Advice re childcare arrangements with grandchildren

You are looking at two options. Carrying on and struggling or asking for a financial contribution.
Isn't the lack of time that you can give to your business also a problem? And one that affects your finances?
If you told your daughter that you love having the children but are struggling to find time for your business and it is making things difficult financially, you might be able to discuss it with her as a practical problem, rather than just asking her for a contribution. It is less personal that way.
The problem of people suggesting you are taking on too much presumably come up in conversation and it is hard to comment without knowing what the rest of that conversation is. If you are pointing out that you are finding things hard financially and don't have enough time for the business, you are likely to get a response that you are taking on too much of the childcare. In that context it is not really criticism.
You have to let your daughter know that you are having problems. It does not sound as if you need major changes. She might not react well as people do tend to feel a bit panicky when an arrangement that works well for them looks like being upended but if you anticipate that and don't tell it personally, you should end up with a more workable arrangement.
It is your life and, cliché that it is, life is short and you can't just give it to someone else, even your daughter.

DD is old enough to realise that she is saving money by living at your house so much, but maybe she needs it pointing out to her.
Like new nanny did, it is time to wean her off your full time support so she can be creating her own family life, and you can be getting on with earning your living with your business.
A gentle approach will probably work and I presume by freeing up time for you to work, money will be less of a worry, but if it is, I would build in some financial arrangement.
As for your friends, they can think what they like. You must arrive at an arrangement which suits you. Meanwhile I think they may have a point, not that it is any of their business.

I have friends who, in my opinion, are too willing to put their lives on hold, despite failing health, when their adult children want them to do child care, but I would not tell them so. It is none of my business. If they ask, I will gently suggest a compromise, but only if asked.

I guess the arrangement is a bit ad hoc, depending on whether SiL is at home etc. A schedule does sound a good idea so you can schedule business time, and are not called on every day, but DD still gets support. If one of the DGC is at school/nursery some days perhaps you could do the pick up and/or drop off but not see DD again that day so you get a bit of time to yourselves or to spend on your business. You said 'we love our involvement' but are you sure DH loves all this childcare? It's nice to be involved but you need 'you' time too. As for the money, that does need a discussion so you can reach some solution that works for you both. Petrol and their food seems a minimum requirement. Maybe you turn the heating up too when they are at your home? Have more washing? Maybe vouchers every week for your regular supermarket would suit you - asking your DD to get your shopping, as some have suggested, does seem a bit of a burden on her, checking what you need, double shopping etc. Vouchers can be used online too. Hope you work it out, you all sound a loving, happy family otherwise so ignore the raised eyebrows!

Firstly, it's none of anybody else's business what you do with your time (how much help you do or don't give to your daughter and grandchildren) - so I would advise you to grow a thicker skin and ignore the raised eyebrows or tackle some of these overt signs of disapproval by asking the people involved precisely why they are doing this.

Secondly, you may learn (if you ask family) that your daughter's husband's job working abroad pays him a great deal of money - and the eyebrows might be raised because they know you are being taken advantage of financially, i.e. if he is getting expatriate pay why isn't he channelling this into some amount of paid childcare

Thirdly, you could ask yourself why your daughter needs so much support. I know she is breastfeeding but she's not actually going out to work. It sounds perhaps as though she's just not coping with being a young mum of two children and that's a conversation you need to have with her. My daughter has many friends (stay-at-home mums) with three and four children of different ages going to different schools and they have not returned to their professional jobs purely so they can stay at home and bring up their children themselves. It sounds to me as though your daughter's reliance on so much help is masking a problem that she has and that needs addressing.

Next, it may also be that if your daughter is finding her own life hard to cope with, she won't have any thought as to your life and the impact looking after her and her children is having on your ability to continue with your home business. You have to tell her this. She may have the financial resources to make you a regular payment in recognition of the fact that it's probably nicer for everyone involved if grandparents are there with the children rather than a nanny.

It looks as though you may be blinded to things that are going on but which others around you can see as they are looking objectively at your poor financial situation, the support you are giving freely, and the potential mollycoddling of your daughter who must be in a comparatively better economic situation than you. You need to get to the bottom of these issues but remember that you obviously get much pleasure out of being in your daughter's and grandchildren's lives so aim for a balance.

It sounds very much as though you enjoy the arrangement apart from being a bit short of money and time. Your DD is still breast feeding a baby so having her husband away so much would be tiring and lonely. Finding time for a soak in the bath is difficult without DH around to listen out for the kids in the evening. So helping her is a lovely thing to do.

I think my suggestion would be to gently say to your DD that you need 2 child free days a week to attend to your business as it's suffering. And because it's suffering, you're really worrying about money. Rather than coming straight out with 'cough up'. I'm not sure if spending a bit more time on the business will earn you that little bit more so you can manage. Also make sure she pays for their lunches and activities etc.

