the Euros?

Or the fantastic young people working in our care homes, caring for our grandchildren, volunteering to help during the pandemic and generally making our world a better place now and in the future.

It is easy, but not accurate, to dismiss a whole swathe of society with a throw away line about wimps.

Not sure what that means timetogo are you meaning she shouldn’t have gone to the olympics at all when she was on top form ??? Do you mean she should have said I won’t go and take up a place because I might, just might have a panic attack or I might, just might have flashbacks that make me unable to carry on She couldn’t foresee how it would go before the day any more than Zola Budd knew she was going to crash into someone and become a hated character for years
It happened, to lose her attention, or her confidence for a split second could leave her injured for life so she sensibly said no I m going to stand aside let someone else get a medal I m not up to it at this point of time
What on earth is wrong with that?

Perhaps it takes someone who has experienced genuine mental health issues, either themselves or in a close friend or family member, to recognise that there is a big difference between those issues and the sort of attitude displayed by MOnica’s American flatmate and a great many today who whine about their mental health because it has become a fashionable thing to do. I’m not saying that genuine mental health problems shouldn’t be talked about and sufferers appropriately supported, because they absolutely should. I have always been open about my depression and also the epilepsy I suffer from because it’s important that people realise these things can happen to anyone and that the sufferer, surprise surprise, is an entirely normal looking person who with the correct treatment is holding down a pretty high powered job. Another expression I might use, equally as unpopular as the mental health card, is sorting the wheat from the chaff. Very often those with real problems don’t talk about them, sometimes with tragic consequences. Those who refer constantly to their mental health are in my opinion less likely to be genuine sufferers. And I agree entirely with Doodledog - if you can’t handle high levels of stress, and not everyone can, then you shouldn’t be in an occupation in which stress is unavoidable and then disappear leaving your colleagues to pick up the pieces. I can handle stress, therefore continued to honour my obligations leaving the black dog at the office door. Not everyone can do that, nor do I expect them to - a favourite phrase of my mother was ‘there’s no such word as can’t’ and I’m sure that toughened me up. But I do expect that if you aren’t the sort of person who can take stress, you find a less stressful occupation.

There are times in all our lives where we inconvenience others at work and elsewhere. In times of bereavement, illness, accident, maternity we are less able to give to others and we put ourselves first. When others are in the same position we support them, as Simone Biles team mates seem to have willingly done.

That's what it is to be human isn't it? We don't consider us inconvenienced, we help.

Perhaps the lack of compassion shown by the 'you've just got to push on through and not play the mental health card' view expects us to be machines and not humans. I strongly believe that contributes to our mental health problem.

Stephen Fry has endured lifelong mental health problems. Would we really rather he'd sat in a room with a blanket over his knees for fear that he might one day 'inconvenience us' by not being able to perform? Or would we rather he worked within his own boundaries and producing us with 40 odd years of brilliant comedy.

Just a little compassion allows people space to do their best.

Anybody who uses the word "whine" in a post about mental health has lost all credibility for me, I'm afraid.

Can I play my "don't think much of people who judge others" card?

‘there’s no such word as can’t’? - There is, though.

And who are we to decide what is wheat and what is chaff?

But how do you sort the wheat from the chaff. You said previously you didnt know anything about Simone, so do you somehow magically 'know' about the circumstances of the other people you are talking about. Basically what gives you the skills to decide this.