I hate christmas

What crap "she's 91 make allowances" too many damn allowances just make little dictators worse. No one is entitled, elderly mother or not, to treat their child like an indentured servant. I know of someone who had such a mother ghastly woman, she had her son waiting on her hand and foot, it impacted on his marriage, she expected him to drop everything at home to go over to hers and she'd be waiting with a list of jobs, he did it out of duty, this woman's husband left her when her children were very young and she made her son aged 8 the man of the house, her daughter never went near her because she couldn't stand her, her children in law and grandchildren also detested her. Reassurance is not what such people need, what they need is their entitlement and selfishness pointed out, if they are compos mentis, if not then Ethel is wasting her breath. I suspect horrible people turn into horrible old people and the person closest to them bears the brunt of their obnoxious behaviour. I'd just do the opposite to whatever she asks, I'd order her groceries online, I'd tell her she will have to hire in some help to do her exacting housework and tell her she needs to reflect on the way she behaves towards you. Please stand up for yourself Ethel, she's taking advantage of you, I'm afraid she's not a nice person.

Anyway glad she was subdued round at your house, the less you have to listen to her the better I'd say. At least she'll be getting groceries delivered so maybe a "pull yourself together mother stop crying over not getting your own way, it's what toddlers do"

If you are providing your mothers care, you are entitled to payment. Contact Age Concern. If she refuses to pay for her shopping I would ask her to do it on line as she’s able, . she chooses how much she want to pay. If she went on about big jobs like curtain taken down and washed I would just say you can’t do it anymore you’re not strong enough. There are things as you get older you have to pay for. You are not her go between between her and your d, she can speak for herself. Try being kinder to yourself without getting upset, if she upsets you just tell her. Good luck.

Callistemon21

OnwardandUpward sums it up:

^If you were in this relationship with someone who wasn't your mother, what would it be called?^

Enslavement.

^She cannot make you her slave without your say so^

Don't keep enabling her.

We are all behind you!!

Thanks Calistlemon.

Yes we are all behind you Ethelwashere1

Yes Caleo it is galling that this woman can be sweet and kind to others, but not her own daughter.

Well done Esmay for sticking to your guns, even if it is out of exhaustion. You're all doing great, despite difficult situations

Now my daughter is coming to visit I’m stressing how to deflect the lecture about never visiting her granny

And leave them to it - it's not your relationship, it's theirs and it's not your problem.
They are both adults.

You can be kind as well as being firm and not letting her dominate you, Ethel

Hope your relationship improves and don't wear yourself out.

Thanks again for the supportive messages. She’s been to my house, very subdued ate very little then went home. I think she says little in front of my daughter. She does do online shopping. I do click and collect as she can’t pack on the doorstep. Asda doesn’t bag anything now. I said in future it will have to be delivery if the car is off the road she began to cry. Christmas s over now hope you all had a lovely time. Thanks again for the kind remarks x

Caleo

She is 91 and it follows she is the needy one. You need to act the responsible adult and do your best despite your fear of her.

Naturally the old lady feels vulnerable. Reassure her +++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++times. As her practical help you seem to be doing just fine.

DO NOT take Witzend's advice as that would be cruel and maybe make her want to put an end to herself. She is 91 for goodness sake! Grow a pair and make allowances!

Rather a harsh response to a lady who is obviously looking for support. When I was on the edge of a nervous breakdown after ten years of 24/7 care my doctor gave me just Witzend's advice as it became the only practice I could use to establish a working framework. And as for telling Ethelwasherel to 'grow a pair' I would say that is completely uncalled for. She is not asking for judgment, she is asking for help.

Caleo

She is 91 and it follows she is the needy one. You need to act the responsible adult and do your best despite your fear of her.

Naturally the old lady feels vulnerable. Reassure her +++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++times. As her practical help you seem to be doing just fine.

DO NOT take Witzend's advice as that would be cruel and maybe make her want to put an end to herself. She is 91 for goodness sake! Grow a pair and make allowances!

Caleo

Ethel has had years of this and it seems to be getting worse.
She can stand up to her mother, be firm without being rude.
And then walk out if her mother carries on behaving like a spoilt toddler.

I remember a friend (a nursing sister) who said her 91 year old mother was dreadful to take out, she would push through a crowd to the front "I'm 91, you know", elbowing people out of the way.
When I asked if she was allowed to get away with that at 90+ she said she most certainly was not allowed to be bad-mannered because she was old.

It's galling that Ethel's mother is sweetness and light to others and tells them what a wonderful daughter she is but can't be kind to Ethel.

OnwardandUpward sums it up:

^If you were in this relationship with someone who wasn't your mother, what would it be called?^

Enslavement.