As for your friends, I would guess they are suggesting to meet up with you and you either say you can't because of the children, or you can but have to take them with you. They may be relishing their child rearing days are over and enjoying adult company and peace and quiet. And who would blame them. So, as you seem to still have friends! Make a bit of child free time with them and don't moan about everything you have to do or take their finger paintings with you to display to them!

If 2 free days doesn't cover the extra expenses and you are genuinely concerned about managing your finances then confide in your daughter if she is a position to contribute more than the odd bag of shopping. I wouldn't make it sound like you expect to be paid for childcare though. You sound like a lovely close family. I have done similar for mine, so I know it's not easy but I wouldn't have had it any other way either.

Good luck.

I am always interested in what practical help different families regard as 'normal'. I was the first of my family in many generations (probably forever!) to bring up my children without female relatives on tap.
Both of my grandmothers were dead when I had my first child, but their sisters clucked over me, wondering how I would manage, so far from everyday 'help'. I did of course, but think I see both points of view.

My DD and two Dgc are living with me as she is a lone parent and has gone back to uni to do a masters degree. I support them and don’t take any money from her, however, she buys their food and we often cook for each other

NanaandGrampy Now now! I can see a disapproval notice winging its way through to you from GNHQ as I type.

DorothyL
You sound like very caring grandparents, and something you enjoy doing is helping your daughter out. But there has to be some changes here as if it continues in this way it might affect your business detrimentally, and your own financial situation worsen.
As your daughter lives very close by and her husband is working abroad, she is probably quite lonely and misses him and values you being close to hand, to the point that it is easier for them all to be at your house Mon-Fri ( if I have read this correctly).
Think...New Year ....now new routines!
I would probably tell your daughter basically what you have told us, but with some solutions thrown in as well. Draw up a workable routine that suits yourselves and your business first, then offer any childcare to suit yourselves, after all if you neglect your business, you could find yourselves even more out of pocket. Then ask her to provide the things for her children that you are paying for, after all she should qualify for child benefit for both of the children. You could do this by saying that's it's now necessary for you to write a shopping list each week for her to provide these items as you are struggling yourselves with escalating costs. I think also that you need more time to yourselves each evening/night. It may well be easier to have them overnight, but for who? Not if it's making you very tired doing this for 5 nights a week. Time to think of your own health here. I would only offer the occasional sleep overs before this situation becomes set in stone. The longer it continues the harder it is to break. Maybe as a way of changing this overnight situation, you could stay overnight at your daughter's house say once or twice a week to give her company and support, and get her used to looking after her own children independently of yourselves.

I can’t see why you are complaining.
You still have two days a week to yourself, which you could devote to your business.

Firstly, I would say that it is nothing to do with your friends and the rest of your family how you spend your time and with whom.

If I understand correctly, your Daughter has two children, one at school and the other still breast feeding.

The problem is you haven't enough time for your home business and you are not very financially well off.

Could you perhaps arrange with your Daughter that when you have dropped off the one at school that the rest of the hours you would be dealing with your business, until after school.

She shouldn't really need your support all day to look after and breast feed a baby.

When she is staying with you ask her to shop for groceries once a week as you're feeling the pinch and maybe cook a couple of evening meals.

In the School holidays maybe just you or your husband could help your Daughter while the other runs the business, on alternate days.

I was a very hands on Grandma as my daughter had twin girls at a very young age, she was a stay at home Mum but still needed help.
Hard work and tiring as it was, I would do it all again, in a heartbeat.
Then I had round two ten years later, when she had her son and went back to work after a year. I had him from early morning five days a week, until he went to school and I still pick him up from school until either her or my son in law get home.

It won't last forever, so enjoy it but talk with your Daughter so that it works for you as well.

You appear to be providing an awful lot of “help” to your daughter. Someone mentioned that you should enjoy this whilst it lasts as it won’t be forever. I wouldn’t be too sure about that. If this continues, your daughter will become reliant on you and your current level of support. Rather than asking for a financial contribution, I would be asking your daughter why she is so reluctant to be a parent to her children. You mentioned that your daughter and her children sometimes stay with you 5 days per week. I’m sorry, but that is excessive and my concern would be that your daughter will be renderred incapable of doing anything for her children on her own.

Urmstongran
Off topic but I wondered if you'd seen the tv programme filmed in Urmston, your area? Now on BBC iPlayer, Getting The Builders In (series 1- episode 1)
You might know the people who had their garden done - and very nice too.

Yes, agreeing with others here- its no one elses buisness- though im sure they're just concerned for you.But just mention to your daughter about the struggle you're having with your business& money.suggest the foodshop thing- maybe you&she can do that online(even while shes feeding the babe- i learned to do loads of things one-handed, back when i was breastfeeding my babies-And we didnt even have internet!Or she can tell you what to add to basket while she feeds& enjoys a cuppa- then she can pay at checkout.(just for the things they are going to eat?)also,yes now times passed a bit maybe they can all spend more time in their own home and maybe you help at weekends only?She needs to start standing back on her own two feet a bit perhaps.you dont say what the arrangements are when your SIL comes home but maybe they need to start functioning more as a family in readiness for his homecomings too?& it gives you&your hubby time for your small buisness and each other.All common sense things which im sure you must have thought over,but need us gransnetters to 'sound out' for you?Good luck.

