"Modern mums have lost the plot"

trisher - thank you so much for your post. No more need be said - this is 2016 isn't it.

Can't believe anyone is discussing why women work. No questions about why men work. Didn't we move past this years ago? Family incomes vary, some women earn more than men some less. Some women are highly trained and at the top of their profession. Would we say they are working to keep up a certain standard of living? Would we say that the father's salary was to keep up a certain standard of living? It's irrelevant.

marmark1, I think some women might work for the luxuries in life, but the young mums I know do so mainly to pay the mortgagee. Most of them would love to spend more time at home with their children but unless they are prepared to move into a much cheaper area far away from family and friends, they have no choice. Even the tiniest houses round here cannot be bought with just one salary unless it is way above the average (and I don't live in London).

Maybe we have brought our children up to have high expectations. It must be difficult to suddenly have to cut back on all the stuff you are used to once you have responsibilities.

When I got married, I had very little anyway so I could only see the positive.

I don't agree that most women work to pay the mortgage,some do,but mostly it's to keep up a certain standard that we(or most of us) didn't think about.Holidays and all the modern technology two cars etc ,

Re advice, a friend of mine had been a midwife and health visitor for 10 years before having her first baby. She said, 'In the first month with him I did EVERYTHING I was telling other mothers NOT to do for the last ten years.'

I'm another who was sternly told that I MUSt put my baby to sleep on her tummy - any other way was fraught with danger. Roll on ten years or so, and they are saying the complete opposite. I don't take too much notice of so called experts these days - they change their minds so often. Eggs are another ditto.

I agree about the heavy, complicated buggies, I too bought a simple McLaren for my own one day a week baby care, since I couldn't stand the cumbersome great thing dd had. (Though at least she hadn't paid silly money for it - it was a cast off from a friend) But guess what - she doesn't use anything else now.

I think it's hard for new mothers nowadays - harder than it was a few decades ago. There is so much stern advice, don't eat or drink this or that, don't do this or that, you must do this or that - and there is so much equipment they are told they must have - far more than we ever had. And of course the need for so many to go back to work before they really want to, not to mention horrendous nursery fees - because they need two salaries to pay the mortgage on a house so many of their parents could have afforded on one, even if it was a tight financial squeeze for a while.

Not all i am sure, but many children these days are placed right at the centre of the family which revolves entirely for their needs and wants, making them feel very important indeed. This to the extent of allowing unacceptable behaviour outside, in restaurants and so on with little understanding by parents of how this affects others enjoyment.
I dont know when this changed. previously, though children were an important part of the family but not central to it and they fitted in with family life and knew how to behave when out.
It will be a surprise when they grow and find that the world does not revolve around them. not their fault of course, but a hard lesson nonetheless.
i have learned that whatever suggestion/ advice/little pearl of wisdom i was tempted to pass on was neither appreciated nor apparently gratefully accepted (and ignored) so now I keep my own counsel.. i know my place.!!
Each generation have certainly made the same complaint and no doubt when these young families grow and their children have children this same conversation will ensue. Tis life.

When we had our DC the received wisdom at the time was to put the baby face down, but that seemed wrong to me and baby got too hot ( perhaps an element in cot deaths) so I always put them on their backs.Their head could turn each way, so looked more comfortable. Shortly after that the Back To Sleep campaign was started, so it was the correct thing to do after all.

I prefer him to do this ( when with us) than watch tv, but we still do cutting and sticking, drawing etc as well.

Not sure I agree about the iPad, our little 3 year old DGS enjoys the BBC games on them, and learns at the same time, about shapes and numbers.It's just another tool after all.

I feel sorry for parents these days. All this business with smart phones and the internet and pornographic photos being sent around. Of course this doesn't affect babies but I hate to see 2 yearolds with an Ipad. I think that you should keep to development as nature intended it for as long as possible.

My last baby refused to sleep on her back. She liked to sleep upright in a sling round her father's shoulders. Prams and beds and chairs are not natural after all.
What mothers have to do today is what we did and our mothers did. We did our best for our children. Mothers are not perfect.

