Is there too much emphasis on qualifications?

I agree with a lot of what others have said. Surely the single most important thing for a nurse is to have a caring nature and have the right kind of attitude towards people which cannot be learned in a classroom. My cousin did well at school she went on to uni in a bid to become a nurse. She enjoyed every bit of the course except the practical training where she had to go onto the wards. She now works in the tax office.

We have had a few engineering graduates come work for us over the years, with the exception of only one most haven’t lasted very long as they have huge chips on their shoulders that means they should start with the “managing directors” job . Not fussed on doing anything “below them” and heaven forbid if you expect them to wash their own cup (isn’t that what I’m for ?) . The best people we have ever had have been those who have gone through old fashioned apprenticeships (not the modern rubbish they have now) . There are some job roles where practical experience, starting at the bottom and working up is worth 100 times more than a piece of paper saying someone is “qualified”.

My education was spasmodic, 7 primary and 3 high schools, the last one of which I left just before I should have sat O levels meant university wasn't even considered. I did a Diploma course and worked as a PA. I did A levels at night school and went on to do a professional qualification in my late 20's. I couldn't have done that without the funding that was then available. I've enjoyed my working life but I wish I'd had a more stable education and the opportunity to go to University at 18.
I made sure that was a possibility for my own children. Studying to A level isn't for everyone and but demonstrating you can stay the course either in education, apprenticeship or working consistently is a key part of growing up.
University is so expensive now yet degrees are essential in nursing and social work, neither of which are going to pay you enough to justify the outlay frankly.
We should invest in our young people. University isn't just about qualifications and those who do Arts rather than Sciences shouldn't be derided. Society is enhanced by the Arts.

The point of university should not be the end goal. It should be about the experience & learning for the sake of learning.

Society is IMO suffering because of the stigma against the classics. I think we could all do with more philosophers, historians and poets etc

Me I did a "means to an end" professional degree.. but think its a dreadful shame that kids are told these days that there is no point in simply studying something they love unless it has a defined graduate career path!

Education is very important for a civilised society, but higher education is not for everyone.
We need an educated workforce at all levels.
When DH and I did our degrees only a small percentage of students went to University and the courses offered were quite restricted.
There were opportunities for people to get qualifications whilst working, for example, in banking, Civil Service or Accountancy. These opportunities do not seem to exist now, unless you have an initial degree first.
My parents had their University opportunities denied them by WW2, although they gained professional qualifications through other routes after the war.
My Grandmother has her University opportunity denied her by the outbreak of WW1, hard enough for a woman to get a degree in those days. She took correspondence courses to gain professional qualifications.
I would like to see more opportunities for those who don’t want to go to university to gain specific knowledge and qualifications in the workplace.
Education at all levels has to be valued.

I agree that apprenticeships and vocational training have a vital place in achieving a good job and quality of life. Quite apart from the debt, University will not suit everyone. As someone has said already, Vocational qualifications need to be better recognised and appreciated.

In my view, there is too much pressure to achieve O and A levels. They need not be the be all and end all. Learning should be valued as a lifetime experience not simply till age 16/18.

Most people who go in to nursing want to do something practical to help people. They are not attracted to it because it gives them the chance to write fully referenced essays.
I think that basic nursing courses should be held at hospitals with in-house education departments with links to universities.
This would attract local people who need work but who cannot travel too far.
Degree courses should still be available but for those who have completed the basic trading and wish to study at greater depth.

^I would like to see more opportunities for those who don’t want to go to university to gain specific knowledge and qualifications in the workplace.
Education at all levels has to be valued^.
J52 I entirely agree with this, and was about to post something similar. Employers seem to be locked into only recognising GCSE, A level and Degree qualifications as being worthy, and people have come to feel that if they don’t possess these qualifications it lessens them in some way and restricts their opportunities. We need more post 16 vocational training courses and we need schools to give less academically able children the incentive and encouragement to pursue other fulfilling routes into worthwhile careers. We also need then to turn out children who are ready for employment and employable. Many aren’t. When I was at school you were very much channelled into the kind of jobs you could do when you left school and these tended to be gender specific, but with day release and night school, opportunities were there for those with the potential to further themselves or change the path they were on and many did. I have two children, one of whom went to university, got a good degree and then got a good job, where she didn’t use any of what she had learned on her degree course. She could probably have got that job on the back of a vocational qualification. My other child took vocational qualifications and has never been out of well paid work.

