woops!!!! I have been told I have really upset a Grandchild

I'm sorry you were made to feel guilty by this innocent error. I find it increasingly difficult to keep up with all the appropriate terms, and am regularly told off by DD for using inapprorpriate language. You are not allowed to call a child a cheeky monkey now, it's cheeky munchkin, but I sometimes forget. One of our grandchilden had a teeshirt years ago saying 'daddy's cheeky monkey' from when they were small, and I see nothing wrong with this, but of course I wouldn't would I as somebody famously said. I think more courtest should be given to a memeber of the older generation when slip-ups like this happen, as they will. Describing a person as 'black' was deemd the hight of rudeness when I was young, we said a 'coloured person' which of course sounds hidious now, but that was what we were brought up to say and thought it respectful. We have to accept these changes and most are definitely for the better but as you get older, it's easy to forget the rules.

Allira

The original name is the one on the birth certificate unless it has been changed by deed poll.

Is the DGC going to be this upset every time someone in officialdom uses the name by which they were registered? What is on their passport, driving licence etc?

Atm we don't know if the name has been changed officially? Too much we don't know - is GC at college? work? How old?

Silverbrooks

Nonsense. If someone changes their name, we should respect that choice and use that name henceforth.

When someone has been married for years and took their spouse's surname but we happened to know them when they were younger and single, we don’t carry on calling them by their former surname, do we?

We do in my family. I have loads of first and second cousins and we always refer to them by their first name and surname.

I use my surname professionally and socially but some people know me by my married name if they are friends or acquaintances of DH.

I also changed my first name, much to my mother's annoyance and it makes me cringe inwardly on the, increasingly rare occasions, that people use my old first name. But I would not make an issue of it.

I think it was bad manners and an over-reaction on the part of your GC to call you out over it.

theworriedwell

Luckygirl3

I do not think that Franbern used the wrong name or pronoun. She simply referenced a family event in the past at a time when her GC was being her own biological self gender-wise. History cannot be wiped out and people should feel free to reference the past.

People who seek to change their gender should show tolerance to others, just as they ask tolerance from us.

How about if the GC decides to call the old bag, is that ok? I mean if that's how the GC remembers her why shouldn't she?

Oh that's right basic good manners.

What rubbish.

Franbrrn was not calling her DGC an abusive name; se used the birth name and the name they have been known by for many years.

Incidentally, if someone decides they are binary, do they choose a hyphenated name as their future name?

Allira

The original name is the one on the birth certificate unless it has been changed by deed poll.

Is the DGC going to be this upset every time someone in officialdom uses the name by which they were registered? What is on their passport, driving licence etc?

It appears that the grandchild feels rather hurt because of "who" did it and "how" they dismissed their feelings. The topic doesn't matter, respect your family and their feelings. We write our opinions here and they are very soon forgotten and hardly important to anyone.

you have my sympathy I go through this with one of my grandkids. she was a lovely sweet child but when my daughter and her father split for a while it got very nasty due to the mother. I kept out of it bar getting my daughter a flat and furnishing it but then she said she could not afford to keep, he kept breaking contact said all the time to her mum was nasty. then told he had a council flat and she was spending Christmas with them. next thing pregnant and back together! anyway all round the houses but I am sure that affected her for life. she had a lot of trouble settling to work, school work before was a nightmare then I got the message she was a lesbian now she has decided she is a man. she wanders round in a harry potter type cloak not quite goth not sure what she is a strange sad girl. nearly 22 still lives at home does not social its just work back to bed etc.my daughters and I have a bad relationship so I have to be careful what I say but I inevitably get it wrong so do not worry I know exactly what you are going through

westendgirl

I think Franbern has been very generous and caring in sending a card with an apology for an unintentional error. I hope the rest of the family are as generous to her accepting that we all make mistakes.

Agreed.

People are so easily offended these days. If they want you to use their choice of words then they should post a daily update of acceptable language.
My DD would not have spoken to me like that, never in 56 years has she shown that lack of respect.
Franbern did not make a mistake she was merely reminiscing.

I think the OP's daughter should explain to the grandchild that her lovely grandmother is an old lady. That she has been caring and supportive for many years and that her comment was not remotely malicious. She should also explain that the anecdote (about being a bridesmaid) was factual. For example, records released by the artist Cat Stevens are credited to that name because that's what he was at the time. Records released after he became a Muslim are credited to his Islamic name of Yusuf Islam because that's what he is now. Respect and empathy is a two way street and the daughter needs to learn that otherwise she will be a very self absorbed individual.

From the OP the GD hadn't complained to her GM. She hated her old name being used, no one can dictate how she should feel. The OP should either leave it alone and not do it again and it will be forgotten or sincerely apologise, a grudgingvapology just makes it worse.

