Surely the beneficiaries have nothing to do with the price assets are sold at, only the executors - or is this beneficiary a charity?
I understand they always make sure they get their pound of flesh and a sliver more if they can, which is why, in my will, I have left money charity but not named any specific one, leaving the choice to the executors.
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Buying a retirement property
(36 Posts)We’re looking for a retirement property for my brother and seen a nice flat but the lease is only 62 years. I know that this could possibly be extended but it will cost and don’t know how easy it will be.
Does anyone have experience of buying a retirement flat and would you recommend trying to find one with a longer lease?
Obviously there’s also the hefty service charge to consider. The flat is considerably cheaper than a non-retirement property so that’s a plus but just concerned that when he comes to sell (or we do on his behalf,) it’s going to very hard due to the length of the lease. I also know retirement properties are much harder to sell so am wondering if he’d better off buying a non-retirement property and getting carers in when/if he needs them.
Anyone else read the article in the Times on Friday?
I think it is something to think very hard about.
If that’s the lifestyle that will suit you and you have the money to fund the management fees (including the inevitable annual increases) then go for it.
Just don’t expect the value of your purchase to go up, it is likely to head the other way and could be difficult to sell.
Not your problem if you are dead but give some thought to those you may leave a poisoned chalice to.
My close relative is going through this at the moment, it’s taken 2years, the management charges have to be met ( to be paid after the flat is sold) To be fair it could have been sold much more quickly if one of the beneficiaries would have accepted that they would have to reduce the price. It has caused a lot of heartache.
Cossy
Allalongagatha
It depends if he wants to leave any money behind after he dies. I would buy if I did not want anyone to inherit. He won’t have any of the problems involved the sale of the property and could live a really comfortable life. Treat it like it is a luxury car. Enjoy all the benefits and expect no resale value.
You could save yourself the hassle by persuading him to leave it to charity.
One word of warning, is that the management fees increase dramatically each year.Management fees also continue to be due until flat is finally sold!
Yes, thats right. These companies do not care if the owner has died, they still want their money!
The retirement flats up the road from us sell at around £99,000 for a one bed but the charges are around £10,000 a year. They do have in house medical care if required.
The retirement flats my mum was in years ago was taken over by the tenants and of course the charges went down but they refused to have a proper sinking fund and we worried about what would happen when the lifts needed attention. Mum was happy for the first years but later the huge mix of ages caused problems.
I would try and downsize to a small property if possible
Allalongagatha
It depends if he wants to leave any money behind after he dies. I would buy if I did not want anyone to inherit. He won’t have any of the problems involved the sale of the property and could live a really comfortable life. Treat it like it is a luxury car. Enjoy all the benefits and expect no resale value.
You could save yourself the hassle by persuading him to leave it to charity.
One word of warning, is that the management fees increase dramatically each year.
Management fees also continue to be due until flat is finally sold!
Buy if he does have the money and really wants to do it it could be a good option for him, David. If he has "enough" for his needs I don't see the problem.
Does it really matter if he spends most of it?
Retirement properties are a nightmare avoid them like the plague, if your brother cannot finance his own accommodation either leave li to the LA to find a place, OR build an Annex on your house OR buy a freehold property for him.
Unless the LA house him it’s going to cost a lot.
I would love to move into a retirement apartment I can afford to buy but it is the maintenance and ground rent payments that are stopping me . Most I've looked at ask around £3500 upwards for maintenance and £600 upwards ground rent , some much more . So whatever savings I would have would have to pay this for the rest of my life . Also they rise each year . What happens when I can no longer pay these huge bills , God forbid I live into really old age I will have nothing in the bank . So I'm staying in my little house .
There is a damming article in the Times to-day about McCartney Stone retirement home loosing so much value that they sell for less than half price sometimes. They are to be avoided as they also have standing charges which mount up .
My mother-in-law has (about 5 years ago)moved to be closer to us. The retirement properties in her new area are all "expensive" and "desirable" - some are old buildings which have been beautifully converted. Quite a few have small patio type gardens. She decided to move to a house instead and is very happy there so although I admit I would have liked the "on call 24 hours a day" security of the retirement units it was probably right for her to move into a house... somewhere arguably too big and with a big garden! 
I think if you are happy and safe in your retirement home that is the most impotant thing.
I love my mother-in-law and if she had used up all her savings and all her equity in a retirement property that wokld have been fine. Being happy and comfortable... that's OK by me.
I'm sure most daughters and sons will feel like this?
The remarkable thing is argybargy is that despite this these blocks are going up apace.
I was reading the paper yesterday and saw an advert for one of the main retirement flat builders and I was absolutely amazed at how long the list of sites was. There must have been getting on for 100 development listed in the building now, due to start building soon list.
