Accidental caring responsibilities

He is a friend sharing your house and contributing to the costs of the household. He has no legal rights at all. Certainly not a tenant of any kind, possibly a lodger, but I doubt even that.

If you want to be legalistic, you offered him a home, while his house was renovated and but the stay was extended extended to cover the lockdown. The lockdown and the house renovation are in the past. When you tell him to go he has to go.

Why not speak to your local Citizen's Advice? They will have all the legal possibilities, if any, at their fingertips and will reassure you that he has no rights at all, and if he tries to claim any you can use their authority to say he has none.

Just google Citizens Advice and add your local authority name. I tried it with my village name and it showed up the detals for my LA area, so not difficult to find.

he is a lodger, at most, not a tenant.
do not even think of strengthening his position by dabbling with tenancy agreement.
you want him out.
he has no rights as a lodger; and he is not even that really, as it was to be a temporary arrangement.
you dd not advertise for a lodger; the prime purpose was to help out a friend, while his house was being made ready, not to set up as a landlady.
get your daughter and her man to come round often, even if only calling at the door.
let him see that you are not unsupported.
time to go home, time to go home, Pammy is waving goodbye, goodbye.
(apologies to watch with mother; o happy days !)

I feel that reading between the lines you are fond of him but maybe not in love with him
It’s hard because it’s gone on for a while so he’s got used to living with you nearly 2.5 years is a long time I understand you ve been happy to not be alone in CoviD times, but that’s not totally fair unless you made it quite clear that it was a temporary situation only
I think it’s harsh to call him a cuckoo in the nest We were both glad of the company and not having to live alone it was a mutual agreement and it appears you didn’t give him a time limit or even a clue that you didn’t want a full time live in lover however as he’s now turned out to not be the perfect man you have every right to end it but I hope he won’t feel used
It may end the relationship and reading between the lines I think you wouldn’t be that sorry I ve always thought living together for a year or two before marriage was the sane thing to do as people can be very different full time as opposed to part time
Good luck and I hope it goes well for you .

Good evening Grans

Sorry for the radio silence. Slept most of the day - possible after effects of the flu jab.

You’ve all - without exception- said it’s time for him to go. Just couldn’t see what a user he turned out to be until recently. I shan’t hesitate but I need to get proper advice and dot all the i’s and cross all the T’s. That’s me being pedantic but better in the long run!

On a personal level - I will feel guilty - how I’m made unfortunately! But that won’t stop me as I know I have to take care of me first. I also know I’ll be more content on my own.

He might try to plead - there again he might not! Have to prepare for the pleas….hence the counselling!

Also there may be a need for a formal tenancy agreement- again it’s erring on the side of caution.

That’s a good suggestion about My daughter…. she and SIL leave nearby so they can be here if needs be.

I cant thank all you Grans enough for your support and confidence boost.

I’ll keep you updated asap xxx

Totally agree with Sashabel and Monica - PLEASE don't delay action. This shouldn't be hard, but you are so caring that you can easily procratinate to postpone the difficult conversation. I know that you will understand what I'm saying.

Let's be totally honest here. All you want is your house back. That's it. His illness (yeah, that one, the one that prevents him from washing the pots but allows him to wash his car) is not your responsibility. Neither are his future plans. You are in a relationship that has run it's course and you want him to move out. It really is as simple as that. Don't overcomplicate it. Don't be drawn into discussions about what he will do without you and all that bollix - not your concern.

I sound hard. I'm not, not at all, I'm a right softie and in your position I would be on here asking for support and advice from Wise Grans - and would welcome it and read and listen carefully and still find it incredibly hard.

So harden your heart. Remember - the relationship has run it's course. Co habiting was only meant to be temporary. Everything else is just fluff - don't let him or his entitled spoiled kids try to guilt trip you.

Counselling will almost certainly give you the courage to do what needs to be done, and help you to deal with the inevitable guilt that as a lovely, caring lady you will feel - but DON'T let it be the shove that you need to get rid of the freeloading old codger. You have had the shove - from us - ladies of your generation, many of whom have first had experience. Brace yourself. Just do it - we'll be behind you shoving for all we're worth

I am a little worried by your comment 'it may not happen overnight'. I realise you cannot leap up tomorrow morning and tell him to be gone. But that phrase could so easily become an excuse for postponing a decision and action.

I think that could also apply to seeing a counsellor. Another 'reason' (excuse) for postponing the decision that you know is the only way out of this situation.

See a counsellor, by all means but do not make giving notice to this cuckoo in your nest contigent on this action.

Give him notice and then see the Counsellor to talk the decision through and how you feel after making a decision that goes against all your nature.

I think you need to have the conversation and get your partner to take responsibility for his care.
I cared for DH for the last year of his life, he would not tell anyone he was ill and would not accept outside help.
By the time he died I was physically and mentally exhausted and felt I was being further punished when DS received a letter from his uncle's wife saying they were disgusted that I could not let them know DH was dying. I did not know he was so close to death.
I would never take on caring at that level again, think carefully about committing yourself.

