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Problem with gardener

(90 Posts)
Sloegin Fri 15-Oct-21 23:42:15

Wasn't sure which forum to post this on but since the only reason we need help in the garden is because of my husband's health problems this seems appropriate. My husband loved gardening and just doesn't seem to be able to accept the idea of giving up growing vegetables. He's not able to do it himself and ,not only am I not a gardener, I don't have the time or energy. With great difficulty we found a man, early 60s, self taught gardener. He's a really hard worker but a bit of an odd character, recovering alcoholic, bit of an ancient rocker. I've been very nice to him, given him nice lunches if he's here over lunchtime and ignored his rather colourful language which I've found inappropriate and offensive. I discovered he was actually a painter and decorator by trade so asked him to do some painting for me. We were a bit annoyed, and surprised, that he completely ignored my instruction not to move a cupboard as difficult to get back in place and he actually put the fridge and freezer outside when we'd told him to just push them to one side. I think he sensed we weren't too happy about that. Yesterday he came to cut down some branches in the garden. I had been out with the dog, came in the back door as my husband was going out the front door to the garden. Our young dog excitedly ran out to the gardener. I can understand he was annoyed and irritated by her but I immediately ran out to get her and was shocked that he really shouted at me quite aggressively to 'keep that dog in, I'm trying to do a job here'. It seemed to be directed at me, not my husband. I'm afraid I raised my voice to point out it wasn't me who let her out. My husband, not someone who copes well with conflict,said that he'd have a word with him and, when the chap came in to get paid my husband called me thinking he was going to apologise but in fact he was quite unpleasant to me. I told him that I'd no problem with him telling me to keep the dog in but it was how he spoke to me but he stormed off. I was very hurt and just felt and feel completely disrespected. I decided to text him to try and smooth things over, hoping he might then apologise having realised he'd behaved badly. I said in the text that I hated fallings out and hoped it wasn't irrevocable. I'd hoped he'd come back with an apology but the response I got was ,' cheers ' name', no worries'. It's almost funny if I weren't so upset. I feel foolish too as think he may have thought that I was apologising! I think, as a retired professional,who was used to being treated with respect and treating others with respect, I just feel so belittled. I don't want to have him back but we need help with the garden. How do I handle this. I was sure he'd apologise after getting my text . I just think we've seen a rather unpleasant side to him. Life has been hard the last couple of years with the pandemic and my husband's deteriorating health so I have been quite down at times. This incident seems to have really been the straw to break the camel's back. Sorry this post is so long but just feels quite therapeutic to share it. I'd appreciate thoughts and advice.

Dickens Mon 15-Nov-21 08:53:21

BlueBelle

I think you come from two massively different backgrounds and by being benevolent ‘making him nice meals’ etc you have taken it away from the employer/employee situation and in your kindness you have moved the relationship into a friend / mate arena and he is talking to you as he would a contemporary
If he’s a good gardener keep him as just that out in the garden take him a cup of coffee by all means but by do not make him nice meals or ask him to do other jobs
He’s obviously ‘forgiven’ you, that’s why you got a ‘cheers no worries mate’ message back
If he’s a good gardener and turns up on time etc just keep him as that but don’t try to be his friend or benefactor keep it on an employer/ employee basis
You are at opposite ends of ‘life’ he is not a sophisticated, well spoken kind man he’s a rough diamond whose probably lived a very very different life to you keep it as to what you originally wanted a hard working gardener (who may be afraid of dogs) don’t take him under your benevolent wing that’s blurring all the lines

... such sensible advice BlueBelle! Well said.

JenniferEccles Sun 14-Nov-21 16:16:54

I’m sorry but I’m struggling to understand why you are continuing to employ this individual.
He uses offensive language, he ignored your instructions regarding the cupboard and fridge and freezer, yet seems to be under the impression that you apologised to him!

He clearly makes you feel uncomfortable around him, so in your position I would make an excuse and tell him you won’t be needing his services any more.
Perhaps say a family member will be helping from now on.