Yes reading back - i see if she lives near then they should be in their own home and maybe ONE of you pop in early morning to help with school run then help with some small jobs if neccessary-the other of you could go to run your buisness-then be joined later by other till end of school.then ask what she particularly needs help with after school,getting tea etc,or help bath baby while she does tea? Then both return home for a good nights rest- im only 55 but all that 'helping' would wear even me out!

It is no-one's business but yours, DorothyL so I hope you will take what we all say in good part!

I do wonder why your DD needs such a high level of support unless she is not well? Many of us had to learn to cope with bringing up our families without the support of grandparents and, in some cases, mine included, have an OH who worked overseas for months at a time.

It's lovely to have so much involvement with your DGC but you have to see to your own needs too - your finances and your business.
Can you gently wean your DD off her great reliance on you? Is she very disorganised or are her standards of housework too impossibly high (you mention 'watching' the children whilst she does chores.) Or is the baby a particularly fretful child who needs constant attention?

If you're not happy with the status quo you will have to talk to her about easing off your involvement whilst still being there to enjoy your DGC and give a little help if required.

Agree with comment from others on here that adult children sometimes do not realise their parents might be struggling financially. Your DD might well need a nudge about that.

Why though does your dd need that level of help? I had my first 2 kids 16 months apart and my dh worked away. This level of parental involvement would have driven me nuts.

Honestly I think you need to back off a bit. She’s an adult and will cope like we all have to.

I honestly would think this level of help ridiculous unless your dd had a mental or physical disability.

I expect your friends think the same and are worried about you.

Hasn’t your dd any mum friends she sees in the day or groups to attend??

I think you all need more space.

You say you are very poor so I wonder how you pay for the extra electricity/food/petrol/heating that helping your DD and GC entails.
Very poor is food bank poor and I don't think that description applies in your case.
Why can't you speak to your own daughter about it? Surely, if you have a decent relationship, you are able to discuss the toll on your finances and health (feeling tired)
I've no idea why so many mothers of 1 or 2 children appear unable to cope. My own husband worked offshore and abroad for weeks, even mo the at a time and we had 5 children. I coped very well without any help.
The children are her responsibility and you seeing the GC should be an occasional pleasure, not something about which you need to ask for advice.
Ask her for a certain amount and don't minimise the cost.

* months, not mo the.

It's your business OP, but overall it does seem your DD is getting an extraordinary, unusually generous amount of support from you.

Also, unless I've misread things, her DH appears to have absolved responsibility for bringing up the children on a day to day basis at least. Is your DD OK with this? I am sure he is working very hard providing for his family from afar, and of course it is up to your DD and her DH how they manage things, but if he is living away with no worries because he knows you are helping out so much, well he is very lucky indeed. I hope you feel you are getting enough in return out of the arrangement. If you're having doubts ....

If he is abroad to work he should certainly be sending money back to pay the bills you are incurring.

Having been in a similar situation in the past,you have been given some good advice,I'll tell you the up side of this,I am so close to my many grandchildren the 13 year old told me "I am so lucky to have you",that's worth a million dollars.We know them so well if they have a problem we can help and not judge and have lots of fun,laser tag at present,keeps us young ? Ignore criticism.

I think it’s lovely to have a healthy level of involvement with your adult kids and grandchildren but my sil has her grandkids most nights after school and most weekends. This has driven a huge wedge between her and her dh who obviousiy feels daily child rearing isn’t on the agenda now they are retired and it’s also driven a wedge between the kids and their mum as they resent the amount of time granny has them.

Granny is happy as really she’s the needy one.

In my opinion too much involvement with grandchildren unless needed due to illness is not healthy.

grandparenting isn’t parenting

Firstly, I wouldn't be worried about your friends disapproval. They may well be aware of your financial situation and think that your daughter and son in law may be taking advantage. However it really is nothing to do with your friends!
As far as your daughter and son in law is concerned, they may not be aware of your financial struggles - I personally never dreamed of asking my parents if they were ok as far as finance is concerned! I think that you need to sit down with your daughter and be quite honest with her. As she is just about living with you, there is no reason why she should not contribute either by buying the groceries on a regular basis, or helping out with the running costs of your home. You also need to explain that you both need to spend more time on your business. You don't say if your daughter is at work - if she is, say that you will no longer be able to do the school runs as often in the week and because of your company, will be happy to help with bedtimes etc but not so much during the day - even concoct a large order for your company if you need to !

But unless I missed it and apologies op if I have I still can’t get my head around why you and your dh need to be so involved and why your dd needs that level
Of help parenting 2 children?