Does your daughter live nearby, Pammy? If so, maybe you would feel better letting her know when you plan to have this conversation with this man so she can come round to support you should he get stroppy and starts giving you a hard time. It sound like he knows just how to manipulate you, so knowing she is free to pop over to support you if he tries should make him back down. My son was on hand to support me when I kicked my lazy, selfish partner out and it was a huge comfort.

Pammy56

Earlier today I arranged to see a counsellor (next week) so I can talk through my plans/how to deal with this difficult situation. It may Not happen overnight but it will happen.

This is a really heartening bit of news! Maybe this is where you can make a start to get to grips with the situation and plan a course of action - that in itself will make you feel better.

These are your twilight years and you need to make the most of them, after what you've already been through. This is your life, your time... this is about your needs.

I wish you well, and hope the counselling really helps to get things in perspective and gives you some peace of mind in a difficult situation.

"I wouldn't mind offering some support, but I think that everyone is assuming that I'll be 'the one' - the carer".

I appreciate that you've had a great deal of advice. All of it sound, sensible, and with no dissent! Hope you won't mind my commenting late! That sentence in your opening post made me think immediately "who's everyone?". Sadly, as your later posts explain in great detail, his family and presumably he have already made this assumption about you. You, your needs, your wishes, your plans don't feature because yes, you're lined up as the carer. So, leave it much longer and your fate could be sealed!

He has been in your home for over 2 years - this was to allow some refurbishment of another home to be completed. Then there was lockdown. OK, but now - in my view - he's really taking liberties. And since he is paying you a regular sum each month he possibly feels that he he can go on living under your roof, guilt-free, whilst the home in which he is destined to live is now a rented out, nice little earner for one of his children.

I'm sure your Counsellor will be of great help to you, but I don't see this decision as difficult or complicated. You may feel it's difficult because you're clearly a very decent and caring person. He doesn't even want to think about it!

With or without big girl pants, you now need to understand that you ARE being taken advantage of, you DO need to just tell him that when you allowed him to move into your home because of some inconvenient circumstances, it was to help him until the house was straight again. You now want to return to living on your own and he can sort out his future from his own property which is not only finished but has a tenant !

There's nothing unkind in that, you are being perfectly reasonable. You mustn't allow him to become a 'victim' and he needs to return to facing life as a widower, running his own home and own life. That's not your job. The 'assumptions' need to stop - and you probably know this. Don't put it off and please don't even attempt to discuss his future plans, or any concerns you might have, with his children or anyone who knows him. That simply makes it look as if you feel you have some responsibilities towards him. You don't. They can assist him or not, their choice, their own family business.

If you decide to continue your relationship with this man on a different basis now, or if you feel that it has run its course, you'll be able to make much better judgements without feeling resentful that your life with him has become a job, a responsibility, that at your age you really don't need. Continue to heal from your sadness and loss, make a better life for yourself where you have freedom and the happiness you deserve. And please don't agonise over a sensible decision which is long overdue and which is really going to make you feel a whole lot better. Good luck with that new life!

Dottygran59

Right, Pammie. Big girl knickers on. I hate confrontation and conflict too, but really this isn't on at all.

Lazy old sod - I'd rather not indeed. Bugger that. This is YOUR life. We're similar ages, you and I, and I would be telling him to bog off home and look after his own house and you look after yours.

Sorry - bit blunt I know, but reading this has made me very, very cross indeed.

Brilliant approach,I think he is a lazy old sod too.

PHEW!! That's a relief. I bet you feel loads better now that you've made the decision and just have to execute it.

Harden your kind heart and think only of YOU - these freeloaders don't deserve your kindness and consideration.

And yes, Gransnet and the Wise Grans therein have saved my sanity while WFH in splendid isolation for the past nearly 2 years - don't often post but I have learned so much from these lovely ladies of our generation.

Good luck with the counselling, big girl drawers (knickers) at the ready and best foot forward - YOU CAN DO THIS

Dear wonderful wise grans

If I had known what a fantastic group you are I would have posted here years ago.

I’ve a feeling my friends have started to suspect things weren’t right. lockdown had kept us all apart and they were unable to see how things had evolved. Now they can but I think they are a little wary that if they’re honest, they might upset me. They know how unwell I was when my husband died and how losing him and the loneliness impacted on my mental health. I won’t go into that but I was very ill but very much better now and know I can cope on my own.

My daughter finally opened up to me. She was also being cautious for all if the above reasons but events around Christmas finally led to an honest conversation 3 days ago. That is what led me to posting here. Not that I don’t trust her because I do. It was more to ask for your thoughts.

Earlier today I arranged to see a counsellor (next week) so I can talk through my plans/how to deal with this difficult situation. It may Not happen overnight but it will happen.

Im sorry I haven’t replied to each of you but I want to thank you all - you have helped me so much. X

As someone living with you on a temporary basis on and making a modest contribution to household expenses, including catering, he has no legal rights what so ever.

Just tell him that the current arrangment was never meant to be permanent, just a port in a storm and that the time has come for him to move on. Give him a months notice and, as said before, if he causes problems, change the locks and put his belongings outside in bin bags.

But I doubt it will come to that. I think if you tell him it is time to go, he will go, just do not agree to any extentions to the date you give him.

