The Archbishop of Canterbury is to be knighted

FACT - As Sir Justin Welby, he will NOT be entitled to sit in the House of Lords.

Jesus was judgemental about the Scribes and the Pharisees.
Religious leaders should not set themselves above others by being offered or accepting prestigious honours.
Jesus would not have approved.

If anyone needs spiritual guidance surely it’s KC3 with his emphasis on defender of faiths not one faith? He might be a touch conflicted in a number of ways? If Justin Welby has been able to help him then good.

Thank you Maddyone,yet so judgemental, you know Justin
Welby doesn’t think of the royal family as people who need to
turn to him but he just laps up to them.

You know Justin Welby eats a big Turkey dinner

I’m Christian Annie.

May i ask Maddyone? Are you atheist?

I think the whole world has become greedy and self serving actually.
Sadly for many, but thankfully not all by any means, young people, they aspire to become an ‘influencer’ on Tik Tok. What a facile ambition! Others aspire to be a pop singer, hence the plethora of singing competitions on television these days. Of course these shows have produced one or two successful ones, Will Young, Girls Aloud, and Ollie somebody or other springs to mind. But the vast majority sink back into oblivion fairly soon.
I don’t blame a lack of religion for these developments, it’s all in the name of the relentless desire to make money. It’s a very different world than the one we were brought up in.
So surely we should be able to look to our religious leaders and not see them lecturing us on the one hand, and then lapping up honours and all the prestige of hob knobbing with the royals and other ‘important’ people. I’d be more impressed with the Archbishop of Canterbury if I saw he’d been out working for homeless charities or Aids charities, rather than donning his fancy garments, leading a Christmas service, and then going home to a big turkey dinner. Do as I say and not as I do springs to mind!

Well as an atheist I of course believe people can have a moral code without believing in God but I am beginning to think that when religion fades people find something else to believe in. Whatever they chant is the 'word of God', those who dont believe are heretics and must be banished etc. They have their 'blasphemy' laws about what mustn't be said, etc. Look at most forms of identity politics and you will find those themes.

GrannyRose15

Siope

Secular society is crying out for something to believe in

Is it? Do you have any evidence to support that claim?

Even if it is true, for secularists the fact that we have a state church, with all its advantages and ability to interfere in the body politic, is a problem.

The evidence is all around you. We are becoming a nasty, greedy, self-centred disjointed society. Mental health issues abound. Of course there are good people doing good things . But I still think our world would be a better place if more people believed in something greater than themselves.

March 2021...
Boris Johnson has told a private meeting of Tory MPs that the success of the UK's Covid vaccine programme was because of "capitalism" and "greed". (retracted later)

There's a school of thought (the Ayn Rand school of thought) that believes... The core of Rand’s philosophy — which also constitutes the overarching theme of her novels — is that unfettered self-interest is good and altruism is destructive. This, she believed, is the ultimate expression of human nature, the guiding principle by which one ought to live one’s life.

www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-do-tories-love-ayn-rand/

If you want to talk about "society" - look at the direction our government wanted /wants us to take. We haven't just become greedy and self-serving... we've had encouragement.

And if the AofC talks about it, he's pilloried.

Siope

^Secular society is crying out for something to believe in^

Is it? Do you have any evidence to support that claim?

Even if it is true, for secularists the fact that we have a state church, with all its advantages and ability to interfere in the body politic, is a problem.

The evidence is all around you. We are becoming a nasty, greedy, self-centred disjointed society. Mental health issues abound. Of course there are good people doing good things . But I still think our world would be a better place if more people believed in something greater than themselves.

Galaxy

As an atheist I would absolutely agree that society is crying out for something to believe in. It's interesting to watch. They replace religion with other belief systems that are linked often to politics.

Maybe because it is politics which will define their lives?

As an atheist and secularist I am not crying out for something to believe in. I believe in a fair and just society and, on a personal level, doing a kindness if I can. It's quite possible to have a moral code without a State-sanctioned religion and its high priest dictating what it should be.

I respect everyone's right to believe in whatever God or religion they choose and am certainly not anti-religion; some great acts of kindness and good have been carried out in its name and it has given untold comfort to people - but it has also been hijacked by those with an agenda and has caused misery and suffering, too.

I think God is a metaphor for goodness and self-sacrifice - but human beings can be good and selfless / altruistic without believing in him.

There’s simply no way round this, however much we agree or disagree with his politics or think he’s a nice man or not. No religious leader should accept, nor indeeed be offered, prestigious honours or gifts, despite the fact that it’s happened before. It is simply not in any way in the spirit of what Jesus said in the Bible. If the Archbishop of Canterbury believes in what is written, then he cannot accept this gong. The anomaly clearly doesn’t bother him.

On a completely different level, I don’t agree with having a HofLs, or second chamber, that is dependent on people being knighted, or given titles. The second chamber should be an elected chamber, otherwise we simply cannot claim to be a democratic country.

Iam64

GrannyRose, I don’t see how the AB of Canterbury can be blamed for our increasingly secular society

He can’t.
People choose not to go to church, so the churches close.
Very similarly,
People choose to shop online, so town centres close.

As an atheist I would absolutely agree that society is crying out for something to believe in. It's interesting to watch. They replace religion with other belief systems that are linked often to politics.

Fleurpepper

No meddling in politics would be strange in a country which is still very much linked to one religion, and just one branch of it.

I'd agree this is nonsense and should stop- especially the link to the judiciary, education and a special place in Government.

What is this link to the judiciary and education?

All knighthoods are political?

Secular society is crying out for something to believe in

Is it? Do you have any evidence to support that claim?

Even if it is true, for secularists the fact that we have a state church, with all its advantages and ability to interfere in the body politic, is a problem.

Iam64

GrannyRose, I don’t see how the AB of Canterbury can be blamed for our increasingly secular society

His principal job is to bring people to God. Secular society is crying out for something to believe in and he isn’t providing any help or guidance.

Clergy are called to a simple disciplined prayerful life as are all Christians. It is not only for the clergy!!

paddyann54

He didn't need to accept it surely thats a vanity/ego issue.Not what one would expect of a man of god...of any faith.Church and politics should be seperate as* Granny23* has explained the Church of Scotland is ,no meddling in politics ...Christians are not a majority in the UK ....I know very few who regard themselves as such

Agnostics are prob the majority in the UK overall.
Next will be those who think of themselves as Christian, as you can be a Christian without going to a church.

No meddling in politics would be strange in a country which is still very much linked to one religion, and just one branch of it.

I'd agree this is nonsense and should stop- especially the link to the judiciary, education and a special place in Government.

GrannyRose, I don’t see how the AB of Canterbury can be blamed for our increasingly secular society

He didn't need to accept it surely thats a vanity/ego issue.Not what one would expect of a man of god...of any faith.Church and politics should be seperate as* Granny23* has explained the Church of Scotland is ,no meddling in politics ...Christians are not a majority in the UK ....I know very few who regard themselves as such

Oreo

I think Welby the weakest wishy washy Archbish ever!

I always find it hard, sort of hilarious, bizarre, weird ... when devout Christians think that thinking and behaving towards others as dictated by the Bible = weak wishy washy.

GrannyRose15

Why? He's the worst ever A of C. Closed churches and went on sabbatical when the country needed spiritual guidance. He should be in the Tower not the Lords.

I don't believe it was so much spiritual guidance that the country needed so much as practical and legal guidance at the time.

I do agree that he should not have taken a sabbatical.