^She cannot make you her slave without your say so^

Don't keep enabling her.

We are all behind you!!

Hi Ethel ,

Every sympathy with you .
You are not alone .
I have a similar problem :

I used to be completely intimidated by my father ( all my life as has been everyone else that he dominates including his own mother )

He makes all sorts of demands and then when either changes his mind or when he thinks that things aren't happening fast enough throws a tantrum just like a child .

He'll even feign illness :
A month ago he pretended to have a stroke .
It wasted the time of four paramedics .
It wasn't until they put the blood pressure cuff on that he was forced to drop the act as he hates it .

Sheer tiredness makes me say sorry , but you said that you wanted this programme on and I'm not changing it again .

Or this is the food that you said that you wanted and I'm not cooking something else .

Yesterday was a box of gateaux from Patisserie Valerie -rejected in favour of buttered buns , which I hadn't got in .

Before now , he's demanded his supper at 4.00 am and even a bath having rejected both earlier .

I certainly wouldn't change curtains or do super cleaning over Xmas .

Just be polite and walk away .

It is very difficult .

Very slowly , the tantrums are shortlived and acceptance is kicking in .

Hello Ethel, nice to hear from you again, but so sorry to hear that the situation with your mother is getting worse. She is a bully. It is very easy for those of us not caught up in the miserable cycle you are in, but you do need to stop allowing her to make your life such absolute misery. Warn her once about the consequences of her rudeness then leave. Keep doing this. And keep offloading here, it does help.

She is 91 and it follows she is the needy one. You need to act the responsible adult and do your best despite your fear of her.

Naturally the old lady feels vulnerable. Reassure her +++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++times. As her practical help you seem to be doing just fine.

DO NOT take Witzend's advice as that would be cruel and maybe make her want to put an end to herself. She is 91 for goodness sake! Grow a pair and make allowances!

Please take heart. My mother was not dissimilar. She actually had the early stages of dementia. She was dreadful, hurtful, insulting and physically violent. She had always had a strong personality but as her strength failed so her personality got stronger. Please, please get help to put strong boundaries in place to prevent you from burnout. Please get your daughter on side so she understands exactly what you are going through. It sounds as if you are a very kind and co-operative lady but this too has it down side. Please think more to look after yourself as none of us are getting any younger and we count too and who looks after us?!

You really do need to stand up to her, but as this has been going on for so long I suspect you would find this impossible. So, you may need to just not visit, and if she comes to you pretend you never heard the door. To be blunt she only controls your life because you allow her too, and I think she always will. I am so sorry for you though

I have no advice and feel great sympathy for you. What a horrible Old Bat your Mother is. What I am taking away from your Post is, that this is a warning to all of us who are Mothers to Daughters. As we get older we must remember that our children (it's usually our daughters) were not put on this earth to be our slaves. They have their own lives to lead and when we see them it must be a social time for both parties. Best of Luck wished you Ethelwashere1

That's a horrible situation to be in Ethel, no wonder you are stressed. You really do have to say 'no' to some of your mother's demands. I realise that will not be easy after all this time so try one small thing at a time then move on to the next thing. Alternatively Lathyrus's advice was good to get someone else to step in for a while.
Good luck.

It's affecting your mental health, which in turn affects your physical health. This is your life too.

Your Mother has choices and so do you.

She can choose to pay a carer, a cleaner or she can choose to live in a dirty home. She cannot make you her slave without your say so. I do think they do forget we are getting older and going through things too.

If you were in this relationship with someone who wasn't your mother, what would it be called? (Forced housework, unreasonable demands....trouble making, manipulation etc)

Just because you're related does not mean you have to take this. Talk to her social worker. Your back has gone, your mental health failed. List your problems and why you cannot continue to care for her as you have been. She will then be assessed and have a care package put in place. Surely at the very least you must be eligible for Respite care.

Some people just get worse with age, maybe she was always appalling, only you can know that. I'd pop in on her merely to make sure she has what she needs to keep her alive, tidy up a bit when she pipes up drown her out with the hoover if you feel up to it, but tell her clearly you aren't her skivvy so if she wants other stuff done then she'll have to pay someone. Tell her you will be shopping online for her food you simply don't have time to faff around for the best possible price on everything "tough! start getting used to it now!" once she starts with other unreasonable demands I'd just walk out, keep doing it so maybe she'll eventually make the connection between you not being there and her vitriolic tongue, you say you already tell her to "shut up" when she starts to cry as you walk out, I think I'd just add "I'm going now because you're a horrible manipulative old woman and you don't deserve me, think on that" then depart, as you say you have your own home, albeit a couple of doors down, but really you don't have to put up with that!