Reported whoisit
OK this thread is pretty old but possibly quite timely! I live in the West Midlands and the prices of retirement flats here have been going down - some are plummeting. Not related to lease length but more likely an over-supply and people waking up to the fact that they are horrendously expensive for what you get, along with ridiculous service charges. Best thing is to look at the Sold prices of other flats in the development or nearby to see what the trend is - RightMove will show you that over the last 5-10 years (or since being built).
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Allsorts I think this is the best way.
My parents sold up and rented a property for the last years of their lives.
They were SO happy there. I just wish they had lived longer to enjoy it even more.
Wonder what got decided?
Depends if he was very young as i would steer clear, but if he was over 50 say and it gave him a happy useful life i wouldn't care if he didn't leave a penny, his happiness comes first and no one should feel they have to leave a penny.
whoisit
Totally understand your concerns—62 years left on the lease is definitely something to pause over, especially for a retirement flat which can already be tricky to resell. You're right that extending the lease will cost, and the process isn’t always straightforward. I'd lean towards finding one with a longer lease if possible.
I think they might have come to a decision by now. The tyesd is 5 months old
Lovely that you care so much about your brother, I hope he moves in to a new home where he is very happy.
Could your BiL, rent a retirement flat. More and more of these flats seem to be available to rent, I suspect, because more and more people are wary of buying them because of the problems re-selling them.
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Thank you all. My brother doesn’t have a wife or children, his only descendant is his niece, my daughter. She already stands to inherit a considerable amount from me and her father (we’re divorced.) It would be nice if she could inherit from her uncle but it’s not essential.
As you point out, the service charges can be very high and go up willy nilly and that’s a concern. I don’t want to be responsible for paying them if he dies before me so would need to make sure he’s set aside enough to cover these.
Non-retirement properties in the area go for around £100k more so that’s another consideration. My brother (who has significant mental health problems) is financially absolutely clueless so I feel I have the responsibility to make sure he makes the right decision.
Lots of food for thought.
My late mother bought a retirement flat when my father died, it was very much what she wanted, she felt somewhat insecure in their house. I helped her with that, and she was very happy there. The charges were expensive, she did tell me that, when we her children came to sell, the managing agents, Peverell, an absolute shower would impose a charge just for handing over some documents to the solicitor, which they did, it was over a thousand if I remember rightly, money for old rope. Hats off to residents who have taken over the management of such places. The monthly service charges were high, but I could see where that money was spent, an on site house manager, the common parts were immaculate, garden well maintained and if for example, one of the machines weren't working in the in house laundry, it was quickly fixed or replaced, if the lift was out of order, they were on to it straight away. There were also events and activities organised, my mother enjoyed some outings to theatre shows and NT gardens, afternoon teas that sort of thing. All in all it was my mun's money and her prerogative to spend it how she wished, I was glad she lived out the final 8 years of her life in comfort with peace of mind about her security. I think her flat had a normal lease, not a short one. When we came to sell after her death, it took a while, I'm thinking, up to a year maybe, there were quite a few of them on the market, so the competition was fierce. However, we styled it together, she got rid of all her old furniture and we ordered everything new from John Lewis, had it redecorated, re-carpeted ripped out the bathroom and made it a shower room. and made much of subtle lighting with up lighters and side lights. The estate agents told us that's what swung the sale, the presentation, in fact the lady who bought it, asked if we would include the personal effects in the sale which we did. Some of these places look so tired in "an old person sort of way" which of course the residents are, but faded floral chintz and cumbersome oldie people chairs and doily stuff all over the place can be a bit depressing imo. Before we sold it though, me and my other half would decamp there for weekends, it faced the sea, to get away from our then teens to have a nice break with bracing walks along the coast and to eat out in some lovely old pubs close by..
Personally I wouldn't buy anything with a short lease, I think on resale it would be a problem, and yes retirement properties can be a liability given the considerable charges, which many a prospective purchaser may baulk at. Bear in mind that the newer apartments are now coming with more and more amenities, gyms and pools even in top end ones! However, one does have to think of those left behind who will inherit the property and will be looking to sell it but in the interim will still have to fund the monthly charges, so maybe set aside a fund for that.
If you can afford an alternative , don't!
To add another dimension, our adult disabled son is moving near us. At present, he is in a housing association flat, which has worked really well for him. We thought it was be a good idea, and we had the funds available, to buy him a property so that he was secure and settled before the inevitable happens (hopefully not for a very long time yet!). At first, we were thinking about flats, but we found that they were all to leasehold. We then thought it might be better to look at small houses instead because they are more likely to be freehold, which is what we did and he is moving in very soon to a two bedroom end of terrace house. However long the lease is on a leasehold property, it is never 100% yours, however much you buy it for, whereas freehold is. Retirement flats are even more of a problem as they are difficult to sell on. I would not touch one with a barge pole. In your brother’s position, I would look for a small bungalow or house.
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