My DS and DIL are much stricter than I was, and my friend's daughter has already told her that she won't be as 'soft as you were' when she has children. So not all children are spoilt nowadays. (I don't think mine were spoilt just raised with what has been described as 'benevolent neglect'!)

Just popping back to give a bit of support to those who don't feel young mothers have lost the plot and are raising children who are being spoilt

Honestly, give them a break. We did our best and that's what this generation is doing. My parents used to talk about being lucky because neither of them had been hit with the straps / belts that most fathers hung on the back door when they were growing up. Dad often laughed about one of their neighbours who'd shout at her little lad "get here while I hit yer" - of course the child ran the other way. There have always been poor parents, selfish people etc but most of do love our children and stagger on, doing the best we can.

Refreshingly honest, Caroline123.

Yes, a FEW, of course, but now there seem to be a great deal about the place.

roses, there have always been spoilt children. I knew a few when I was a child myself.

Not so sure about turning out 'quite normal ' though annodomini more like turning out quite spoilt in a lot of cases.

When I had my dd the advice was to lay the baby on its front which is what I did.she was born in high summer and when I took her out in the pram an old lady said 'are you cooking her for your dinner?'she was so hot,I'd swaddled her and covered her in blankets!iI used a sling when I went on the bus, have you ever tried having a 6 month old in a sling and 5 bags of shopping and more than a mile to walk home?even on the bus it was no fun.
I remember so much opposing advice, I didn't know what to do to be right.
Thankfully she survived but that was in spite of all my mistakes.

That is my fear Elegran. He has been able to get away with everything, but Mum won't have time when no 2 comes along. At least he is in Nursery 4 days a week currently, so he has some routine, it just all goes pear shaped at the weekend.

Well said Bluecat

I have a feeling the ever since homo sapiens came out of the African forests, each generation has had its own opinions on child rearing, the big difference being the great diversity of choice available. Young mums have no more lost the plot than we did. The children will turn out quite normal, just as they did, just as we did.

I have 5 grandchildren, two currently babies. The first thing I insisted on when looking after them was a sensible, lightweight buggy. We live on a hill, ok going downwards but...... I need to stop off for a coffee to give me the energy to get back uphill and can't be doing with negotiating those huge (eyewateringly heavy) things they all have these days. Systems I think they are called. However did I manage with my own two? One was aged 13 months when the other came along. Two McLarren buggies fastened together. I used to get on a bus to Brent Cross shopping centre with the babies and thought nothing of it.
A thousand pounds for a 'system ' indeed. They go everywhere in cars anyway. My little ones love being pushed to the park, it's quite unusual for them.

Bothiegran the fact that your daughter-in-law has lost the plot doesn't mean it is a universal fact to be applied to all modern mums

One of the most sensible posts on here Bluecat, particularly your last paragraph.

My dd had her first (and probably only) child at 40 after several years of gynae problems which had us all convinced she would never have children. She was overjoyed at this minor 'miracle' but became quickly anxious as our granddaughter has a dairy allergy which meant she constantly threw up formula and was frequently distressed, until the allergy was diagnosed. Then the fun really started with a trial and error regime of what could be eaten safely. All the child -rearing books my dd eagerly bought when pregnant, were thrown out the window. Also because of the danger of choking on her vomit, my dd dare not leave her in her own very pretty little Peppa Pig bedroom but took her into her own bed where, 2 years later despite many attempts to reverse this, our granddaughter still sleeps. Dgd is constantly ill with a cycle of virus, infection, anti-biotic, won't eat, won't sleep so is ill again. As grandparents we think our granddaughter is delightful, intelligent and beautiful and yes, a lovable tin god'ess'. As parents we are worried about our dd. Sorry for long post but any advice or experience on how I can effectively support dd (words just don't seem enough and we live a fair distance away), or on building up children with allergies, would be gratefully received.