Lying

I'm with Jeni on this one!

whenim64 is right - you can affirm to tell the truth - people in court whether jurors or witnesses do it all the time. Difficult question - would you lie for a good friend or a member of your family. When the little boy Rees was shot by a teenager in Liverpool a few years ago - the mother of the witness lied to the police to give her son an alibi. She may well have thought she was being loyal to her son, but he killed a child for no reason at all, if my child did that I'd turn him into the police - for his own sake as well as the child's family sake. But - until you are faced with the situation what would you do? If there was capital punishment here would you lie to save your child?

I am still 'on the fence' about this. But I don't think I could commit perjury.

No moral dilemma for me - I would lie in court to save a friend's life.

If the friend had committed some heinous crime such as murder I'd square it with my conscience somehow!

I wish I could be as sure of how I would react as some of you are. I really hate lying so my first instinct was to say that I would not do so under any circumstances. Now I am not quite so sure and think I could only answer this if I was in the situation.

When I find out/suspect that someone is lying I react very strongly as I do with any form of cheating or duplicity. It has been said that I am naive and that may well be true but I have to look at myself in the mirror and my self respect is important to me.

I had to take an oath, or affirmation, when I changed my name by deed poll and also, I think, when I signed the Official Secrets Act.

Q: How do you apply for probate or letters of administration?
The application is in the form of an oath that the executors or administrators (as the case may be) need to "swear" before a Solicitor not from the firm who prepared the oath. This means that you swear on the Bible that the contents of the oath are true, although if you do not wish to use the Bible you may affirm instead. The reason it is done this way is that if you swear the oath knowing the contents are incorrect then it is perjury. Once sworn the oath sent to the Probate Registry along with the original Will which is then retained by the Probate Registry. Once probate has been granted the Will becomes a matter of public record. Unless there has been any objection to the application lodged at the Probate Registry, the application generally takes around 2 weeks

absent You are probably right and it must have been the the Power of Attorney. At the time I didnt know if I was on my arse or my elbow.

It was a dreadful time with my father dying in one hospital and my mum in another 12 miles away, having lost the plot completely. They died with two months of each other in 2002.

That's interesting Nelliemoser, I've never had to affirm anything as an executor of a will.

I gave evidence at the inquest into my father's death. This was in an Irish court where I declined to swear on the bible but gave an affirmation as follows:

“I, do solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that the evidence that I shall give shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth”.

I think I would, in any circumstance, find it very difficult to make such an affirmation and then immediately break it.

OK, thanks. So however one makes the promise to tell the truth, if one is found to have lied, one is in contempt of court. Nice and straightforward.

Bags That is when you make an affirmation instead of swearing on the bible or whatever. I had to make such a declaration as executor of my mothers will (That I would carry out my executor duties according to her wishes etc.)

There was a choice of swearing before God or as I think its called a solemn affirmation. A serious undertaking.

Atheists swear an oath to tell the truth bags

Thanks, smollie. In that case, or if supoenaed (sp?), I think I would feel obliged to try and only use the evidence that was being presented in court as, I believe, jurors are supposed to do. A properly run case should, surely, have all the evidence. Yeah, I know things go wrong sometimes.

But we don't have the death penalty in this country, so the situation wouldn't arise here.

If I was utterly convinced of my friends' innocence, the right thing to do in my view, even if subpoenaed, would be to keep schtum and go to prison for it.

I don't think I could lie deliberately in court, but I might if I thought the police were lying (has been known).

BTW, what do atheists swear on? Is it necessary to swear on anything? If you promise to tell the truth, you've promised.

But to answer the question sensibly you would have to go into scrolls and scrolls of whys and wherefores.

The death penalty no longer exists in Britain - it was abolished for piracy on the seas and high treason many years after it was abolished for murder.
I would never swear an oath, anyway, as I am an atheist. As I am totally opposed to the judicial murder, I would probably lie in any country where it still existed.

Bags I believe but not 100pc sure that if you get a subpoena you have to answer or be in contempt of court which carries a prison sentence,this was the case during our high court case,where a teacher refused to get involved...she was made to by the judge.
I don't know about other countries.

To be at the point that the death penalty is the only punishment possible in this country,means that crime has to be murder.
If that murder was self defence,I would favour my friend and exaggerate any knowledge .
If that murder my friend was the instigator for other reasons then No I would not lie.
When knowing I would exaggerate in my friends defence,I would affirm,not swear on the bible.
If my friend was in a country where the death penalty is for lesser reasons such as smuggling drugs,I would lie,but as absent says finish the friendship,
a) they should be aware enough of smuggling by be asked by strangers to take packages for them.
B) If it was not accidental then it was deliberate,I wouldn't lie for them.

If it was my child as grace has said I would die for them....but would I lie for them much harder to answer that question.

British Law doesn't have the American equivalent of the 5th Amendment, does it?
As I understand it, if a witness in an American court chooses to use that, it protects them from incriminating themselves.
Not really sure if I have that right - off to check it out.

Bags Difficult if you are summonsed as a witness for the prosecution.

What's the position with remaining silent in such cases?

It's not a question of being sensible; it's about a hypothetical moral dilemma but the answers we give could tell us a lot about ourselves - and I haven't got round to answering it yet.

Does every question have to be sensible? I think that would be rather boring.. and far too sensible, and I am far from that.. thank goodness!

Helshea if you want a straight answer. I feel it would be morally very wrong to make any such decision without a full consideration of the circumstances.

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