Elderly Mother refusing help from carers

i wonder what happened though ?
Sunny ?

Everyone has long gone

This thread is over a year old Bellresa don't know if you noticed

I am very sorry that you are in such a situation. Of course, I am also very sorry for your mother, who is going through all this. I'm sure it's not so easy for her, especially on a psychological level. It is not easy for her to accept the fact that she needs help.
Maybe she will need a couple of sessions with a psychotherapist.
My father went through the same period. He refused nurses, refused any help at all. I had to practically force it. I contacted senior care in Cincinnati company: www.assistinghands.com/9/ohio/cincinnati/services/ . For a couple of months, I prepared my father psychologically for this. I convinced him that there was nothing shameful about it. I think your mother also needs to explain this and show understanding.

you don't want to care for your mother so there are two choices you cooperate with social work to organise care or you collude with your mother so she can live and die in squallor Harsh yes but that is the harsh reality !

Hithere, I think your guess may be right.

Maybe OP's kids were upset as they saw their mother's reaction?

Anyway, wrong priorities. Children first, then adults.

Sunny, I don't understand why your children were all that upset by your mother's impending death. I mean , how can it be your mother is a disagreeable harridan and at the same time commands your children's affections?

What you seek from this discussion is not practical advice but moral support for you to leave the care of your mother to the social and medical services.

You already know you don't want to be remorseful or guilty of neglect. This decision is nothing to do with your poor daughter who harms herself. If you really cannot deal with your mother's problem as well as parenting problems you should tell the person in charge of your mother at the present time.

I just cannot believe that your mother is of sound mind and was living the way she was. I can only go by my experience of people who would come across my mum by short visits or during her shopping trips. To them she was okay and she would make cups of tea for visitors which is automatic habitual behaviour. It was only when you spent more time with her that you noticed other than light conversation she couldn’t retain a meaningful one that would include using her memory. Neighbours would say she was fine but how wrong they were! She became wrapped up in her own needs and demands oblivious to anyone else’s. My mental state was driven to exhaustion with her demands and her social worker said to me we are not concerned about your needs, only your mothers. That’s basically it.

Sunny123

Did your 13 y.o. also visit your mother when you were given the false alarm by the nurse?

Honestly, with this new information, I will focus all my energy on your minor kids and 13 y.o.

Your mother is an adult.
Your kids depend on you and your stable mental health.
Have you ever asked yourself how much your mother selfishly disrupts your daily life and your kids' lives?

these kind of issues are exactly what an advocacy service would assist with. but they may not be fully active at the moment, and if you can consult those solicitors that would be good.
all the best. PM me if you wish.

Sunny, i understand your position and i totally agree with you.

Please allow me to clarify. I believe my Mum is now in the right place - in a care home.

However, I am the one who hurriedly had to take my children to see their Nan and say goodbye as we were told by a professional nurse that she could die that night if she did not go into a care home immediately. This was an outright lie and caused enormous upset. I did not want to share this personal information before but will now as I am anonymous on this site. My 13 year old daughter self harms and has attempted suicide more than once in the last 12 months. You have no idea how much stress I was put under by being told a lie which my children overheard and could have resulted in my daughter doing something unthinkable that night.

Do the means justify the end in this case?

Having read the page on the solicitors website that I linked to earlier I sincerely believe my Mum was forced into a care home against her will which could be unlawful as it amounts to deprivation of liberty. This is different to DOLS (Denial of Liberty Safeguarding) where someone without capacity is denied their liberty.

I'm no legal expert hence me asking if anyone was familiar with Deprivation of Liberty. I will call the solicitors tomorrow and see what they say. It could be a case of my word against someone else or it could be I am misunderstanding what I have read.

If the representatives of the local authority are acting unlawfully then I believe someone needs to stand up to them. This is not some kind of personal vendetta. It is a matter of principle for me and others might benefit in some way in the future if staff are educated not to act in this way in future.

My mother had dementia and refused help in her home. We had carers everyday under the advice of SS. She barricaded herself in her home and screaming at the carter to go away. She was sectioned under the mental health act and taken to a mental hospital for assessment. My brother was petrified her money would be spent on her care so he went to the hospital threatening staff he was taking her home as she didn’t want to be there. They then had to do a deprivation of Liberty on my mum for her own protection. This is not taken lightly and done under strict guidelines. It was to stop my mum being removed during her assessments. If they are talking about deprivation of liberty there is something more serious going on than just your mum wanting to go home. I’m wondering if they want to keep her there longer to do a stronger mental capacity assessment.

Totally agree with GillT57. Good advice from someone who has been through a similar situation.

Of course legal way is not the way to go now, but last resort.

Op's mother has the right to choose, even if it doesn't benefit her. Even if she soils herself, falls and nobody knows for hours, breaks a hip, etc.

It doesn't mean OP has to engage if her mother doesnt cooperate.

