Assigned female at birth

Used correctly then.

MissAdventure

Flamdoodle.
That's a great word.

Thank you MissAdventure. It came into my mind as I wrote, so I looked it up to make sure I was using it correctly before the posting police jumped on me.
Definition of flamdoodle
dialectal. : nonsense especially : pretentious nonsense

But I've been informed that there are those who don't know what a cervix is, or whether they indeed have one. How true that is, or how many individuals don't actually know what it is must be minute, surely

Well Keir Starmer doesn't know for a start! When Rosie Duffield dared to state the bleeding obvious she not only was trolled online for being transphobic but Starmer said that she "was wrong to say that only women have a cervix."

Flamdoodle.
That's a great word.

Thank you so much Doodledog for responding so clearly and so effectively with all the flamdoodle that you quoted in your post at 21:52.

Dickens
An invitation for a cervical smear test is open to anyone who's got one, surely
Yes and for those who don’t know what one is, it’s a valid reason for asking Dr Google.

Doodledog

Not speaking for PP here, but why not just invite the granddaughter in for a smear? I've never needed to have things like that explained to me. 'Dear Mrs Dog, You are invited to come for a mammogram as we believe you have breasts' would be equally ridiculous. Also, as I suspect you are aware, Heart Failure is a specific diagnosis that does not mean that a heart has stopped functioning, and rehabilitation is not just about addiction, but any post-operative recovery.

Thank you Mrs Dog (LOL!) for simplifying an issue that appears to have been the subject of 'overthinking'. "you are invited for a smear test of your cervix" should really be all that's necessary.
But I've been informed that there are those who don't know what a cervix is, or whether they indeed have one. How true that is, or how many individuals don't actually know what it is must be minute, surely? And if indeed you get a letter inviting you for a test on a part of your anatomy of which you are unfamiliar, surely you pick up the 'phone and ask - what is this test and why do I need it? And if the recipient has mental health problems or learning difficulties, they will probably have a guardian who can explain it to them - as probably happens already.

Making simple things more complicated in order to find the right wording for the sake of inclusivity and then making it more confusing, is just ridiculous. An invitation for a cervical smear test is open to anyone who's got one, surely?

Oh, I thought the idea was to role-play an 18th century vicar in my view-sharing activity. I was just starting to enjoy myself ?

Oh the irony!

And yet you refer to "the fairer sex" Doodle.

In Sisterhood, may we continue to share our differing views, and not simply flatten those who disagree.

Would you prefer your granddaughter's letter to say, "because we believe you have a cervix? Perhaps that would be more relevant?
Not speaking for PP here, but why not just invite the granddaughter in for a smear? I've never needed to have things like that explained to me. 'Dear Mrs Dog, You are invited to come for a mammogram as we believe you have breasts' would be equally ridiculous. Also, as I suspect you are aware, Heart Failure is a specific diagnosis that does not mean that a heart has stopped functioning, and rehabilitation is not just about addiction, but any post-operative recovery.

Herefornow, thank you so much for introducing the many variations of chromosomal and hormonal sex/gender decision-making. Presumably there are others, but I did discover about these more than fifty years ago.
Go you. Did you get recognised for your discovery? Shame you didn't learn to differentiate between sex and gender though - there is more than a '/' that separates them.

I think that perhaps A problem here is that whilst it may not be useful to divide humans into male and female, it may help to divide us into those who want to keep learning new things and those who are frightened to have their concepts questioned.
Why might that help, and who would benefit? My own thoughts are that dividing humans into male and female is often useful - eg for competitive sport where strength is relevant, for situations where there are cultural expectations that they aren't mixed, and where there is risk to the female because of the possibility of being overpowered by a stronger male in a situation where there are no witnesses and clothing is removed. So there you are. We disagree. Did anyone ask you whether you felt that your views should over-rule centuries of custom and practice, incidentally? Nobody asked me for my views on the matter, and no women I know have been consulted on the matter either.

All hail anyone questioning the singularity/duality of so-called sex/gender. May we, in the fulness of time, learn how to resolve the issues of who we allow to compete against each other in sports.
Have we gone back to 1780? A pox on all who wish to diminish the hard-won rights of the female of the species! Cursed be they who confound the likelihood of the fairer sex winning medals for sporting prowess!

Sorry not hithere but herefornow.

So we'll just ignore the sky high suicide, murder, domestic violence, rape, and hate crime statistics for trans women

Not wanting to ignore all that hi there, could you give us some figures for those things, please?

it may help to divide us into those who want to keep learning new things and those who are frightened to have their concepts questioned.

And another way of putting it is: those who want to keep denying that women are at risk from sexually predatory men who present as women so that they can access women when they are at their most vulnerable. And those who are so desperate to be seen as down wid da kids that they're happily throwing women under a bus, whilst smiling beningnly and telling us that they're just trying to be kind to penis people.

