Displaying emotions

Im not a fan of celebrities but they are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Adele was photographed by a bystander she didn't go there with cameras. If they publicly give money, they are cashing in on opportunity and if they don't they are mean and selfish. None of us knew how much George Michael gave away of his money until after he died. What I can't stand is when they think their voice should be heard above all others

A cover-up is impossible, too many people knew the inhabitants of the tower, they weren't living in segregation.

Conspiracy theories are well-loved, but not always based on reality.

I find the certainty of some posters on this thread (and others) unsettling. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but please remember that is what they are. Not facts.

It has been obvious for days that some victims will have been reduced to ashes. That's why the police have said since the early reports it may never be possible to identify all the victims.

The recovery of the remains of many victims will need careful inspection by a forensic science specialist.

Getting it right has to be the priority.

I haven't seen any demands for public demonstrations of emotions.

And to those of you who have used George Michael as a good example of a celeb doing good deeds anonymously, if people act anonymously how do you know others are not doing the same - even though we have seen them in the last week?

Can't we just accept that we're all different and nobody is right or wrong?

But in most disasters- e.g the Twin Towers the media tend to exaggerate the numbers- 14000 was given as a possibility then. The media have remained remarkably subdued about the whole thing and only people in the area seem to be saying how high the numbers may be.. And for the last time I am not suggesting a cover up simply a manipulation of information. The numbers will come out, but how and when is another question. Did no one see how angry the residents were the next day? You don't want people behaving like that in Kensington do you?

"Can't we just accept that we're all different and nobody is right or wrong?" That seems to be difficult to universally accept. There is a lot of "I would do it this way, so I shall lay guilt on those who don't" about.

Nick Paget-Brown agrees with you, Elegran. Far too much emotion from people involved.

skwawkbox.org/2017/06/19/video-rbkc-chief-claims-volunteer-efforts-to-vindicate-council-grenfell/

Trisher you are right about the twin towers. It was estimated between 14000 and 19000 people were in the building at the time of the attacks - a large margin of possibility in itself. Yet reports quoted as high as 100,000. In the end just under 3000 people died, including the terrorists. That's a tragic number, but it does highlight the need for accuracy for anyone with a personal interest.

Elegran if we were discussing something that is factually based, I might think differently, but all this thread does is show just how broad the band if touchy feely-ness (sp?) is.

if=of

As far as politicians are concerned, they are just after more votes especially as the other side have been blaming the government even though the council concerned in the fire area is under Labour control. I certainly wouldn't want Jeremy hugging me but it would nice to see the Queen felt she should pay a visit. Mr Corbyn thinks that rich people should give up their homes to rehouse victims but I haven't see any reporting of Labour councillors, politicians or Labour voting luvvies offering space in theirs!

That's not true quizqueen. The properties Jeremy Corbyn is talking about are unoccupied properties bought as investments by people who live abroad. These properties are empty all year round. There is a difference.

I shouldn't use your political knowledge in a quiz, quizqueen.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/19/kensington-chelsea-council-has-274m-in-reserves-grenfell-tower-budget-surplus

"The Conservative council responsible for the tower block where at least 79 people died in a fire described by the mayor of London as preventable has stockpiled £274m of reserves and offered rebates to residents paying the top rate of council tax.

According to the latest accounts, the Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea ran a budget surplus, which Labour councillors have claimed was being used as a slush fund to bribe voters with a rebate close to elections.

A draft statement of Kensington and Chelsea’s accounts for 2016-17 disclosed that the council has an “AA” credit rating and a financial standing described as robust, with “usable reserves at 31 March 2017 of £274m (£300m at 31 March 2016)”."

Yes, there's a difference in that the properties you're talking about, Wilma, are actually owned by someone, whether they live abroad or not. I agree that it's scandalous that there are so many empty, but they can't just be taken over.

We seem to suffer from emotional incontinence these days. I think the Queen got it absolutely right. I feel sorry for Theresa May as I don't for a minute think she's cold or uncaring , just more reserved than people like or understand. Were all different in the way we deals with things and no one has a monopoly on caring. I detest the mindless pampered celebs who need to get in on the act and try to make grief political

Quizqueen But she did! "^. . . . it would nice to see the Queen felt she should pay a visit.^" did you mean "was" not "would"?

Using the kind of legislation enacted in the WW11 you could.

That said, I am not in favour of this. I would rather change the law that around someone abroad buying property in the UK to discourage the practice.

My reply was a Ana.

to Ana (sorry, I blame the heat!)

In the meantime, Wilma, homes are needed now for the 200+ families who have lost theirs.
What should we do now?

Definitely seems like a Tory council to me, quizqueen.

"Opposition councillors are angry at the way council leaders appeared to freeze when confronted by a disaster on the scale of the fire. They said they were kept in the dark and repeatedly given incorrect assurances that accommodation had been found for residents. The Conservative-led administration had failed to return calls from neighbouring councils offering to provide accommodation and other help, the councillors said.

Other criticisms include a failure to communicate with survivors and their families; a lack of visible staff on the ground providing advice; a failure to distribute any of the money being donated; and a failure to ensure that surviving residents were allocated suitable accommodation nearby.

The Labour leader on the council, Robert Atkinson, said the leadership had lost all credibility. “They have lost control,” he said. “They seem mesmerised by the gravity of the situation.”

Atkinson called on Paget-Brown, his deputy and senior officials to stand down, saying they had “collapsed on the job”. “There must have come a point on Wednesday or Thursday when they realised they were out of their depth,” he said."

I do agree we can be too touchy-feely nowadays towards people we don't know personally, and this attitude started when Diana died. I don't think May should be hugging people and crying in public. She obviously has emotions but is controlled which is surely what we need in the leader of the country who has an enormous job to do, dealing with the aftermath of the fire, the terrorists attacks and Brexit in addition to her normal work. She probably should have spoken to the survivors when she visited but that's not a major sin.

The survivors thought it was.

dj I don't know why you would ask me that question, but since you did then my solution would be to build temporary modular houses on the green or brown land in the area around Grenfell Tower. This would make good use of the £300 million reserves held by K&C.

Really? I would have thought they had other things to worry about.

My reply was to dj

I agree with wilma