Legal action will help nobody, will just add more unnecessary stress into your situation surely? The comment I made about you not being able to visit your Mother if she self discharged to her own home was based on my understanding that households are not supposed to mix at the moment; if this is incorrect I apologise. Maybe you need to look at things in another way; stop railing against those who have made it possible for your Mother to be in a care home, deprivation of liberty charges are serious and difficult to prove, maybe you should be looking at it from the point of view that these people, perhaps clumsily due to overwork, have seen that your Mother is unable to make decisions regarding her own care? From what I can see, whatever you do will not make your Mother happy, so perhaps make what will make you happy? When she is in a care home, you can rest at night, knowing she is not falling/soiling herself, is eating properly and is safe. I know, I have been through similar, and the relief of knowing that the alarm won't go off, that I won't have to drop everything and drive over at all times of the day and night, is beyond measure. Be kind to yourself, even if your Mother isn't.

Things maybe could have been handled more tactfully, but do you think your mum would have been better off with no input from the nurses, social services or the care home?
She says she's going to leave; if the care home phone you to say she's on her way, will that suit you both?
Your mum can't look after herself.
She refuses to pay for any help.
You don't want to do it.
I can't see how legal action will help either of you.

OP

You feel you have a moral obligation to your mother.

You do not get along with your mother, for a while now.

Your sister doesn't talk to your mother for 40 years+, what was that disagreement?

Dont you see that you, your mother and sister had a healthy relationship?

You are your own person with your right to choose

Your mother is an adult who is mentally fit legally.

The warden and nurses want to pass you the hot potato. It is very common for social services to force families to be responsible for elderly relatives and use less than ethical and legal practices.

At some point, you have to make a choice. You can choose you.

Your mother, as unfit as she is now, she doesn't see it. You cannot make her see it, social worker cannot make her see it, nobody can.

The only way to make others' opinion count more than your own mothers' is to assign her a guardian as she is not legally competent to make decisions for herself.
Even then, you dont have to be her guardian.

Seriously, stop. Stop. Think what you want for your life. Think what makes you happy. Choose yourself.

Your mother seems to be the person who is not happy, not matter how much others do for her.

Yes I would start by suggesting she uses her attendance allowance for care, as that is what it is for.

Your mu will get used to that and then you can gradually expand her help etc.

Gently does it and eventually she will think it is her idea?

You need a deal of patience though.

This may have already been suggested I’m sorry I haven’t time to read all the postings

Depriving someone of their liberty is only allowed when it has been decided that there is no other option, and the least intrusive option should always be the goal.

It would have to have been decided that your mum lacked capacity before interfering with her free will.

Is anyone familiar with Deprivation of Liberty?

Apparently:

The following are all signs that a deprivation of liberty may be unlawful:

Local Authority forcing a person into a care home without consent or against their will

Unlawful Deprivations of Liberty & Damages Awards.

It is a little known fact that an individual who has been unlawfully deprived of their liberty has a right to compensation.

These quotes are all taken from a solicitors website:

www.lindermyers.co.uk/unlawful-deprivation-of-liberty-do-you-have-a-case/

I feel so angry about the underhanded way the nurse and social worker forced Mum into a care home I'm going to contact the solicitors and see if we have a case. They may have had Mum's best interests in mind but that does not make them exempt from acting within the law.

Thank you all again for the replies and suggestions. I just called the care home and apparently Mum has been asking to go home next week as she cannot afford to stay but they won't let her go if she is unable to look after herself. I was advised to call social services on Monday if I wanted to discuss the matter further.

Mum is now going to have to accept that she has no choice but to stay put or go through an assessment and agree to pay for carers (assuming that moving back home would be suitable for her).

This whole process has been incredibly stressful for me so I am going to take a few days off to focus on my own family life. I won't be calling social services on Monday or answering any withheld numbers I receive for the time being.

So sorry you have this problem and at a difficult time too Sunny123.
It seems to me that your Mum needs a full geriatric assessment together with a referral to a continence advisor. Her GP can arrange this. Mum's double incontinence needs investigating and sorting whether she stays in the care home or returns home. As suggested up thread her rectum maybe inpacted with overflow or she may have a prolapse or infection for example. Regarding the urine incontinence she might have a urinary infection or an electrolyte imbalance for example.
If Mum does go home a care package needs to be put in place in advance of her arrival.Sounds as though Mum needs every day help with her daily living activities like bathing, dressing and assistance with her medication.

sunny123, I'm well aware of the dodgy tactics employed by social workers and nurses in an overworked and stressed out working environment. However, I do believe that they have your mum's best interests at heart.

You want to defend her right to choose. The reality is, though, that she can't look after herself. You can't look after her either and nobody should expect you to.

The safest place is probably a care home. Very few people would choose to live in one. Think how you'd feel about it.

We lied to our mother. We gave the impression that the family were paying. In fact, that was suggested. There was absolutely no way I could afford my third of £1, 250 a week! Only one sibling (the one who who suggested it) could.

Mum had no need to know that her lifetime savings were vanishing and her house was being sold. It would only have distressed her to know the truth.

She had Pension Credit and full Attendance Allowance as she was paying full fees. She was officially a 'temporary' resident, there for recuperation. You can be temporary for a full year and there are advantages, so don't agree to any permanent status.

Yes, it's a horrible, upsetting situation for all involved. Stay (outwardly) cool and calm, be positive around her. She may decide to leave and get home - but, if you help her, there will only be further problems. Please accept the reality and try to persuade her to stay for now.