When we employ people to do work for us it’s important that we feel comfortable around them and trust them, and it’s clear this man makes you feel uneasy.

Could you make enquiries with neighbours about a reliable gardener? It would be good if you were given two or three names then you could decide which one you felt most comfortable with.

Time to let this one go.

Caleo Tue 19-Oct-21 14:23:57

Actually I do think employees should "touch their forelocks" metaphorically of course. That includes professional grade employees such as doctors and lawyers. Everyone is a servant. Employers too should respect the rights of employees.

Grammaretto Tue 19-Oct-21 13:00:05

There are some people on gransnet who seem to enjoy conflict and finding fault with other peoples choices. They usually stick to the political threads but can pop up on any.

I am sorry I didn't pick up on your emotional condition as well as I should have but I can imagine what it must feel like for you.
Since DH died less than a year ago, I have had to manage most things on my own and asking people for help is not my forte so although they say " just ask me any time" I don't feel I really can ask at least not too often or for small things. They are small to them but not small for me.

Shandy57 Tue 19-Oct-21 12:22:00

I was 42 when we moved here, and I remember talking about paying trades people to an older neighbour. She told me to tell them to come back on Friday at 4.30 pm for their money. Cap in hand!

Sago Tue 19-Oct-21 11:52:24

I also felt that was very harsh.

Scones Tue 19-Oct-21 09:07:26

Sloegin

Harris27

Do you feel that as he’s working for you he should touch his forelock? There respect and a certain snobbery here. Is it that he’s your gardener and should know his place? Or is it genuinely that he’s been unpleasant? Think,of how you’ve spoken to him in the past if your not happy find another gardener.

This comment has been bothering me. I was going to ignore but decided to respond. Don't know why you felt the need to be unkind and, if you'd read my post, you'd have picked up that I was very nice to this man, treated him like the equal I considered him to be and ignored his inappropriate swearing. In my professional life ( always NHS) I was used to paying, and being paid, respect from all levels of staff and never came across such unpleasant behaviour. Rudeness and aggression are never acceptable. I wasn't expecting such an unsympathetic response on gransnet and can't understand what motivated you. Reacting like this to someone who has said she's got an ill husband and feeling low is inexplicable. Try being a little bit more sympathetic to people who are hurt and upset and you may find it has benefits for you.

Hear hear! Well said Sloegin.

Billybob4491 Tue 19-Oct-21 08:27:26

Do hope your situation improves soon and wishing you and your husband well.

Sloegin Tue 19-Oct-21 08:06:50

loopyloo

I find these days that quite small things cause me a lot of worry. Like arranging a van to get a sofa bed picked up Why? Getting older doesn't help and I don't think I Covid does and the news seems to be endless scare mongering.
Really I think this man was discourteous and you should find another gardener.

Thank you loopyloo. I'm sorry that you are finding yourself having similar feelings to mine but nice for me that you can empathise. Most responses were kind but concentrating on the practical problem rather than my feeling far too upset about something that shouldn't have caused me that much distress. Covid has indeed made things very difficult and the rates in our area are worryingly high at the moment. Hard to understand one or two unkind responses- see my previous post. ( I decided I needed to stick up for myself and hopefully she'll reflect on her response and maybe be a bit more sympathetic to others who are anxious or depressed)

loopyloo Tue 19-Oct-21 07:05:40

I find these days that quite small things cause me a lot of worry. Like arranging a van to get a sofa bed picked up Why? Getting older doesn't help and I don't think I Covid does and the news seems to be endless scare mongering.
Really I think this man was discourteous and you should find another gardener.

Sloegin Tue 19-Oct-21 06:28:10

Harris27

Do you feel that as he’s working for you he should touch his forelock? There respect and a certain snobbery here. Is it that he’s your gardener and should know his place? Or is it genuinely that he’s been unpleasant? Think,of how you’ve spoken to him in the past if your not happy find another gardener.

