Freemasons

Crossstitchfan

Claremont, you have absolutely NO idea, have you??

Oh I do, which is why I feel so strongly about it.

Because you like the other groups, but particularly Rotary and Round Table and some of the other groups mentioned are just as guilty of the things you accuse masons of doing.
But if you won’t admit that, so be it.

Claremont

Crossstitchfan

Claremont, you have absolutely NO idea, have you??

Oh I do, which is why I feel so strongly about it.

How, if it is all so secretive?

I'm intrigued.

No -one here is going to be swayed, persuaded by arguments for or against.
You either approve because you know members or don’t approve because it sounds secretive or archaic.
No middle ground for the posters.

I do know of a case where Masonic influence was used to the detriment of employees. Two teachers had a strong disagreement with their Head; both were married to Masons, and the Chairman of the Governors was a member of the same Lodge. One of the husbands threatened the Head that he would see her out of her job as a consequence; she was suspended, fought her case, found innocent of all charges, and won. As Head she was then allowed the right to remove all the acting governors, which she did because they had undermined her authority. The two teachers who had brought the complaints left shortly afterwards. The local Masonic community was left reeling in shock, not so much because of the actions two of their members had taken, but because they had made open threats which had exposed the power Masons can exert, usually behind the scenes.

Usedtobeblonde

No -one here is going to be swayed, persuaded by arguments for or against.
You either approve because you know members or don’t approve because it sounds secretive or archaic.
No middle ground for the posters.

Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn!!

Frankly I don’t give a damn either, and I’m not about to post the Lions equivalent of the Masonic story above, though it would make interesting reading.

My father, father-in-law and husband were all Masons for many years. None of them benefitted from this in their daily lives.
Where-ever you work, you will get people who will help others in their careers and daily lives. This is not just something practised by Masons. However, the fact itself is good ammo for those who want to run them down.

I am against Freemasons on various levels. Firstly I have no intention of being patronised by being give a "special night out" where I can get dressed up to be give some evening or other, which they think makes up for the rest of the year. Then I do not approve of their type of secrecy. When I married , we vowed tobe there for each other and no secrets etc. Of course we had our own interests and different groups we chose to join, but there was no one telling either of us to keep things secret from each other etc. I have known many masons from work and elsewhere, and whilst the majority of them have been decent and law abiding men, who have helped charities, I have also known a man who used the lodge as way to cover his tracks whilst he had an affair, and several police who joined as they saw it was to their advantage. In the very old days it was a way of the specific guilds working together to uphold their quality of work and so forth, in days when there was very little widespread travelling. Now it is much more jobs for the boys and it is more about keeping people out . Well I have been my own person and done my own thing all my life. My work speaks for itself and I have travelled and lived abroad and done a variety of things. I have never had to get someone to wangle me into some society and am not beholden to them.

madeleine45
You have the right to like or dislike masons , but really?
I worked for a non Mason who had an affair . He used his non-Masonic job to cover for him. He also beat his wife for trying to leave him when she discovered what was going on. She was brought back home by the catholic priest from their church.
Now there’s an organisation for you.

I don’t ever recollect being patronised by being invited to/going to an evening out, whether a Masonic evening, a Lions evening, a Mother’s Union Evening or a LARP club get together at Uni, but if that sort of thing makes you feel patronised . . . Probably better not to go.

All the societies have admission by invitation only and usually need a someone they know to sponsor them.

Many people get a job because they know someone whether in the masons or other groups, and many do not.
DH was a mason, but neither he nor I got our jobs because of that. You only have to read the thread about teenagers being helped/not helped to get jobs to learn that it’s what goes on in the real world.

Now, it is much less jobs for the boys, but you’re free to have your own opinion about that too.

And finally, whether or not husbands and wives have secrets from each other and what the secrets are about is up to them, and nothing to do with masons or with anybody else.

Some people, even masons, do go home and tell their partners what they’ve done in their evening out.

