Care home have asked Mum to leave

I think often people seem to use the terms care home and nursing home as almost interchangable but there is a big difference between care homes staffed by care assistants and nursing homes staffed by medically trained staff.

Need for a hoist to use the bathroom, get out of bed etc does not automatically indicate that nursing care is needed. Care home residents have primarily social care needs such as help with washing, dressing, feeding and using the bathroom etc that can be carried out by trained carers. If care home residents have medical care needs then these are usually carried out by visits from the district nurse and local GP - a care home does not necessarily have a medically qualified person there 24/7 so residents requiring more extensive medical intervention would need a nursing home.

Nursing homes provide nurse-led care and can treat certain conditions, deal with dressings and catheters and are more likely to have specialist knowledge for care planning and equipment for assisting conditions and carrying out tests etc..

I know I am late joining this thread but am totally appalled by this treatment of your mother Nana3. I hope by now you have talked to a social worker? Don't know which part of the country you live in? If your mother needs a hoist, how can they say she doesn't need nursing care? Doesn't make sense.
Get your GP, social workers, MP's everyone involved. This is disgraceful!!!

Physios not Physics!!!

Ramblingrose22 just found this thread and hope this isn't too late to help. My mum was in hospital and was assessed (as were all the people on her ward) for discharge. We had a meeting with all the team concerned- Occupational and Physics, nurse, carer, social worker and doctor. They discussed her needs and what she wanted with us and her. The OT made a home visit and looked at aids mum would need and the social worker was putting together a care package. Sadly mum died from pneumonia before she could be discharged- she was 95. You should ask for a meeting with everyone involved in your MILs care. Funding depends on care and nursing costs although there is NHS funding available after discharge.

Nana3 this is very distressing, I wish you the very best of luck in your search. My mother went into a home after a fall in which she broke her hip, she already had dementia, and we were advised to find a home which catered for dementia but also had nursing care, which we did. I was very relieved because the manager told me that each time a person with dementia is moved to a new environment, their condition declines stepwise.

Would the home be receptive to the idea of you/ss hiring a hoist for use with you mother? - I have no idea if this is feasible or how much it would cost, but it would allay moving her

just to echo some of the thoughts of other members in this post and to make sure you check the CQC ratings. I can't believe the cost of care is rising so drastically.

When looking for a care for my partners parents, we used Trusted Care to view care homes with a good CQC rating in our area

Good luck

satisfactorily

Nana3 I haven't read the whole thread so the situation may have been resolved satisfactory but, if not, I do hope that it is and that your mother will be well looked after and settles well after the move.

It is very unfortunate that the home where she is feels unable to meet her needs.

Isn't there something now about the way care homes are registered an that if they have dementia they need to be in a car home that is registered for dementia patients?
The staff do have to be trained to deal with dementia patients and if a home is registered as a 'care home' they may not be. A suitably qualified member of staff has to be there for 24/7 as far as I understand it.

Care homes face a real dilemma with dementia cases because they can change so quickly and their behaviour can get so erratic. I know this case has got more to do with mobility, but if a dementia patient does not like being placed and moved with a hoist it can take up an enormous amount of time encouraging them to accept using it.

My uncle, who did not have dementia had another man in the room next to him with mild dementia, then one day he started to accuse my DU of stealing his CDs. DU did not have a CD player. A couple of day later he erupted in to DU's room and began to attack him with his walking stick, he was a big man, at least 6 foot. Fortunately my uncle was able to get out of his room and get help. But that man had clearly become a danger to others and the home he was in had to say that he must leave, and quickly. It happens and not every home can deal with every kind of disability.

This is why I'm so glad that my Mum died before her Alzheiemer's got worse. Many care homes just can't deal with the advanced stages, so people get moved from one place to another. Good luck in finding a place which deals with all levels of care in one facility,

I am interested in this thread because my MIL, who is in hospital at present, is going to have an assessment to see what sort of care home she needs.
MIL has all her marbles but has lost her mobility, is incontinent and has macular degeneration. She has started to climb out of bed at night and then falls to the floor and is unable to get up.
I am confused about the different types of assessment that can be carried out. An earlier post refers to one carried out by a District Nurse. Has anyone had an assessment carried out for an elderly relative in hospital and were they given a copy of the result of the assessment?
Also, will she be forced to sell her home even though she has savings that could cover the first year's fees?
I hope some of you can help with the answers to these questions?

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I was helping my brother in law choose a care home for his wife who had dementia. Having worked in the care field I was aware of the different registrations for care homes. I think most care homes will say they can manage adults with dementia what they don't say is they will move residents if they deteriorate. I was able to look on the Care Inspectorate website and saw care homes specifically registered for those with dementia. It is quite different to a care home which says it can manage someone with dementia giving room for moving the resident when they deteriorate. It's not easy looking for the right place for your loved one. Glad to hear social services are going to help.

Hi Nana3, I hope the last few months have been okay for you. I know from personal experience how difficult it can be to get the help you need and finding an appropriate home can be really hard.

Moving your Mum can be really stressful for both you but if your Mum does need more specialised care it's important for everyone involved to find the best place to cope with her needs, but it seems like you have been very diligent in doing this already. I commend you for your strong effort so far, you're doing an amazing thing by trying your best to give your mum the care she deserves.

Reassessments for you LA are always important, especially when your parent is getting old as their needs can change very quickly. It sounds like you've had a good social worker so far and I hope they are still being cooperative.

All the best!