I've always been very LGBTQ+ friendly, trans, liquid etc. and I have absolutely no problem with them at all but I have to admit with so many swapping genders and inter-gendering and self-identifying as some sort of non-human's etc. etc. it can be incredibly confusing, especially if the person changes their genders and pronouns and species multiple times over the years!

Personally, if I was actually you, I'd apologize the first time as you made a genuine ''mistake'' but I'd make it VERY clear to them that you'll not apologize any more for that or any other mispronunciations in the future .

As one of my American elderly patients says about ''offended'' persons, ''suck it up and grow up, baby!''

I'm sorry you were made to feel guilty by this innocent error

It was NOT an "error" - she spoke the truth whilst remembering an event that happened in the past.

People who change their gender owe respect to those around them, as well as the other way round.

My transitioning GC would never dream of being so touchy or disrespectful of me. We have been clear about respecting their current position whilst not wiping out who they once were. Both are people we love/have loved.

It is a mark of maturity in a transitioned/transitioning person to grasp that.

I wonder what would happen if the couple whose wedding it was decide to get out their wedding photos at a family event, eg a special anniversary?

We've been to anniversary parties (and other events) where the album of wedding photos has been displayed on a side table so guests can browse through and reminisce.

I suppose guests would just browse through?
I don't see any problems with that.

I don't understand what you said earlier about people who are binary having hyphenated names though...

NotSpaghetti

I suppose guests would just browse through?
I don't see any problems with that.

I don't understand what you said earlier about people who are binary having hyphenated names though...

Or perhaps just choose a non-binary name so it would suit however they're feeling on that day.

Dear God! I really feel for you Franbern, you obviously meant no harm on this occasion, as evidenced by your careful use of their " pronouns" on previous social events. I would not have apologised; if grown adults who have decided to change their gender cannot excuse a genuine mistake from an 84 year old struggling, along with the rest of us, with gender dysphoria, pronouns, intersex and puberty blockers then I'm afraid I would leave them to get on with it.

Allsorts

Least said, soonest mended. I would have apologised for it as don't want family fall outs, in my opinion you did nothing wrong, how on earth can anyone keep up with all this I don't know. I would keep out of the way in future. What a ridiculous phase, deadnaming, is someone sitting in an office somewhere making all these things up. You are a good mother and gran, they should think on that. The worlds gone mad.

Yes, the worlds gone mad. I'm afraid I can't figure it all out.

rafichagran

This is so tedious, thank God my Grandchildren are not a lot of Primadonnas.
The Grandmother made a error in the name, so what, does it really need a upset Grandaugher and a hand ringing Mother saying how upset she is. If it was me I would be telling my teen child to get over it and it's not all about them and Gran made a mistake that's all.

Hear Hear. So would I.

I have never heard of dead naming.
Every day is a schoolday (I have heard of that).

What a minefield we walk amongst. However upsetting the mistake was for the adult, surely they can then cut some slack for an old lady who was talking about the olden days.

God forbid you get dementia, you'll be misgendering them til kingdom come and they'll be distraught.

She hated her old name being used, no one can dictate how she should feel.

And no one can dictate what the OPs memories or feelings are either. In the memory that OP was recalling, her grandchild was known by a particular name at that time and when she was recounting that incident, she recalled that associated name. The fact that grandchild has since swithered between several names, genders and identities is for them to come to terms with; it's no one else's responsibility to rewrite history for them. They can be anything and anyone they want to be. What they can't do is alter someone else's reality.

Well said, ohohoh. They also can't alter actual reality, which is that human can't change sex and that genderism is just about trying to force others to toe each individual's line however crazy and mixed-up it is.

For the entire history of hominids over millennia 99.9% of the population has been able to tell clearly which ones are male and which ones are female. As can other sexually reproducing animals.

Baggs

Well said, ohohoh. They also can't alter actual reality, which is that human can't change sex and that genderism is just about trying to force others to toe each individual's line however crazy and mixed-up it is.

For the entire history of hominids over millennia 99.9% of the population has been able to tell clearly which ones are male and which ones are female. As can other sexually reproducing animals.

This will do a rather wonderful job of ruining a relationship don't you think? Is your opinion more important than that?

Luminance

Baggs

Well said, ohohoh. They also can't alter actual reality, which is that human can't change sex and that genderism is just about trying to force others to toe each individual's line however crazy and mixed-up it is.

For the entire history of hominids over millennia 99.9% of the population has been able to tell clearly which ones are male and which ones are female. As can other sexually reproducing animals.

This will do a rather wonderful job of ruining a relationship don't you think? Is your opinion more important than that?

My comment is not advice, Luminance. I am not related to the individual mentioned in the OP so he/she/it/they will not be affected by what I think 😊

I would hope that the OP would come strongly to the defence against "it".

Me too. But what does "non-binary" mean?