Refugees - How will our finances cope?

I should have added JaneJudge, that doing that must be from desperation and hope that someone, somewhere, would take them in and care for them.

I knew someone whose DGC were sent out to Australia under the orphan scheme. I would love to be able to find them and tell them how their grandmother never forgot them and always wanted to care for them.

I had a work colleague/friend who was a Hungarian refugee and friends (two families) who were refugees from Uganda.

I cannot imagine putting a child on a boat, big or small and thinking that was the best thing for them
My Hungarian friend arrived alone as a child and was taken in by two women. One Ugandan friend arrived alone too but has made a very good life here.

All of them have contributed enormously to this country.
They are all assets, not drains on our economy.

I had two work colleagues who arrived as children on the kinder transport. Every member of their families perished in the camps. They were older and more experienced at our work than I was. I remember them with affection gratitude and respect fir their support and fir being such good role models
Refugees often contribute hugely to the country thst offers refuge.

my family member was a small child who travelled alone fwiw

I think I'm a bit exasperated. I cannot imagine putting a child on a boat, big or small and thinking that was the best thing for them.

Displacement is traumatic and just quite frankly, horrible and unnecessary in a modern world. It all just makes me so sad

I don't really want to go over my own family history but if one of my relatives hadn't got to safety here and their family followed, I wouldn't have been born. Two generations ago my family were discriminated against because of who they were and where they came from and our foreign names. Maybe to some of us it is more personal. I don't know.

Thank you for your reply Gelleh

Yes JJ your reply on the subject that fee paying schools might offer places was that my comment was "crass". I chose not to take you up on it because I do not think you are nasty and judgmental, just frustrated and irritated by the system, and seeing it from your own perspective.
I am glad we all agree that every child is precious.

Mamardoit

Yes I will take the cut and paste back. There was no need.
But the Do I win?.....What the hell was the poster getting at? It was pathetic coming from a supposedly educated adult.

Everyone is entitled to post. I've said nothing that is anti refugees.

Not the cut and paste …the “nasty”

Mamardoit

Yes I will take the cut and paste back. There was no need.
But the Do I win?.....What the hell was the poster getting at? It was pathetic coming from a supposedly educated adult.

Everyone is entitled to post. I've said nothing that is anti refugees.

Why I am I supposedly educated?

I have just read back the thread. I think I took offence at I'm not sure how the fee paying parents would feel about free places being offered to host children and refugees

in one of your earlier posts but I have read your full post back and it was very measured.

I think I have been surrounded by so many parents who think their children are more precious than mine because theirs go to private school, that my mind went to 'why are their children more important than refugees' . I posted with an unconscious bias and I apologise. Everyone's children are precious.

That should say more money in this country now in total...

According to GillT57, UK is a rich country and we have pots of money, yes but it is actually borrowed money £2.3 trillion debt in fact and the government is spending money like there is no tomorrow.

Do you know where a country's money comes from, SporeRB ?. Can you explain why there is money in this country now, in total, than there was, say, 50 years ago when the population was 56million, as opposed to 68 million now? And people earn more than they did at that time? How did we get enough money to share between 12 million more people and actually increase everyone's share?

Magic?

If you and I spend money the way this government (under Boris Johnson) spends its money, we will be declared bankrupt by now.

Just about every single economist will tell you that a national is not the same as a household economy. A government that issues its own currency cannot run out of money.

I think we'll manage fine to accommodate a few 1,000s more people.

Maudi

I have no problem with the Ukrainian refugees they are fleeing a war and they are mostly women, children and the elderly and will probably want to go back to Ukraine when this terrible war is over. I'm not so happy about the mostly young fit men coming over in the dingeys who we are putting up in hotels.

sorry maudi, i must disagree. these young men are also fleeing for their lives from a war torn country having paid thousands to criminal people traffickers only to risk their lives crossing the channel in a dinghy with just a thin layer of rubber between them and the very real possibility of drowning.
off my soapbox now!

Yes I will take the cut and paste back. There was no need.
But the Do I win?.....What the hell was the poster getting at? It was pathetic coming from a supposedly educated adult.

Everyone is entitled to post. I've said nothing that is anti refugees.

Message deleted as it quotes a deleted post.

JaneJudge, a word of support. No you are nit judgemental or nasty.
What’s happening on this forum

I don't know Calistemon, I just know people can enter the country on work visas to do any of those jobs listed as we have shortage in the UK. I am not sure why people are getting their knickers in a twist about a small number of refugees fleeing their home country which is being bombed to high heaven.

I am neither judgemental or nasty either. People are presenting problems and there are already provisions in place to meet these needs. It is neither here or there that you wont put your own 4 year old grandson in a taxi with escort - that is your choice. There is still transport to school provided though in instances such as those.

It is awful people are having poor outcomes from our health service but it lies at the hands of our government.

If your job is on the list, you can be paid 80% of the job’s usual going rate to qualify for a Skilled Worker visa.