Christinefrance We had an Admiral Nurse helping us last year with my Dad. He was in the army and I was his main carer. I hadn't thought of asking for help again with Mum as I think I'm coping better now that she is in a care home. I don't think I qualify for their help now. Thanks for your suggestion though it was very kind.
duramjen my Mum's GP discussed end of life and said as next of kin my wishes would be taken into consideration. I was the one who raised the subject though. I am sorry about your MiL, all that moving it's so distressing for her and everyone who love her. I remember you talking about her last year when I was posting about Dad.

Do you have Admiral Nurses in your area. They specialise in helping people with dementia also have nurses specifically to help carers.

Good luck

I know what you mean, Nana3. My mother in law has dementia. At 94 she is about to be moved into her 4th home in two years. She was okay when she first went into one. In fact, she went in for respite as 100% fee paying because she was frightened of falling over again when she was on her own. She has no idea where she is, or who anyone is. She said last year she had had enough of life, but deteriorated quite quickly and has been in and out of hospital three times since then. She does not have any end-of-life plan written down.

I read the article durhamjen thanks. There's a lot of sense and wisdom in it. It takes a brave DD or DS to raise the subject of death with a parent, I don't know if I could do it now that Mum is 92 and confused, I could have a few years ago.
I could speak to my own DDs about myself though, that's something to think about.

Thanks for your post NoStrayGrey it is kind of you to explain what may be happening. I know Mum has fallen a couple of times, she could really do with some physiotherapy to help her regain some strength. A person from social services has been to check safety issues and give advice.
I am so far down the line with this now that I have been aware of your points but only from observation not from any practical experience. I can see how skilled the carers are and I am full of admiration for most of them.
Mum is so much better now, it was the shock of moving and my father's death that caused her to withdraw from the world. She knows she's mixed up, as she puts it, but she is looking happy and is chatting to other residents. She can transfer now, eats well, and enjoys any activities on offer. I have her name down on two specialist dementia ( I've come to dislike that word) care homes as they still want her to leave.
Thanks again, sorry for late reply, I had a lovely few days in Kent with old friends.

Helpful response giving a view from the 'other side'. All very sad for families though.

Hi,
I am new to this site, so firstly I should introduce myself, and say I hope to be of use on this subject.
I have lots of experience in this particular field of work, having been a senior care worker, and qualified in the care of Alzheimer's Residents, before I became too ill to work.
It is very expensive to train and keep staff who are willing and able to care for people with this condition. Some require a lot of monitoring, and are indeed prone to violence for no apparent reason, and finding the cause for the outbursts can take a lot of detective work. This is not to say your Mum has these problems, and is not intended to cause offence to you. Quite the contrary, I am trying to throw some light onto this subject.
Unless staff are trained, people with this condition can appear very tricky customer's, and many staff will refuse to assist, if they feel unsure or fearful. Sometimes, the more mild-mannered, gentle folks can be difficult to communicate with, and can present a lot of problems for the untrained. However, this condition does affect the majority of elderly people, in some degree or another. The matter of using a hoist is also something which staff must be trained to do, before they begin to work with people, and that knowledge and experience can take some people a while to learn fully. All staff must be trained mandatorilly in the moving and handling of people in their care. This training is annually renewed and refreshed, to keep abreast of updated rules and regulations. When applied to a person with Dementia, sometimes it can take a good knowledge of both the condition and the person, and the applied rules for moving and handling, which needs continuous re-assessment.
I am definitely not defending the actions of the Manager where your Mum is residing. On the contrary, this was handled badly.
Where I worked, this would not have happened, due to the degree of illness we were fully trained to deal with. Unco-operative residents were the norm, and violent outbursts were a daily feature of our work, along with some other very challenging behaviours.
I trust you can appreciate the many issues faced, which need to be handled in a dignified and courteous manner, while protecting the resident and staff.
You could ask for further explanation from Registered Nurses, or again, speak to the Manager for clarification on their reasons. Perhaps there are risks which cannot be catered for at the Home, besides your Mum's mobility problems. Often, it can be a matter of lack of equipment, which can prove costly to a Home. Or a staffing issue, or something else which the Home cannot meet. It might not be a matter of your Mum's needs, but those of the Home. They would have a duty of care towards your Mum, and everyone else, but if they cannot meet those needs, it may be necessary to do risk assessments, to find where staff are struggling. If they cannot reach resolution, then it could be an important factor to the way your Mum is cared for. You would not wish Mum to come to any harm, and maybe the Home are fearful of this happening. Often it is the relatives who are the last to know, of the difficulties staff might face when dealing with a particular aspect of a person's care. It may be a matter of loud crying, that disturbs other residents. It might be that Mum keeps trying to get up, and keeps falling over. There are so many things which you might be completely unaware of, as they are things which do not necessarily require you being informed, and that could be they're concerned it could upset you.
Please don't give up, or get upset, just push for the answers if that would help YOU. I have not written this to cause you any distress, and have only done it, to show there could be a million and one reasons. It hasn't been handled well, and the Manager is not really dealing with it in a professional manner. If you need more information, then you can insist on knowing. But, please be aware, the answers could be distressing to you. Contact the CQC if you aren't happy. Be Strong. Take Care.

theconversation.com/heres-what-people-in-their-90s-really-think-about-death-58053

This is an interesting article I have just been reading.
How often are those in care homes, or even in their own homes, asked what they think about their situation?

Hi. Good luck finding the right place for your mum. It's so hard when people are in this situation to know where to turn and it seems to be a common problem. Not sure why the comment was deleted? But anyway glad you saw it x