STOP CLAPPING!

What lemongrove says.

‘Not appropriate in that setting’ !!
Now I have heard everything!
An inspiring poem that should appeal to anyone, especially when younger.A poem about doing the best that you possibly can and remaining true to yourself.
PC ness gone crazy yet again.

Q. Do you like Kipling?
A. I don't know, I've never kipled.

The poem does remind people of the "White man rules and conquers" attitude of the Colonial days in history and a time not to be proud of. I think it was mis-placed in that context and removing it was the right thing to do. I am not saying remove it from its place in studies or English Literature. Just that having it on the wall was not appropriate in that setting.

I do not think Manchester University is particularly picked upon by the media any more than any other place of learning. Students are particularly aware of issues and ethics and people's rights. It is part of their age and being a Student. It is important that they think about these things and we, no longer in a University setting, can learn from them.

I have read that Kipling's attitudes could be considered racist.I don't know,enough about him to make a comment on that.
My instinct is not to erase historical figures / authors etc but to use their works to explore the era. But I am open to thoughts that differ on this issue.

Nobody is going to be thrown out of anywhere for clapping.

Funny that, because when the story first broke, earlier this week, The Guardian reported "^at last^ year’s NUS conference said that students who whoop, cheer and clap should face “consequences". What consequences, I wonder?

This isnt the first time that Manchester University has made some startling statements that have been picked up by the media.

Earlier this year, the writer Rudyard Kipling’s “If” poem was scrubbed off a Manchester University building by university students who claim he was a “racist”.
Student leaders at the university declared that Kipling “stands for the opposite of liberation empowerment, and human rights”.

The poem, which had been painted on the wall of the students’ union building by an artist,
was removed by students in a bid to “reclaim” history on behalf of those who have been “oppressed” by “the likes of Kipling”.

It makes sense that a group of people tried to improve a situation for another group. It may not be the ideal solution but at least they tried and are not cynical and smug.

Well, with clapping frowned upon, we now have this Carol Povey of the National Autistic Society told ABC News she understood the university’s position as “many autistic people experience sensory overload.” But her organization did not advocate an outright ban on clapping. “Hand waving might cause sensory overload for people with visual sensitivity.”.... what on earth is a poor appreciative audience to do? What's left? Any ideas?

Which makes even less sense then, at an event, a lot of people clapping and some doing jazz hands.

Lemongrove FYI “The policy was proposed in order to encourage the use of British Sign Language (BSL) clapping during our democratic events to make those events more accessible and inclusive for all. We are not banning audible clapping – we understand that some people may be more comfortable to continue using it.”

Read more at: inews.co.uk/news/clapping-ban-manchester-university-students-union-jazz-hands/

Iam64 I do hope someone will look at this and try to find a solution for blind people. It isn't easy to find solutions that suit everyone, but at least these young people are trying.

I feel a jazzhands coming on ????????????

Why suggest it is me only that is believing this btw when all other posts do too?
Only me ‘peddling this nonsense’........I think not!

Are you saying it didn’t happen PECS that it isn’t an idea put forward by the student union leader in Manchester uni?
Are you saying it was totally made up fake news?
I would like to know exactly what you are saying.

lemongrove you really should find out the fact before peddling this nonsense!s

Nobody is going to be thrown out of anywhere for clapping. I posted the link to the statement from the Student Union that had to be made because the 'story' which is really a non story had been blown up by some journalists to make a political point! And some people believed it {hmm]

No trisher these student leaders don’t act on GN members like a conscience, that’s just laughable.

I wonder what will happen in student debates /talks etc now in Manchester, if some students wish to applaud and not do jazz hands? Will they be thrown out of the hall?

Student Unions seek to impose restrictions is some form or other, Universities used to be hotbeds for free speech, but sadly not any more.

Thanks trisher for reminding us that this isn't just 'snowflakery" its based in attempting to care for others. I still wonder how it can be made easier for blind people, I'm sure theres a way
Apologies for using the term 'snowflake' - it's so offensive.

Petra

I think it's a bit like using the word gay which used to mean happy , gleeful.

Words take on different meanings as the years go by and some accept that , some don't.

nounVULGAR SLANG
1. a woman's genitals.
2.a person regarded as stupid or obnoxious.

verbINFORMAL•BRITISH
1. hit or punch (someone).
"if my best mate said that I'd twat him".

I think David Cameron got it right when he said " Too many tweets might make make a twat". I think he was referring to No 2 ' A person regarded as stupid or abnoxious'.

Tillybelle I sometimes think people like these students somehow act on GN posters like a conscience and when they bring up something like this posters just try to stamp it down (Guilt?)

What are "Jazz-Hands"?

trisher Oh Trisher! I want to hug you! Thank you! You have said exactly what I have tried to say. That is what the students are doing. Miss Khan was so polite too.
Bless you! ?

I wonder how many of the people condemning this have watched Parliamentary debates and condemned the jeering and cat calling. It is precisely this sort of reaction that the students are trying to deal with. They are trying to be more responsible, to create a kinder area for discussion where people feel able to speak and where approval can be expressed but without drowning out or intimidating others. Where even the most nervous feel able to speak. Surely we should applaud them. And clapping can be a real problem in such a situation for those who use hearing aids and who need to keep adjusting them. The condemnation on this thread for caring young people is pathetic.

Lyndiloo You are quite right about the universal response to pleasure and enjoyment.

The point you are missing, together with most people who are saying the Students' decision is silly, is that the Manchester University SU is only banning it for meetings and discussions where people are speaking and debating and where the audience were inclined to but-in with whoops and claps of agreement/disagreement etc à la House of Commons, which prevented others from hearing what was being said, especially those with hearing disorders who just gave up and stayed away instead.

I repeat Sara Khan's words:
""I think a lot of the time, even in Parliamentary debates, I've seen that clapping, whooping, talking over each other, loud noises, encourages an atmosphere that is not as respectful as it could be,"

They have not banned clapping in Theatres*

The ban is very specific concerning when it is in place
and
nobody will be prevented from showing pleasure by clapping at a Theatrical production.

You and many others, including the opinionated and too arrogant people in the media, would do well to humble yourselves enough to look at the facts before you start ganging up and showing off how pompous and "cleverly" outraged you can be in berating decent people. Get your facts right first!

I don't know why everyone is so indignant and threatened every time something new is suggested to be tried out. If it proves itself helpful it is good that it was suggested, whereas if it isn't, then I am sure it will be dropped and they will return to clapping or try something else. Heck we'd still be in caves if everyone worried about upsetting the "way we've always done things"

I had missed the original news item so looked it up and found this. I wonder which media outlets misrepresented the information!
inews.co.uk/news/clapping-ban-manchester-university-students-union-jazz-hands/

Gosh! What a lot of smugness and unkindness in so many of the posts!
We were not at the decision to use jazz hands as opposed to traditional clapping. The arguments to do so must have been persuasive.
I am v aware of the fine balance between supporting a person with a disability / health need to be able to live well in the ' able' world and making so many changes that life is very different for the majority of ' able' people. What I find distasteful is the unpleasant and reactionary way a few posts are so dismissive of people who have diabilities or health needs.