Please don't be so meek, she's a bully, a new year a new start, stand up to her, capitulating to her demands won't get you any Brownie points and honestly do you care what she thinks? Good luck

Ethel, I am so sorry to hear about your situation. I fear that you will find it hard to be strong yourself, so I think that Lathyrus's advice is the way to go. Is there anyone who could be your intermediary, as sadly, you have suspected covid/ flu/ bubonic plague so have been told to stay away from anyone elderly or vulnerable for a few weeks. This problem may be a recurring disorder requiring a ( less helpful) friend to step in more than once. Hopefully, this will break the cycle. Good luck - everyone here on GN is rooting for you.

Yes Ethel don’t stay when the abuse starts, you don’t need to listen to any of it. I’ve walked out a couple of times recently when mum said me and DH were lazy !
I still work part time look after dgc in the holidays as well as visiting twice a week , doing Mums shopping, managing her bank account, bills appointments etc etc and you’ll know it doesn’t sound much, but it is actually a massive mental load.
Besides the fact that I’m on call 24/7 in case she falls or is ill
If she is sound of mind like my mum then it is their decision to live alone, and be very lonely like my mum. You don’t have to be responsible for her.
Next time she is in hospital. Do not let them discharge her without a proper care package, speak with her social worker and tell them your only available to food shop for her.
You can go online to adult social services and organize an assessment for her. Tell her they just want to see how she’s coping, I tell lots of fibs these days, it’s kinder.
Just another thing as someone else suggested could you move house ? We did twelve years ago best thing we ever did.

You could be talking about my mother Ethel although she wasn’t quite as bad as yours.
My delight when my H got a new job 60 miles away was unbelievable although we did visit for the weekend about every3/4 weeks but made bearable by the fact that after Sunday lunch we were in the car and on the way home again for another break.
We had to fetch her for all major holidays until she was in her 90’s and she spoiled every Christmas for my H and I, and I had to work very hard to stop her doing the same for our C.
I never learned to stand up to her, my conscience would not as I would have suffered such remorse.
I was an only child.
I know I have not helped but I just wanted you to know I have every sympathy and know just how you feel.
I am 85 now and the effects are still with me.

I feel for you, has your mother always been like this? It sounds as though she feels out of control of her own life so is trying to dominate and control yours. It is totally unreasonable to expect you to be changing curtains for Christmas and washing bath mats on Christmas Day!
Explain to her that you are happy to help out when you can but you can’t keep this up and she needs to arrange for carers and/or a cleaner to come in regularly. Once this has been sorted take a step back and start as you mean to go on.
I can sympathise as my own mother (late 80’s) has become more and more demanding. She is very stubborn and was reluctant to accept outside help but we made it clear that things couldn’t carry on and she reluctantly agreed. It took a while to get things in place but it has made such a difference. Carers pop in twice a day and she has a lovely cleaner once a week who she has grown very fond of. Visits to her are now much more pleasant.
You can’t allow this to go on, it will eventually make you ill, they forget we are also getting older and have our own health issues, grandchildren to look after etc. Sit down with her and tell her in the kindest possible way that you cant’t carry on doing so much and tell her what NEEDS to happen. Good luck.

I’m so sorry, it must be so hard for you. Honestly, these tyrannical, selfish old people who expect their children to slave for them…🤬

If she can afford to pay for help, then she really ought to do so - of course she won’t like it but needs must.
As for nasty remarks, I’d just tell her that if she can’t be pleasant, I’m going home - and 100% mean it!! Every time!

That worked with my mother even though she had dementia - she would say really horrible things, but evidently knew I meant it when I said I’d go home if she didn’t stop.

I do hope things improve for you, and for your poor friend. 💐

Ethel You have one thing on your side. Your mother doesn't live with you, so when she gets difficult, do not stop to argue or defend yourself, just get up and walk out saying. 'I am not going to let you talk to me like that' 'No, I cannot do that' ',You will have to organise that for yourself, then leave the room before she responds.

Im sorry.

I had a similar situation with my Mother, but she lives hundreds of miles away and I don't have POA. One of my siblings lives near her and needs to develop better boundaries to safeguard their family life and kids from this nightmare. Last year I set up care for DM after staying to care for her, it was a very reasonable package of three half hour slots a day. It would have taken care of all her needs. She appeared to accept this, but when I got home I had a message from the care agency to say she cancelled the care by telling them she was leaving the area!

She has extensive savings and several pensions, but does not want to pay for her own care. I am still very upset by her actions, but have decided to respect her choices. My sibling says she is entitled to make a bad choice as she has mental capacity to weigh up the consequences.

So sorry, but I think you need to step back, for your own wellbeing. My mother also plays "divide and conquer" and its very toxic.