Sashabel is spot on, Pammy. You most certainly shouldn't be talking to his AC about his future care needs - NOT your responsibility. They wouldn't want to engage in a conversation about it either, and this will leave you feeling more frustrated. Where he goes and what he does is not your concern. Sorry again to be so blunt, but this has been playing on my mind and your update has made VERY concerned for you. I bet his late wife did everything for him and he will expect you to do the same.

I didn't realise that you had been ill for 5 weeks - Dear God, you should have had someone loving and devoted caring for YOU - not this passive get yer feet under t'table of a good, caring woman and hope that she won't realise what a sponging lazy bugger has inveigled his way into her life.

I'm glad that the scales have finally fallen from your eyes - and that the Wise Grans have reinforced your decision to get shut and get on with your life. YOUR life.

And if in the future you find yourself warming towards another kind gentleman send him over here and we will rigorously interview him for you.

TBH his children and his house are not your problem. He is your lodger as he is paying you, so you can give him notice and he can go and do whatever he wants too, if he chooses to go back to his house it’s up to him to sort it out with his ACs.

So sorry you’ve found yourself in this situation. I think it’s very brave of you to be so honest with yourself, and it does seem like you have an idea of what’s best for yourself. It’s absolutely okay to take care of yourself

Sorry to be blunt, Pammy, but sounds to me that you are being walked all over on all sides - him and his AC's. If the plan was for him to move in with with the lodger after the renovations, then he definitely does have somewhere to go. The only difference for him is that he wont have you on hand to be his servant (slave, more like). My partner took selfishness to a new level and then was shocked when I told him to leave, but it was like a huge weight being lifted off my shoulders the day he went and I will never have a man in my life again (apart from the two little ones I couldn't be without aged 5 and 2).
Get tough and get rid. If he doesn't want to talk to his children, then leave it alone. Informing them is not your responsibility, it's his.

I think you need some proper legal advice about how you can get him to move out.

It seems to me that not only do you have the work and stress if a carer but that you are also being taken advantage of financially.

He (and his family) have a place for him to live, no bills, a carer and domestic help, all for the bargain price of £300 a month!

Even if you decide to go on living with him you must add up all your expenses, council tax, utilities, insurance, food, house maintenance etc and he must pay half.

Please don’t let this continue. I’m more and more concerned for you.

And you’re only 65. So much good living still to do?

Well it may be doable as the tenant is a family friend who worked for his wife and lived with him and his late wife. She stayed on after his wife died and the plan was that she would move in with him when the house was ready. She subsequently moved in on her own. I do know her and also know that she has other options and is considering a move nearer to her family. She doesn’t know of this situation though as Im treading carefully and not disclosing anything

So he hasn’t got a place to go to? And he’s been giving you money each month.

This isn’t going to be simple is it? ?

Hello Grans

Gosh can I just say you are all very astute in your observations. Maybe I’ve been to close and too busy to see things clearly. As the saying goes….‘can’t see the wood for the trees…. It was being ill for 5 weeks which made me pause and take stock. So maybe being ill was a gift - in a weird way.

I think he needed (and will need) a carer and I was an easy option as I live nearby and I’m fairly presentable. I do have a giving nature and a degree of naïveté - and on reflection, I was still quite vulnerable.

He is a strange mix - appearing to care but also selfish. I don’t think it’s necessarily intentional- it’s more that he’s wired that way. He also has some lack of a moral compass. Lots of little things but they indicate character don’t they?

About the AC. Eldest son is aged 36 with High functioning autism or possibly Asperger’s. Never been an actual diagnosis but you know it’s there. He’s quite innocent but with very little emotional intelligence. Possibly the autism/Asperger’s??

Daughter aged 33?is superficially charming. A love bomber. Underneath - spoilt and entitled. Definitely the favourite child and still is.
After his wife died he handed over the family home (£300K) to her and SIL. The deal was that they buy his late mothers home for £110K - proceeds split between him and 2 brothers. They got a dependents BTL mortgage and he would live rent free. He used his share - £38K to refurb the house. It wasn’t quite finished by lockdown hence the move here. It now has a tenant (family friend). She pays £500 per month to his daughter & SIL. That was never the plan - as in no rent. So they have - the family home (mortgage free) + the £500 rental bonus AND GIVE HIM NOTHING. Not even offered and considering what he spent on the refurb I do think he should have at least 50%. He could have then contributed more to staying here. Currently paying me £300 pcm.

So he’s caring towards daughter, ok with son but he is always helping daughter. Less with don but he isn’t demanding whereas daughter very needy - as in a user.

Sorry for the vent and I hope you don’t mind it’s been helpful to get it all written down…cathartic really! X

I think it’s time he went home. Continue seeing each other but keep your independence.

Extremely selfish of him not to tell his adult children.

This is their problem and his, and you are bearing the brunt of it.

He seems to be making the assumption that you will be his carer, and that he needn't involve them.

In other words, it's all about him and his needs. Has he ever discussed it with you and asked you how you feel?

Without saying too much I’m interested in your difficult dilemma. The responses are interesting so I’ll follow with interest.
Dottygran made me laugh too and she has a very valid take on the situation!