Some don’t, and their partners trust them enough not to need a detailed account of their evening.
Those who do always demand such an account tend to be controlling. . . and that’s worrying.

madeleine45

I am against Freemasons on various levels. Firstly I have no intention of being patronised by being give a "special night out" where I can get dressed up to be give some evening or other, which they think makes up for the rest of the year. Then I do not approve of their type of secrecy. When I married , we vowed tobe there for each other and no secrets etc. Of course we had our own interests and different groups we chose to join, but there was no one telling either of us to keep things secret from each other etc. I have known many masons from work and elsewhere, and whilst the majority of them have been decent and law abiding men, who have helped charities, I have also known a man who used the lodge as way to cover his tracks whilst he had an affair, and several police who joined as they saw it was to their advantage. In the very old days it was a way of the specific guilds working together to uphold their quality of work and so forth, in days when there was very little widespread travelling. Now it is much more jobs for the boys and it is more about keeping people out . Well I have been my own person and done my own thing all my life. My work speaks for itself and I have travelled and lived abroad and done a variety of things. I have never had to get someone to wangle me into some society and am not beholden to them.

Oh for heaven’s sake! Protesting too much, I think! You don’t like them, or what they stand for? Fine. That is your right. There are a lot of things I don’t approve of, or like, but that’s life, I guess.
You say you have known a lot of Masons. Really? Masons do not tend to go around broadcasting the fact that they are Masons so that statement seems a little suspect in itself, but if you say so. I also can’t see what your travelling and living abroad has to do with anything, unless it is just to give you a chance to boast!
As for someone you know using the Masons to cover his tracks about an affair, well, lots of men will use anything they can to do just that. It is not just something Freemasons do.

Mollygo

madeleine45
You have the right to like or dislike masons , but really?
I worked for a non Mason who had an affair . He used his non-Masonic job to cover for him. He also beat his wife for trying to leave him when she discovered what was going on. She was brought back home by the catholic priest from their church.
Now there’s an organisation for you.

I don’t ever recollect being patronised by being invited to/going to an evening out, whether a Masonic evening, a Lions evening, a Mother’s Union Evening or a LARP club get together at Uni, but if that sort of thing makes you feel patronised . . . Probably better not to go.

All the societies have admission by invitation only and usually need a someone they know to sponsor them.

Many people get a job because they know someone whether in the masons or other groups, and many do not.
DH was a mason, but neither he nor I got our jobs because of that. You only have to read the thread about teenagers being helped/not helped to get jobs to learn that it’s what goes on in the real world.

Now, it is much less jobs for the boys, but you’re free to have your own opinion about that too.

And finally, whether or not husbands and wives have secrets from each other and what the secrets are about is up to them, and nothing to do with masons or with anybody else.

Some people, even masons, do go home and tell their partners what they’ve done in their evening out.

Some don’t, and their partners trust them enough not to need a detailed account of their evening.
Those who do always demand such an account tend to be controlling. . . and that’s worrying.

Very well said, Mollygo! I totally agree with all you have said here.

Crossstitchfan, it's frequently alleged the Masons are a powerful clique. I don't allege this as I simply don't know.

Your evidence the Masons are NOT a powerful clique is unfortunately anecdotal, and I hope there is objective evidence too.

"There’s no credible evidence that the Freemasons are a powerful ruling clique today. While they historically included influential figures—especially in the 18th and 19th centuries—modern Freemasonry is largely a declining, decentralized fraternal organization. Membership is shrinking, their activities are often public, and no peer-reviewed studies or institutional investigations have shown that they exert coordinated political or economic power. Like many old societies, their secrecy fuels suspicion, but that’s not the same as proof of control."

ChatGPT one minute ago

Freemasons aren’t a secret group running the world today—there’s no real proof of that. But like any club where people know each other well, they do help each other out sometimes. It’s not the same as favouring family (which is what nepotism means), but they do give special chances to other members. This kind of close support happens in lots of groups today, like professional associations, old school friends’ networks, or even some sports clubs. So, Freemasonry isn’t a powerful ruling group, but it is a close club where members look after one another.

ChatGPT a moment ago

As a wife of a mason, I can assure you that 21st century Freemasonry is not a secret clique running the world

Hey Ho thanks for the laugh 😹😹😹

GrannyGravy13

As a wife of a mason, I can assure you that 21st century Freemasonry is not a secret clique running the world

Hey Ho thanks for the laugh 😹😹😹

No, that's the WEF!!

ChatGPT
What is this please?

Allira

ChatGPT
What is this please?

Chat GPT is an AI know it all…

Oh!

I'll refrain from saying more 🤐