A problem here is that whilst it may not be useful to divide humans into male and female, it may help to divide us into those who want to keep learning new things and those who are frightened to have their concepts questioned.

Derisory. And disingenuous... because you know well that this is not the issue.

Your comment is equally as provocative as the OP that engendered the subsequent discussion.

You believe a more generalised approach to discuss these issues "might be better"? There is nothing 'generalised' about your posting.

Hi Pinkprincess. Would you prefer your granddaughter's letter to say, "because we believe you have a cervix*? Perhaps that would be more relevant? But the NHS has a history of choosing names for its clinics that don't meet with patients' wholehearted approval. Eg "Heart Failure Clinic" (for people whose hearts are functioning less well than before, but still functioning! and "Rehabilitation" for people who may never have had an addiction problem). None of these names change the function nor the usefulness of the service offered.

Herefornow, thank you so much for introducing the many variations of chromosomal and hormonal sex/gender decision-making. Presumably there are others, but I did discover about these more than fifty years ago.
I think that perhaps A problem here is that whilst it may not be useful to divide humans into male and female, it may help to divide us into those who want to keep learning new things and those who are frightened to have their concepts questioned.
I do think that it might be better to discuss some of the issues on this post in a more generalised way, but appreciate the value of a letter shown to a grandmother (perhaps specifically to wind "her" up?) becoming the trigger for the discussion.
All hail anyone questioning the singularity/duality of so-called sex/gender. May we, in the fulness of time, learn how to resolve the issues of who we allow to compete against each other in sports. I am looking forward to the hockey game where only people who play as poorly as me are allowed to play, regardless of whether their genitalia hangs or is "neatly" tucked up.

Odd isn't it how what is actually said is digested and regurgitated by some as something completely different.

What I'm hearing, bar one or two inspired comments, is that the way to solve everything is for transwomen to take themselves back off under the rock they came from.

... that's what you are hearing. Not what is being said.

It's not even a status quo where women have achieved equality with men, but apparently you like things as they've been

No, we don't. Which is why women still fight against patriarchical ideology.

Herefornow

What I'm hearing, bar one or two inspired comments, is that the way to solve everything is for transwomen to take themselves back off under the rock they came from.

So we'll just ignore the sky high suicide, murder, domestic violence, rape, and hate crime statistics for trans women and chalk that up to the price we pay for the status quo. It's not even a status quo where women have achieved equality with men, but apparently you like things as they've been. Thank god the young folk have more sense than us.

What you’re hearing is only things that support what you want to think is true.
If you’ve read anything on GN you must have read that most posters want only for the ill-intentioned TW to stop claiming female rights to jobs, safe spaces and the right not to find males cheating their way to dubious success by claiming to be women. If you approve of those ill-intentioned, you have my deepest contempt, or my sympathy if you can’t help it.
As for young folk having more sense, I have personal experience of coping with girls being bullied by trans boys who have found power by demanding that fellow pupils who do things like use the wrong pronoun (these are all girls in school uniform so indistinguishable) are punished for being transphobic. The staff are evidently powerless to stop it and award detentions and demerits on the word of the ‘in’ gang.

When I met with some of the girls at the root of the movement and suggested that they would be happier at an all boys or at least a mixed school the answer from one * was, “Where’s the fun in that?”
The ill-intentioned know exactly what they are doing, but they don’t have the support of most trans.

Thank you for adding your voice Herefornow

No one's suggesting that trans women "take themselves back off under the rock they came from" Herefornow. Why can't we have a sensible discussion?

If you wish to disagree with what's being said then you'd be much better off challenging what's actually being said.

Do you mean in the uk herefornow. Thankfully the figures are very low for murder. There have also been warnings about how dangetous it is to use the suicide statistics in the way you are doing.

To deal with those issues, a good starting point would be to acknowledge them.
Not huddle together and deny they happen.

What I'm hearing, bar one or two inspired comments, is that the way to solve everything is for transwomen to take themselves back off under the rock they came from.

So we'll just ignore the sky high suicide, murder, domestic violence, rape, and hate crime statistics for trans women and chalk that up to the price we pay for the status quo. It's not even a status quo where women have achieved equality with men, but apparently you like things as they've been. Thank god the young folk have more sense than us.

Only just checking in and am at the parallels being drawn between women being concerned at the erosion of their rights and QANON!! Best laugh I've had for a while!

Such a shame that Mollymalone6 hasn't posted for a while.

Here is a snippet from the ongoing employment tribunal of Maya Forstater.
It shows a representative of her employer stating that the 'reality' of some people must not be shaken by reference to actual reality.

I'd be very interested if someone, oldladynewlife maybe, could explain why someone's idea of 'reality' should supersede actual reality and the accepted meanings of words.