This comment has been bothering me. I was going to ignore but decided to respond. Don't know why you felt the need to be unkind and, if you'd read my post, you'd have picked up that I was very nice to this man, treated him like the equal I considered him to be and ignored his inappropriate swearing. In my professional life ( always NHS) I was used to paying, and being paid, respect from all levels of staff and never came across such unpleasant behaviour. Rudeness and aggression are never acceptable. I wasn't expecting such an unsympathetic response on gransnet and can't understand what motivated you. Reacting like this to someone who has said she's got an ill husband and feeling low is inexplicable. Try being a little bit more sympathetic to people who are hurt and upset and you may find it has benefits for you.

Dustyhen2010 Sun 17-Oct-21 22:36:46

How upsetting for you as you obviously tried to treat him kindly and with respect. However I think he sounds like someone who has his own way of doing things and won't alter his behaviour for others. If you can't find another gardener I would change approach. Have minimal contact with him. Yes, make him tea but no meals. And certainly don't ask him to do jobs in the house as he seems to do his own thing and ignore your wishes. Any interaction about gardening and payment I would leave to OH. It is hard to get the right balance in these sort of relationships and in some ways as you were expecting an apology it sounds like you feel he is a friend (but he doesn't sound like a friend you would choose to have). As I say try to remove yourself from the situation and I am sure you will feel happier in the long run.

Sloegin Sun 17-Oct-21 20:01:46

Nell8

Sloegin I'm sorry you have been feeling low for some time and this recent incident has knocked you right back. I expect the seasonal change in daylight doesn't help either. Are you able to get out to meet friends for coffee or exercise and a good chat?
Have you had a word with your GP? If you really start to feel overwhelmed talking therapy and/or a course of antidepressants could help you to feel more like your old self.

Thank you for this response which I really appreciate. I do actually use a light box in the darker months so must haul it out again. I'm afraid, as a result of the pandemic and my husband shielding, my social life has become rather non existent. Generally I cope OK but this incident just seemed to knock me for six. Thank you for your kindness.

Sloegin Sun 17-Oct-21 19:54:56

Thank you for all the helpful advice/ suggestions re the garden but interesting that, and this may be my fault for going into too much detail about the incident, very few picked up that my reason for posting was because I wanted some help in dealing with my emotional state, feeling upset, hurt and offended. Also feeling that I'd handled things so badly. A few people did,and seemed to empathise, but most just focused on the practical problem of the garden which doesn't bother me as much as feeling rather traumatised by this man's unpleasant attitude to me. Shocked that one or two responses were actually rather unkind.

Peasblossom Sun 17-Oct-21 13:42:28

The bottom line is that you need help with the garden. Don’t lose sight of that.

Bear in mind you only found him “with great difficulty”.

Grammaretto Sun 17-Oct-21 13:03:16

No no no! You should not put up with this bad behaviour.
Rewild the garden if necessary. It's very good for the environment.
At the Edinburgh Botanics there is now a large area devoted to the wild ness cause. You wouldn't know at first glance as it just looks neglected but they have put up an information board. smile
I left half my grass to become a meadow last Summer and I was very pleased with it. It was full of orchids and butterflies. I mowed around it, to give it an edge and I have rid myself of the big heavy macho mower and bought a nice lightweight battery one.

There are a lot of "Boys' toys" in the world which on closer inspection are just heavy and need strength but there are often alternatives.

I also made a non dig garden for the potatoes. I followed Charles Dowding and am very pleased with the results.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LH6-w57Slw

Baggs Sun 17-Oct-21 10:19:01

Has he expressed annoyance about the dog before this incident?

Teacheranne Sun 17-Oct-21 01:23:45

The problem the OP has is that I think she lives in a rural area and it’s difficult to find someone willing to do gardening. She might feel inclined to continue using this man even though he offended her as it’s not going to be easy to find a replacement.