I'm not sure if I'm reading this right, JaneJudge but does that mean skilled workers who apply for visas to do jobs on the list will only be paid 80% of the going rate for the job?
ie getting them here to do skilled work on the cheap and undercutting British workers although we have a shortage of people already here who are skilled enough to do the jobs anyway.

iyswim

3411Artists – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £16,800(£8.28 per hour)
What kind of artists? Painting murals in schools and hospitals? I didn't take Art GCE (long story, I won't bore you) but I did gain an NVQ in Art when I was about 65.
I'd need double the pay though.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Good point Merylstreep, and for info:

The Ukraine” was previously used as a shortened version of “the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic,” and therefore saying “the Ukraine” refers to a time that many Ukrainians would rather not reference.

I will make sure I use the correct title from now on

Can some stop calling Ukraine as The Ukraine. It’s Ukraine
There is no The in the Ukrainian language.

Beanutz2115

What’s the difference between the illegals and refugees? I know there is one but I’m not sure what it is.

Tell us first what an 'illegal' is.

Refugees -how will they cope without our financial help?

What’s the difference between the illegals and refugees? I know there is one but I’m not sure what it is.

Lilly of the Valley
I am sure you have no fears , How ever long it takes, the menfolk of the Ukraine will NOT desert their country.
Knowing wives and children are safe allowing them to do what is essential.

And in Syria, parts of Africa and Lebanon

Anyone can apply for a work visa to come and work and live in the Uk for the following jobs (taken from the gov.uk website)

Skilled Worker visa: shortage occupations
Updated 15 February 2022

Check which jobs are on the shortage occupations list in each area of the UK.

If your job is on the list, you can be paid 80% of the job’s usual going rate to qualify for a Skilled Worker visa.

The annual salaries for these jobs are based on a 39-hour working week. They must be pro-rated for other working patterns, based on the weekly working hours stated by your employer.

There’s a different list of shortage occupations for some jobs if you work in healthcare or education.

If you do not know your job’s occupation code, you can search for your job in the ONS occupation coding tool.

Occupation codeJob types included on the shortage occupations listAreas of the UK where there is a shortageAnnual salary (80% of going rate)

1181Health services and public health managers and directors – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £30,720 (£15.15 per hour)

1242Residential, day and domiciliary care managers and proprietors – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £21,360 (£10.53 per hour)

2111Chemical scientists – only jobs in the nuclear industryScotland only80% of going rate: £21,360(£10.53 per hour)

2112Biological scientists and biochemists – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £23,760(£11.72 per hour)

2113Physical scientists – only the following jobs in the construction-related ground engineering industry:
engineering geologist
hydrogeologist
geophysicistEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £29,200(£14.40 per hour)

2113Physical scientists – only the following jobs in the oil and gas industry:
geophysicist
geoscientist
geologist
geochemist
technical services manager in the decommissioning and waste areas of the nuclear industry
senior resource geologist and staff geologist in the mining sectorEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £29,200(£14.40 per hour)

2114Social and humanities scientists – only archaeologistsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £20,720(£10.22 per hour)

2121Civil engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £28,000(£13.81 per hour)

2122Mechanical engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £26,720(£13.18 per hour)

2123Electrical engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £29,600(£14.60 per hour)

2124Electronics engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £27,760(£13.69 per hour)

2126Design and development engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £27,280(£13.45 per hour)

2127Production and process engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £26,480(£13.06 per hour)

2129Engineering professionals not elsewhere classified – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £26,160(£12.90 per hour)

2135IT business analysts, architects and systems designers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £29,280(£14.44 per hour)

2136Programmers and software development professionals – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £26,640(£13.14 per hour)

2137Web design and development professionals – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £20,800(£10.26 per hour)

2139Information technology and communications professionals not elsewhere classified – only cyber security specialistsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £25,440(£12.54 per hour)

2216Veterinarians – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £26,000(£12.82 per hour)

2425Actuaries, economists and statisticians – only bio-informaticians and informaticiansEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £26,240(£12.94 per hour)

2431Architects – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £28,000(£13.81 per hour)

2461Quality control and planning engineers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £24,400(£12.03 per hour)

3111Laboratory technicians – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £14,560 (£7.18 per hour)

3411Artists – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £16,800(£8.28 per hour)

3414Dancers and choreographers – only skilled classical ballet dancers or skilled contemporary dancers who meet the standard required by internationally recognised UK ballet or contemporary dance companies.
The company must be endorsed as being internationally recognised by a UK industry body such as the Arts Councils (of England, Scotland or Wales).England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £23,840(£11.76 per hour)

3415Musicians – only skilled orchestral musicians who are leaders, principals, sub-principals or numbered string positions, and who meet the standard required by internationally recognised UK orchestras.
The orchestra must a full member of the Association of British Orchestras.England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £22,000 (£10.85 per hour)

3416Arts officers, producers and directors – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £24,000(£11.83 per hour)

3421Graphic designers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £18,800(£9.27 per hour)

5215Welding trades – only high integrity pipe welders, where the job requires 3 or more years’ related on-the-job experience. This experience must not have been gained through illegal working.England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £18,240(£8.99 per hour)

6145Care workers and home carers - private households or individuals (other than sole traders sponsoring someone to work for their business) cannot sponsor Skilled Worker applicantsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern IrelandNo going rate – the salary must be at least £20,480 per year or £10.10 per hour

6146Senior care workers – all jobsEngland, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland80% of going rate: £13,520 (£6.67 per hour)