Are we ladies or women?

Many were offended by Blurred Lines, the "bitch" word was the least if it.

eazybee

A gentleman of 85,and I use the term deliberately, referred to the females working in the Library (no longer assistant librarians but customer service advisors)

... I object to assistant librarians being referred to as "customer service advisors" far more than ladies being women or vice versa.

I once heard a medic refer to patients as a "service users" (The Queen Elizabeth Hospital, Birmingham).

Dehumanising corporate-speak.

Sometimes we are women and others, ladies.

I don't get fussed about "guys" - it's inclusive and I think usually meant to be.

Recently listened to the song "Blurred Lines" (Pharrell Williams & Robin Thicke), and noted the line, "you the cutest bitch in this place".

I am offended by that.

I am torn on this. I can’t get the image and voice of Dave Walliams’ character “I’m a lady” out of my head or All Murrays’ pub landlord “white wine for the lady please”.
The fitting rooms in the shop where I work say Women and Men but I find myself referring to ladies for female customers etc.
If I think it’s important and relevant I prefer woman. But as noted above it does sound clunky when addressing “that woman there” for example. 🤔

Btw this same friend objects strongly in shops etc if they call her darling, love, chick or any other similar term.

I’m reminded of something I read in a novel not long ago, employee announcing to employer that there was a ‘lady’ to see him. Employer knew from the very slight emphasis on the word, that this was a lady who wasn’t ’quite’ a lady.

(Of course this was written in a former era, probably pre WW2.

Never really thought about. The behaviour that accompanies the speaker is more important than that to me

Next time she moans about being called a lady, call her a man!

Iam64

Deedaa, I’d much prefer to be referred to as the woman.

Me too!

Coming back to this I think it's the optics between the two. Ladies having a connotation of feeble and weak from a bygone era, as in "a lady feeling faint because her corset was laced too tightly" or men patronisingly prone to say at a mixed gathering "not in front of the ladies" "that's no way for a lady to behave" "she's no lady" An onus placed on women to behave in a preordained feminine way, which tends to veer on the side of being delicate and restrained.

Women on the other hand implies strength to me "Votes for Women" as heralded by the Suffragettes, "The Women of Troy" or the BBC production "Riot Women", or one of my latest books "The Women" nurses during the Vietnam war. Women do the serious stuff, Boudica would have definitely been a woman and not a lady if such terminology applied at the time. Ladies do the frivolous stuff, they lunch, they wear lavender as in "Ladies in Lavender" they must not hear anything deemed vulgar, they're fragile and precious, they need to be revived with smelling salts. All archaic I know but the very word is imbued in images of a bygone era.

I'd like to add, that I don't care really, I'm just adding my thoughts to the OP, woman is my preference but I certainly wouldn't dream of opposing anyone who wants the lady/ies description.

What a rude woman Dragonfly. I am a lady, a woman, Does it matter? one thing I can't stand is someone saying, aw bless as if I am in my dotage, but I never snap a reply back, some people are on high alert for anything to moan at.

Deedaa, I’d much prefer to be referred to as the woman.

I'm not really bothered whether I'm a lady, a woman, or a guy, but it has always grated when first David Dimbleby and then Fiona Bruce refer to female questioners as women. "Can we hear from the woman in the blue top?" Would it really hurt to say "the lady" ?

ClicketyClick

I dislike the use of guys no matter what gender it's being used to address someone. Ladies/women - it depends on the situation. I do say I'm meeting the girls but I'd never dream of saying I'm going to the woman's which just sounds bizarre.

Not if you’re going to a women’s meeting or the women’s institute 🌞

I dislike the use of guys no matter what gender it's being used to address someone. Ladies/women - it depends on the situation. I do say I'm meeting the girls but I'd never dream of saying I'm going to the woman's which just sounds bizarre.

It’s not what you say it’s the way that you say it. To quote my Dad

I’ve just remembered that my American GC sometimes say ‘Bro’ or ‘Bruh’ when talking to people. My DS and DIL try to pull them up in it but they’re not having much success. Guys now seems quite old-fashioned.

I'm easy with all those terms: I've heard women called much worse.
Interesting that I just used 'women' rather than 'ladies', as referring to a group of ladies sounds odd and old fashioned.
I would have liked to have been a lady in the old days with all that glamour, but the term doesn't quite fit me now.
I always refer to 'us girls' when I'm with my group of female friends: why not.

Dh’s old aunt still referred to her bridge-playing cronies (all 80 plus) as ‘the girls’.

Like others, the only one I object to is ‘you guys’, especially when applied to a mixed or entirely female group of obviously well over 60s.

But it does surely depend on the circs. Addressing a large group with ‘Good afternoon, men and women’ does sound weird and clunky compared with ‘ladies and gentlemen’.

The receptionist at my David Lloyd referred to the groups of ‘lovely ladies’* who attend the Aquacise classes.

*nearly all old and fat, from what I’ve seen, so I wouldn’t feel at all out of place! 😂 - but all the yelling and loud music does put me right off.

Ladies, woman whatever you like is fine. Anyone who objects to being called a lady needs to have head wobble. It's a pleasantry and there are lots of horrible things we can be called by some people these days.

Intonation means everything but you can be just as derogatory using the term “woman” or indeed complemantary.
“Wife” can be uncomfortable, indeed a few years ago a club I was a member determined that all wives and partners were to be referred to as “Partners”, those that were wives objected very strongly and the whole idea was dropped.

For me, it is much more the tone of the what is said rather than the words themselves. I am quite happy for it to be welcome ladies or whatever if said in a proper manner for the occasion, whether it is welcoming members of the wi or the gardening club or whatever. I dislike what I perceive is actually rather a condescending tone, often when men choose to talk about "the ladies" in a patronising and belittling manner in a mixed group. My red rag to a bull moment is much more when men refer to "the wife" ! Fine to refer to "my wife" or by her name , but to me the wife implies firstly she is owned by the man, and definitely not a courteous way to refer to her at all. You never hear them say "the mother" or "the daughter" and although you would thing that using "my" is more possessive, yet it is seen as the normal and polite term. So personally I would be more likely to refer in a general way to say something such as "welcome everyone to the gardening club, or Ladies and Gentlemen we are ready to begin or whatever so I dont specifically think about it, but say what appears to be the natural polite terms used for that occasion. I used to enjoy watching Betty Boothroyd in the chair of parliament, whose "right honourable member" could sound the whole range from encouraging to a newcomer to and absolute slapdown to anyone trying to get one over on her! I am afraid there have been times when my tone has been quite sarcastic in the past as I ask "the gentleman" for something, when my meaning is quite clear that I do not see him as a gentleman at all!! So horses for courses is my reply

Both. I don’t care

Just say "Good morning" Oreo. It's as simple as that.

I don’t mind either, but as a result of the post I’ve thought about this, and on reflection I don’t like either the terms woman or female, as they are both derivatives of the male term - I’m more than a ‘man with a womb’, I think. At least lady is a unique term.

I think dragonfly was addressing a women's group.

Addressing a group of women as women ‘ Good Morning women’ sounds ridiculous.
If ladies sounds wrong too, tho I can’t see women’s groups objecting to it anyway, there aren’t many other words to use that don’t sound a bit weird.
I don’t like ‘guys’ as we aren’t, and ‘folks’ sounds a bit homespun so I guess saying ‘Good Morning everyone’ is the best alternative.