I suggest you give him another chance, ignore your feelings following your text and give him the benefit of the doubt. If he behaves in an appropriate way on his next visit, then try to forget about this incident, but do try to keep your dogs out of his way. If his behaviour is still inappropriate, then you have to decide whether you tell him not to return but risk not finding anyone else to help you in the garden or put up with his slightly odd attitude.

I’m not sure what I would do to be honest.

Sago Sat 16-Oct-21 23:30:47

I am amazed at so many of the responses, is the OP really supposed to accept this behaviour?

She has been kind and accepting but treated in an unfair and aggressive way ,this man has ignored her requests and had the temerity to get angry about her dog on her property.

There is no excuse, he is rude and aggressive.

DiscoDancer1975 Sat 16-Oct-21 20:12:31

Harris27

Do you feel that as he’s working for you he should touch his forelock? There respect and a certain snobbery here. Is it that he’s your gardener and should know his place? Or is it genuinely that he’s been unpleasant? Think,of how you’ve spoken to him in the past if your not happy find another gardener.

Good grief...that’s not what the OP is saying at all!! She’s employed this person to do a job...in her home. She’s entitled to feel safe. Not have aggressive and disrespectful mouthing off.

We have gardeners to do trees, and if they behaved as this one has, they wouldn’t be coming back.

DiscoDancer1975 Sat 16-Oct-21 20:06:29

I would have given him his marching orders the minute he started using bad language. This is completely unacceptable behaviour from someone who’s come to your home to do work.

There are loads of people out there who can garden. You seem to be bending over backwards to accommodate him, when it should be the other way round. He needs the work. There’s so much wrong here, he needs to go.

It is only a garden. Get someone else.

Barmeyoldbat Sat 16-Oct-21 19:17:10

I think you are extremely lucky to have found a gardener, let alone A hard working one. If it was me I would just forget what has happened and start again with him. As for the dog, well he could have been worried he, the dog, would get hurt, maybe he is a bit scared of and as for speaking aggressively to you that was probably done without thinking. Just put it all behind you and treat it as a bad day.

Sloegin Sat 16-Oct-21 17:49:10

Thank you to all of you who have left supportive comments and advice but particularly to those of you who understood why I was so hurt by this incident. One or two were, I felt, unkind and it's hard to understand why anyone would want to be nasty to someone who has said that they've got an ill husband and already feeling low. I only discovered Gransnet during lockdown and only second time I started a post. It's been a learning experience! A genuine thank you to the kinder folk. I think, overall, it has helped me get this in perspective .

Scones Sat 16-Oct-21 17:29:36

BlueBelle

* I'm a bit shocked by the comments here telling Sloegin to 'pull up her big knickers' and to put up with the swearing and shouting* I DIDNT SAY THAT As often happens you have put your own incorrect interpretation on my post Scones I didn’t tell sloegin to put up with swearing or any other bad behaviour My advice about the knickers was to stop going over and over what she’d ‘done wrong’ (she’d done nothing wrong but was beating herself up that she had)
Luckily Sloegin seemed to understand what I was advising although you obviously didn’t.
It was said in the original post that there were little choice and he was a good gardener so surely it’s about her being able to find a way to feel comfortable

Do I 'so often' interpret your posts incorrectly Bluebelle? I honestly can't remember doing that before - if so, you've not mentioned it.

The swearing and shouting element of my post did not refer to you.

I was shocked by the tone of some of the comments to the OP. I thought I had conveyed that in a gentle way and not in a confrontational or aggressive way. I thought I'd written a kind and supportive mail to the OP and my sole aim was to try to help and be kind as I'm sure was yours.

Shandy57 Sat 16-Oct-21 13:59:56

Sorry you are still feeling low Sloegin, it is hard having to pay people to do things you could do before Father Time intervened.

The best advice I received when I had CBT was to remember that people 'own their own reactions' and their reaction to us is very often nothing to with us at all. Whatever this man said or did, is due to whatever is happening in his world, and who knows what is going on in it.

He can't be the person you need him to be, so just leave a flask of tea for him and don't have any more interaction with him.