My father took a degree in chemical engineering after the war and it was essential for his job. My mother didn’t take a degree but as she spoke two languages fluently having been brought up abroad, she worked as a translator for one of the Embassies in London. She did regret not having been to university and both parents supported and urged me on in my academic career.
DH and I both went to university, he took a history degree (which he didn’t really use) and I a law degree. My own degree was essential for my career in law (first step) and I was fortunate that when I graduated in the late 1980’s the loans hadn’t come in! I am now thinking of starting (a bit late?) a masters degree which I don’t need for professional reasons but I have always wanted to do.
Of my 3 AC 2 have degrees both essential for their jobs in social work and teaching, but the youngest is less academic and instead chose a course at an agricultural college with lots of practical work especially with horses which she loved.
University isn’t for everyone but I agree with Janeainsworth that the fees now faced by students are a tragedy as they now put so many young people off the chance to further their academic lives.

Agree with Greyduster. We need people with practical skills. Far too much snobbery about a decent days work.

I agree with notanan2. There is far too much emphasis on ‘useful’ degrees and not enough on degrees that expand the mind. Arts degrees are being sidelined, and we in danger of becoming a philistine society. In fact, I think we already are.

Degrees should be to educate, not to train for a job. Another thing that many prospective students and their teachers often seem to overlook is that not all degrees, or universities, are of the same standard. Just ‘a degree’ means very little now.

One of my sons did computer science and he does work with computers, although the knowledge he gained 25 years ago is obviously hugely out of date now. My other son read geography. His current (very good) job has no connection to the subject, but it needs a well-trnained mind, which is what a good university will give you.

Is there too much emphasis on qualifications?

It depends if we are discussing academic qualifications or all types of qualification.

If I want a plumbing job done, I want a well-qualified plumber to carry out the work.
The same with an electrician, obviously.
As for mechanical fitters - unfortunately the training is often not as rigorous as it was in years past and there is a serious lack of well-qualified marine mechanics.

A plumber, mechanical fitter or electrician could take many years to obtain the right qualifications for the job - perhaps longer than a degree.
Years ago HNDs were a very popular route to careers in engineering etc and sandwich courses were the norm.

Is there anyone on here that can perhaps tell us what employers look for when they look at a candidate who has degree status? How much weight do they give to the actual nature of the degree when balanced against the job on offer, if neither one is related to the other. This is a genuine question.

minimoon if my kids had spent time and money to get a degree and then didn't use the bloomin' thing I'd be incandescent with rage.What a waste ,not only of their time but the system .

paddyann,a good degree is always ‘used’, because it should train the mind in logical thought, ability to weigh evidence and ability to be articulate, among many other things. Unfortunately there are some degrees nowadays that don’t really do this, but it’s the ideal.

Don’t we all want our children to be as well educated as possible? Knowledge is never wasted.

I can only speak from experience Greyduster but we used to get a great many applications for a rather few jobs and doing a 'sift' initially entailed picking those whose qualifications (and perhaps experience) most closely fitted the criteria for the role.

I should add that those who were over-qualified for the job in question were often ruled out too.

Greyduster, my grandson applied for a job, went for the interview. As he and his father (his chauffeur!) were driving home my grandson received a call on his mobile from the person who had interviewed him, she said she had spoken to ‘the boss’ and given his qualifications would he attend an interview with ‘the boss’ who thought my grandson was qualified for a position higher up than the position he had applied for, he did, got the higher position and in just two years has moved up to an even higher position. So his degree did make a difference .

I think there are some young people who would be better off without the pressure of needing to gain qualifications.

I believe those young people could and do make valuable contributions and they are often undervalued.

I'm not sure about some of todays qualifications and I don't like the practice of putting students on courses just to get bums on seats. That's part of the reason I gave up being a tutor.

Some selection processes don't do the student, their tutors, the institution or employers any favours.

Ironically I've never used my law degree for employment but I have used my other degrees. Indeed, I would not have been able to do the jobs I had without them.

Both DD's have relevant degrees but DD2 wanted to do an apprenticeship. At the time it was hard for girls to get an engineering apprenticeship so she did the degree.

Worked out OK for them, they use most of their qualifications in their jobs but isn't always the case.

I do feel sad for those in Debt who's qualifications don't equip them for paid employment.

I think we have a system now that does put too much pressure on young people to get qualifications. I'm not sure anyone is being well served but it is what it is until it changes - Again.